djcubez
  • djcubez
  • Senior Member Topic Starter
14 years ago
I decided to compile margin of victory stats for 7 different teams (Steelers, Patriots, Colts and the whole NFC North) over the past 5 years because of something NonStopDrivel said. I can't remember exactly what it was though.

A Few Notes
I used margins of 0-4, 5-7 and 8+ points. In hindsight 0-3, 4-7 and 8+ may have been better but I'm not doing this all again ;)

I tried to pick teams that have had both consistency at the head coaching position and had fielded great teams in recent history. I then picked the NFC North to get a more robust sample base so we're not just comparing McCarthy to "elite" coaches.

I did not include any playoff games.


				== Steelers ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	10-4 	Tomlin		 3	 3	4	| 1	 1	2	
2009	9-7	Tomlin		 3	 1	5	| 5	 2	0
2008	12-4	Tomlin	 	 3	 2	6	| 1	 1	2	
2007	10-6	Tomlin	 	 2	 0	8	| 2	 3	1
2006	8-8	Cowher		 1	 2	5	| 1	 1	6
===============================================================================
Tomlin Total:			 8	 6	23	| 9	 7	5
Cowher Total:			 1	 2 	5 	| 2	 3 	1
Overall Total:			 9	 8	28	| 11	 10	6


				== Colts ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	8-6	Caldwell	 2	 1	5	| 4	 0	2
2009	14-2	Caldwell	 7 	 0	7	| 0	 0	2
2008	12-4	Dungy		 6	 2	4	| 1	 0	3
2007	13-3	Dungy		 3	 2 	8	| 2	 1	0
2006	12-4	Dungy		 4	 4	4	| 3	 1	1
===============================================================================
Caldwell Total:			 9	 1	12	| 4	 0	4
Dungy Total:			 13	 8	16	| 6	 2	1
Overall Total:			 22	 9	28	| 10	 2	5


				== Patriots ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	12-2	Belichick	 4	 0	8	| 0	 0	2
2009	10-6	Belichick	 1	 2	7	| 3	 2	1
2008	11-5	Belichick	 1	 2	8	| 2	 0	3
2007	16-0	Belichick	 4	 0	12	| 0	 0	0
2006	12-4	Belichick	 3	 2	7	| 1	 1	2
===============================================================================
Belichick Total:		 13	 6	42	| 6	 3	8


				== Bears ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	10-4	Smith		 3	 3	4	| 2	 0	2
2009	7-9	Smith		 1	 2	4	| 2	 3	4
2008	9-7	Smith		 4	 1	4	| 3	 2	2
2007	7-9	Smith		 2	 1	4	| 1	 3	5
2006	13-3	Smith		 3	 1	9	| 1	 0	2
===============================================================================
Smith Total:			 13	 8	23	| 9	 8	15


				== Lions ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	4-10	Schwartz	 2	 0	2	| 5	 1	4
2009	2-14	Schwartz	 1	 1	0	| 0	 2	12
2008	0-16	Marinelli	 0	 0	0 	| 3	 1	12
2007 	7-9	Marinelli	 1	 2	4	| 1	 1	7
2006	3-13	Marinelli	 1	 0	2	| 1	 7	5
===============================================================================
Schwartz Total:			 3	 1	2	| 5	 3	16
Marinelli Total:		 2	 2	6	| 6	 9	24
Overall Total:			 5	 3	8	| 11	 12	40


				== Vikings ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	5-9	Childress*	 3	 0	2	| 2	 1	6
2009	12-4	Childress	 2	 1	9	| 0	 1	3
2008	10-6	Childress	 5	 1	4	| 1	 4	1
2007	8-8	Childress	 1	 3	4	| 3	 2	3
2006	6-10	Childress	 2	 1	3	| 3	 3	4
===============================================================================
Childress Total:		 13	 6	22	| 9	 11	17

* Childress got fired during the season and Leslie Frazier took over as interim 

coach. I still gave Childress credit for the games Frazier coached.

And of course McCarthy and the Packers.


