Pack93z
15 years ago

Union or non union, this guys facts/story does not add up.

"all_about_da_packers" wrote:



Totally agree.

"RaiderPride" wrote:



So tell me why Mike McCarthy comments hold more truth... is there someone that witnessed this "conversation"? Is he more credible, and if so, why?

Again.. get ahead of this PR crap and save the Packers Franchise the pain of this story running wild.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
dfosterf
15 years ago
We were saying the exact same things during a certain "fiasco".

Fair has nothing to do with anything.

The national media is going to couple the handling of this little dust up with how the Packers organization handled the last one.


Game?

Forget the game. This is a better story. The undoing of a head coach due to a petty retaliation against a 22 yr employee for making a comment, which

AT PRESENT

is the employee's version of the comment.

This MORON of a head coach simply needs to tell the media (presently local, in 24 hours national) what was said.

The SMART thing to do, if there is ANY GREY AREA as to the legitimacy of this termination, is to un-terminate the man...as in say, about 15 seconds after this story hit the papers.

OR

EXPLAIN it------



FAST.


None of this is happening.

Game?

What game?

Watch...just watch. Skip Bayliss, Chris Collingsworth, Rome is burning, yada yada yada


GO INTERVIEW THE OTHER GROUNDSKEEPERS!!!!!
Zero2Cool
15 years ago
Haven't read too many more posts since page three or so. I see we are on page 7. I'm convinced that fans just like to bitch. Maybe this is a good convo, maybe its not. I just can't imagine there's nothing else to talk about for 7 pages, but the unfortunate termination of a 22 year employed maintenance person.

It's unfortunate.
We don't know the whole truth.
We can speculate all day, or 7 plus pages.
Fact is, we won't know.

Sound familiar?

I'm hoping we're being more civil in this debate than in others in the past. It's the middle of the football season and I'd rather talk Packers football, not Packers maintenance staff. I'll see if I can find other threads that are worth ones time.
UserPostedImage
nerdmann
15 years ago

lol I can't remember such drastic over reaction before. Amusing.

From what I've learned. Mike McCarthy told the supervisor he thought he heard someone say don't lay an egg.

Supervisor says we can't have that, we have to let you go.

Wood is subsequently let go.


I didn't see where it said that Mike McCarthy asked for Wood to be fired or anything like that. Let's just blast Mike McCarthy though. I'm down for that. I'm tired of him anyway!

Really though, after hearing Mike McCarthy talk about "clean it up" every week, are we surprised he may have had a hand in the "cleaning" staff? :)

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



Mike McCarthy admits that they "exchanged comments." Then he admits that he called the guy's supervisor.
When asked if he ordered the firing, he said no.
When asked if he recommended the firing, he said, "It was a one minute conversation." To me, that's a yes.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Pack93z
15 years ago
Why should one care or discuss it.. because it is becoming another black mark on the Packers organization.. and personally things like that matter to me as a fan of the franchise.

I was once a diehard Cowboy fan in my youth because I respected how Tom Laundry went about his business and the class he held himself in. When Jerry Jones bought the franchise and basically threw Laundry out the door with little thought.. my passion turned from a fan of the franchise to despising the hell out of Jerry Jones. I was a teenager at the time.. and after all these years I still hold the same opinion and dislike for Jones. He just has added to it over the years.

So to answer the question of why discuss it for seven pages, because to some of us, these types of matters matter.

I am personally sick of watching my beloved franchise chastised in the press.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
dfosterf
15 years ago

Haven't read too many more posts since page three or so. I see we are on page 7. I'm convinced that fans just like to bitch. Maybe this is a good convo, maybe its not. I just can't imagine there's nothing else to talk about for 7 pages, but the unfortunate termination of a 22 year employed maintenance person.

It's unfortunate.
We don't know the whole truth.
We can speculate all day, or 7 plus pages.
Fact is, we won't know.

Sound familiar?

I'm hoping we're being more civil in this debate than in others in the past. It's the middle of the football season and I'd rather talk Packers football, not Packers maintenance staff. I'll see if I can find other threads that are worth ones time.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:




You can view this as your fellow members just looking for something to bitch about.

Here is what I am seeing.