				== Packers ==
Year	Record	Coach			Wins		|	Losses
===============================================================================
				0-4	5-7	8+	|0-4	5-7	8+
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010	8-6	McCarthy	 2	 1	5	| 6	 0	0
2009	11-5	McCarthy	 0	 3	8	| 1	 2	2	
2008	6-10	McCarthy	 0	 1	5	| 7	 0	3	
2007	13-3	McCarthy	 2	 2	9	| 0	 1	2
2006	8-8	McCarthy	 1	 2	5	| 1	 1	6
===============================================================================
McCarthy Total:			 5	 9	32	| 15	 4	12

Reaction
Obviously these are raw stats that negate any situational or conditional aspects of the game (missed FG's, injuries, weather, etc) so you can't draw any definite conclusions. Yet it's apparent that McCarthy's teams have not fared well in close games. Here are the records for coaches in games decided by 4 points or less: McCarthy (5-15), Tomlin (8-9), Dungy (13-6), Caldwell (9-4), Bellchick (13-6), Lovie Smith (13-9), Childress (13-9), Schwartz (3-5), Marinelli (2-6). Of all the coaches I checked McCarthy has the worst winning percentage in games decided by 4 points or less.

When you bump it up to games decided by a TD (7 points) or less McCarthy fares a bit better: McCarthy (14-19), Childress (19-20), Schwartz (4-8), Marinelli (4-15), Smith (21-17), Belichick(19-9), Caldwell (10-4), Dungy (21-8), Tomlin (14-16).

However what's interesting are the records for games decided by 8 points or more: Tomlin (23-5), Caldwell (12-4), Dungy (16-1), Belichick (42-8), Smith (23-15), Schwartz (2-16), Marinelli (6-24), Childress (22-17), McCarthy (32-12).

Now here's what's interesting. Let's lose the 2006 8-8 season for a moment. Of the 12 times that McCarthy's teams have been beaten by 8 or more points 6 came in the 8-8 2006 season. That means that over the past 4 years McCarthy has only lost 6 games by 8 or more points and 3 by 5-7 points. 14 of the Packers 23 losses in the past four years have been decided by 0-4 points. For comparison: McCarthy (14/23), Childress (6/27), Smith (8/29), Belichick (5/13), Tomlin (9/21), Dungy (6/13) Caldwell (4/8).

From a year-to-year standpoint McCarthy's teams are improving by playing more close games and blowing out more opponents. It seems that McCarthy is really close to the "elite" level of coaching but he has to make the leap from "good" or as some around here would like to say "mediocre." Here's to hoping he can figure it out and get us there!

Like I said before these are only stats and can never explain the whole story. Take from this what you will.
Zero2Cool
14 years ago
Incredible!
UserPostedImage
Felipe7777777
14 years ago
Nice freakin idea and data collecting, bravo, real interesting too, thanks!
blank
mi_keys
14 years ago
+1 for the work, I always appreciate it when someone digs up as many statistics as you have to give us another viewpoint to look at what has happened.
Born and bred a cheesehead
Greg C.
14 years ago
Interesting stuff, and I agree with your conclusion that McCarthy falls short of being an "elite" coach. This is kind of a good companion piece to the article that somebody linked a few weeks ago, which demonstrated that Aaron Rodgers' lack of comeback wins is not really his fault. The problem seems to be a broader one with McCarthy's teams. Collectively, it seems like they just don't have the starch to win their share of close games.

The question is whether this means McCarthy is not the right guy to lead the Packers to a championship. I think he's shown a lot more good than bad in his time here, and he has almost certainly earned at least another year.
blank
millertime
14 years ago
+1. Thanks for this. Nice to have some data to support what we all know, the Pack will either blow a team out or lose by a FG.
14 years ago
Don't you just hate it on a message board when some guy lips off and you wind up doing all the resarch. You and some otthers can learn a few things but thee will always be somebody saying something without the facts.