I just went through all of the "biggies" web-site-wise, regarding the NFL. This story is on the front page of every single one.

The theme?

Employee said something. He got fired. Head coach will not say what was said to get him fired.


I will repeat. This IS ridiculous. The WHY it is ridiculous is the most ridiculous part of the story.

The "not telling the reason/what was said" is going to BURN this organization, media-wise... my prediction.

Edit---

Pack93z

LOL LOL LOL Here we go AGAIN!

You and I, typing practically the same shit at the same time, becoming outraged about something in perfect synchronization, while others "pooh pooh" our collective hand-wringing. Remember the Crabtree/Raji one? lol


In a week, when McCarthy is fired and Dom leads us to a winless remainder of the season, the franchise roundly laughed at by all, FA's refusing to come here, fanbase shrivelled to nothingness (OK, a tad bit over-the-top, lol)

THEN they will see why we went the 7 pages, lol...and create the 100 in hindsight, when we saw it coming 8 hours prior to this post.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
15 years ago

I have personally seen long time employees become bitter, complaining, cancers, after 22 years on the job.

"RaiderPride" wrote:



So have I. And sometimes it has been because management has screwed up. Organizations and the quality of their culture can be fragile places. And sometimes the "great places to work" are the most fragile. Especially if those great places are also places where the management is top down in a big way.

There are two kinds of questions involved here:
1. Whether the Wood dude deserved what he got or not.
2. Whether the Packer organization is handling the Wood case correctly or not.

Part of #2 is "should they have fired him?" But only part. Part of it is managing the individual worker correctly. But part of it is managing the organization correctly. And if you're going to manage in a hierarchical way, the latter means people above Wood AND people in public positions (which includes McCarthy even if he isn't in Wood's chain of command) paying attention to how they speak publicly.

If you're in a position of influence, and McCarthy is, words have consequences. Yeah, in a perfect world, we'd have better journalism and fans not getting on his case about things they shouldn't get on his case about. But we don't live in a perfect world; and Mike, if he wants to get the big bucks, needs to do better. And, more importantly, the Packer hierarchy needs to do better.

People usually don't just "become cancers" overnight. They do so for a reason. Sometimes that is because something else in their lives has gone pear-shaped, or because something in their brain (serotonin uptake or whatever). And sometimes that reason is because they've been around long enough to see the organization becoming a different kind of place to work, and because they've invested a large part of their lives and themselves in the "old place", a place that "current management" has fucked with.

IF there's just one instance of "bitterness", it's a good bet that its something outside the organization that is the problem. But if there's more than one, it's a better bet that there's something wrong internally. And each example doesn't just increase the probability that the problem is organization, it increases it at an increasing rate.

Especially when you have a organization whose identity has for a long time been built around "family" or "community" notions. All organizations talk about being those things, but some places actually are that way.

But don't stay that way. And while those "inside" know it isn't the same as it used to be, the public image as a "special place" can persist for some time.

If I might be permitted an analogy: it's easy to see how dysfunctional the Raiders organization is....now. And it's easy to see that it's been that way for awhile now. But here's a question: when did it become so?

I can't answer that question. I'm not only outside of the Raiders organization, I really don't care a whole lot about the answer enough to look at the history. But I'm pretty sure that it was dysfunctional well before anyone started to notice and at a time when people outside were still talking about it being a "special organization".

Were this the only example of a disgruntled employee, I wouldn't be worried. Were this the only example of management speak and bad public handling of a disgruntled employee, I wouldn't be worried. Heck even if it were just this and the Voldemort example, I wouldn't be particularly bothered. But it isn't just one or two isolated examples any more.

And that does trouble me.

A lot.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
all_about_da_packers
15 years ago

If you are going to belittle the opinions based upon Mike Wood's comments, then how can you take Mike McCarthy comments and be more convinced.

"pack93z" wrote:




Fair criticism, point taken.

To blame Mike McCarthy in this matter is premature; I'll concede to accepting McCarthy's words at face value is premature too.


I hope Mike McCarthy is not as deeply involved in this as the story suggests.

Totally agree that the organization should clear this matter soon.
The NFL: Where Greg Jennings Happens.
nerdmann
15 years ago

Zero,.......i was making a JOKE!!!
As in "Mike McCarthy doesn't DO anything!"
Get it now?