The funny thing this season is the Packers had been leading in net points for many weeks but now dropped to 3rd (1st in NFC) and in net TD's they are second to Patriots.
blank
Fan Shout
dfosterf (14-Jun) : TWO magnificent strikes for touchdowns. Lose the pennstate semigeezer non nfl backup
dfosterf (14-Jun) : There was minicamp Thursday. My man Taylor Engersma threw
dfosterf (11-Jun) : There will be a mini camp practice Thursday.
Zero2Cool (11-Jun) : He's been sporting a ring for a while now. It's probably Madonna.
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : We only do the tea before whoopee, it relaxes me.
wpr (10-Jun) : That's awesome Martha.
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : How's the ayahuasca tea he makes, Martha?
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : Turns out he like older women
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : I wasn't supposed to say anything, but yes the word is out and we are happy 😂😂😂
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : I might be late on this but Aaron Rodgers is now married
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : Well he can always ask his brother for pointers
Zero2Cool (10-Jun) : Bo Melton taking some reps at CB as well as WR
Zero2Cool (10-Jun) : key transactions coming today at 3pm that will consume more cap in 2025
Zero2Cool (9-Jun) : Jaire played in just 34 of a possible 68 games since the start of the 2021 season
Zero2Cool (9-Jun) : reported, but not expected to practice
Zero2Cool (9-Jun) : Jenkins has REPORTED for mandatory camp
Zero2Cool (9-Jun) : I really thought he'd play for Packers.
buckeyepackfan (9-Jun) : Packers releasing Jaire Alexander.
Mucky Tundra (8-Jun) : (Context: he wants his defense to create turnovers)
Mucky Tundra (8-Jun) : Giants DC Shane Bowen tells players to “be a damn pirate."
dfosterf (6-Jun) : Semper fi !
Cheesey (6-Jun) : This is why I have so much respect for those that have gone through battles
Cheesey (6-Jun) : I can't even imagine what that would have been like
wpr (6-Jun) : "Come on, you sons of bitches. Do you want to live forever?"
wpr (6-Jun) : Facing a line of machine guns 2 time medal of Honor recipient, First Sergeant Dan Daly told his men,
wpr (6-Jun) : Another detachment went into the Belleau Wood.
wpr (6-Jun) : On the 6th the Marines took Hill 142 but suffered terrible losses.
wpr (6-Jun) : It’s time to remember dfoster’s Marine brothers in Belleau Wood. The battle went on from June 1-26. Nearly 10,000 casualties.
packerfanoutwest (6-Jun) : Nick Collins and Morgan Burnett have signed with the PACK
packerfanoutwest (6-Jun) : he won't be wearing #12, maybe he will wear number two
packerfanoutwest (6-Jun) : He will fail this season, should have retired
Mucky Tundra (5-Jun) : Thus the cycle of Hall of Fame Packer QBs going to the Jets and then the Vikings is broken
bboystyle (5-Jun) : Rodgers to steelers on 1 year contract
Zero2Cool (5-Jun) : It's the cycle of civilizations. Get lazier, lazier, softer, softer and vanish.
Martha Careful (5-Jun) : great point. every aspect of society, including art, culture and sports has degraded.
dfosterf (4-Jun) : Green Bay sweep meant something to society about stopping pure excellence. We have the tush push now
dfosterf (4-Jun) : We old Martha.
Martha Careful (4-Jun) : *front four
Martha Careful (4-Jun) : Re frout four, I wish we had some Green "People Eaters" or a fearsome foursome
dfosterf (4-Jun) : *directions*
dfosterf (4-Jun) : Just don't ask him for driving direct
dfosterf (4-Jun) : Jim Marshall was an all-time great DE for the Purple People Eaters. Didn't like him. That's a compliment. RIP
Zero2Cool (3-Jun) : ooppppss
Zero2Cool (3-Jun) : “Kenny Clark played all of last season hurt by the way and got surgery to fix it in January”
Mucky Tundra (3-Jun) : @ByRyanWood How much did the injury affect him last fall? “A lot.”
Mucky Tundra (3-Jun) : @ByRyanWood Kenny Clark said he had foot surgery in January. Injured his foot in opener against Eagles and played through it all year.
Zero2Cool (3-Jun) : Golden is wearing guardian cap again. I bet he plays with it on too.
Mucky Tundra (3-Jun) : All the stuff I'm reading from Lions fans are pointing at his toe; he more or less has permanent turf toe in one of his big toes
dfosterf (3-Jun) : Kenny played through it, and a shame he gets little credit for that, imo
dfosterf (3-Jun) : Big men. I hope it's not the undoing of Kenny Clark
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
16-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

15-Jun / Random Babble / Martha Careful

14-Jun / Around The NFL / beast

14-Jun / Community Welcome! / dfosterf

13-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

13-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Adam

12-Jun / Random Babble / Martha Careful

12-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

12-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

12-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

11-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

10-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

10-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

7-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

6-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.