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



I want him to do something.
Leave.
And take the damn ZBS with him.

"Cheesey" wrote:




LOL. F'n zBS.
I think that's the main reason I favor hiring Cowher. He's the opposite of a zBS type guys. He's a smashmouth coach who likes bigger stronger guys on both sides of the LOS.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
nerdmann
15 years ago

Suppose the guy said something that was truly unacceptable, e.g. something like "Hey McCarthy, you asshole, how come you don't get on those asshole OL's for being asshole useless"? Why, after he said "all I said was this innocuous thing here", didn't they say, "he didn't say something innocuous, he was disrespectful and insubordinate"? That they didn't do this suggests to me either:

"Wade" wrote:



Yeah because entering a he said, she said thing publicly is so professional!

I don't agree with that theory as it assumes the person giving the official statement was aware of the wording used in the article.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



Two things:
1. Quoting the "corporate policy" is what PR people do. It isn't what company leaders should be doing.
2. It's part of the job description for those who "give official statements": know what the fuck is being said out there before taking an official stance.

*We* shouldn't be expected to know. The Packer admin should. Or someone (else) at 1265 is not doing their job.

"Wade" wrote:




Bring back Ari Fleischer!
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Fan Shout
beast (7h) : Sounds like no serious injuries from the Saints game and Jacobs and Watson should play in the Vikings game
packerfanoutwest (12h) : both games Watson missed, Packers won
Martha Careful (14h) : I hope all of you have a Merry Christmas!
Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Oh I know about Jacobs, I just couldn't pass up an opportunity to mimic Zero lol
buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : Jacobs was just sat down, Watson re-injured that knee that kept him out 1 game earlier
buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : I needed .14 that's. .14 points for the whole 4th quarter to win and go to the SB. Lol
Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Jacobs gonna be OK???
Zero2Cool (24-Dec) : Watson gonna be OK???
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : Inactives tonight for the Pack: Alexander- knee Bullard - ankle Williams - quad Walker -ankle Monk Heath
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : No Jaire, but hopefully the front 7 destroys the line of scrimmage & forces Rattler into a few passes to McKinney.
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : minny could be #1 seed and the Lions #5 seed
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : We'd have same Division and Conference records. Strength of schedule we edge them
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I just checked. What tie breaker?
bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes its possible but unlikely. If we do get the 5th, we face the NFCS winner
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ahh, ok.
bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes due to tie breaker
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I mean, unlikely, yes, but mathematically, 5th is possible by what I'm reading.
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : If Vikings lose out, Packers win out, Packers get 5th, right?
bboystyle (23-Dec) : Minny isnt going to lose out so 5th seed is out of the equation. We are playing for the 6th or 7th seed which makes no difference
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, the ad revenue goes to the broadcast company but they gotta pay to air the game on their channel/network
beast (23-Dec) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th
beast (23-Dec) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.
bboystyle (23-Dec) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno
beast (23-Dec) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?
packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I see what you did there Mucky
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : dammit. 3:25pm
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Upon receiving the news about Luke Musgrave, I immediately fell to the ground
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Yeah baby!
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : LUKE MUSGRAVE PLAYING TONIGHT~!~~~~WOWHOAAOHAOAA yah
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I wanna kill new QB's ... blitz the crap out of them.
beast (23-Dec) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : However, we seem to struggle vs new QB's
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.
packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : ok I stand corrected
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ok, yes, you are right. I see that now how they get 7th
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : 5th - Packers win out, Vikings lose out. Maybe?
beast (23-Dec) : Saying no to the 6th lock.
beast (23-Dec) : No, with the Commanders beating the Eagles, Packers could have a good chance of 6th or 7th unless the win out
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think if Packers win, they are locked 6th with chance for 5th.
beast (23-Dec) : But it doesn't matter, as the Packers win surely win one of their remaining games
beast (23-Dec) : This is not complex, just someone doesn't want to believe reality
beast (23-Dec) : We already have told you... if Packers lose all their games (they won't, but if they did), and Buccaneers and Falcons win all theirs
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I posted it in that Packers and 1 seed thread
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I literally just said it.
packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : show us a scenario where Pack don't get in? bet you can't
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