Whispers Packers could release number of veterans· Page 3

all_about_da_packers
Senior Member

14 years ago

Not exactly a slam on the kid, but not a ringing endorsement either. We knew out of the draft the kid was a punishing blocker who needs to brush up on his all around FB skills.

Mike McCarthy then says Quinn looks good. Good, not bad. Good. Mike McCarthy also makes an excellent point, Quinn is a thumper --- which is hard to evaluate without pads on. Hardly a slight on Quinn there.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

I think we're interpreting his comments different - which for the record is fine. I took the "he needs to line" to mean that he is in his second year and hasn't stood out yet. Mike McCarthy emphasizes so much on player progression from year 1 to year 2, so I took it as odd as McCarthy not saying "He has made a jump" as he has indicated with players like Underwood.

As for the "looking good" comment; I've realized Mike McCarthy rarely comes out and criticizes players. FFS, he said the same thing about Allen Barbre... I was sort of reading between the lines, but when you do that there is no guarantee that you get at what person's true inner thoughts all the time.

I guess my main issue is that people are seemingly thinking Johnson has one spot locked up, and the other two players will battle for the remaining one... That's not accurate at all. A simple breakdown of snaps shows that Kuhn played 247 snaps on offense, Johnson played 137, and Hall came in third at 118. Hall also missed 5-6 weeks with an injury. If anything, you'd assume based off those numbers that Hall and Johnson would be competing for the second FB spot.

But my point is that it's pretty silly to anoint Johnson as having one of the two spots locked up, and thinking it'll be up to Kuhn and Hall to compete for the other one.

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bozz_2006
Registered

14 years ago

#22

I think one thing to note is that Hall and Kuhn basically bring similar skill sets, don't they? If Johnson brings something a little different, it may very well be between Hall and Kuhn.

all_about_da_packers
Senior Member

14 years ago

#23

I think one thing to note is that Hall and Kuhn basically bring similar skill sets, don't they? If Johnson brings something a little different, it may very well be between Hall and Kuhn.

"bozz_2006" wrote:

That is a great point you make, and I'd agree with you that Hall and Kuhn bring similar skill sets.

But the thing is, in my opinion, those skill sets fit our team very nicely. Neither is going to be mistaken for all-pro blockers, but they do it pretty well. Neither will be splitting out wide as WRs, but both have shown themselves to be decent at receiving, and Rodgers has confidence in them to throw them the ball should plays break down. Put differently, they are decent last resort check-down options.

But when I say the fit in well with our offensive system, their physical skill set fits our zone scheme very nicely. In the zone scheme, outside of cutting D-linemen, you want some blockers on the second level. Hall and Kuhn have the quickness to get to that second level and occupy blockers. Quinn Johnson does not. Outside of short-yardage situations and goal-line situations, Johnson doesn't offer a heck of a whole lot to you. Arguably though, Kuhn offers just as much as Johnson if not more in goal-line situations, what with his ability to block decently, sneak out and catch-passes, or run the ball in (as we've seen, Mike McCarthy likes to hand-off to Kuhn in goal-line situations).

So while Kuhn and Hall bring similar skill-sets, I think they fit pretty darn well with our system. Much more so than Quinn Johnson's skill set. I still think it'll be a three-man competition, with the best two staying on. Kuhn might have a jump on one of the spots based on my thinking above, but I don't think anyone can say with any confidence that any of the players has a lock on any one roster spot. Which many imply, based on the "Hall or Kuhn stay" line of reasoning.

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beast
Select Member

14 years ago

#24

I don't really have any faith in Havner. I don't see him being a threat to opposing defenses (they can just throw a LB on him).

"go.pack.go." wrote:

I agree when a defense is playing man to man it has been easy for teams to just cover Havner up.

BUT when a defense is playing zone Havner finds the hole and gets open and once he gets the ball, he's very good at playing avoid the defenders game zig zagging he's way to TDs...

4 TDs in 7 catches... I'm not sure why defenders lose him in zone but as long as he keeps scoring for the Packers it's good :thumbright:

That's kind of why I want to keep 4 TEs for this year.

Dulak
Veteran Member

14 years ago

#25

Reported at the beginning of summer :
Whispers

Our sources in Green Bay would not be shocked if the team released a sizable number of familiar veterans this offseason. Included on the list of potential casualties is eighth-year TE Donald Lee, who is now looking up at Jermichael Finley on the depth chart; sixth-year LB Brady Poppinga, whose pass-rush shortcomings could prove to be his undoing; fifth-year CB-S Jarrett Bush; and fourth-year OT Allen Barbre. We also hear it's almost a given that one of the team's three fullbacks (John Kuhn, Korey Hall or Quinn Johnson) will be sent packing.

"68md" wrote:

Does this all hold true or have things changed here at the end of summer ?

most of us already knew that these guys could get ousted already ... but as far as lee and pop I have a feeling we keep them even thou their production is lacking.

like other posters already said - we do we have to replace pop as a backup? and lee is better then err cant spell his name (the new guy).
although I could do without seeing the ball thrown to lee in the endzone (did he drop it 2x last year in the endzone?)
viks game and?

porky88
Veteran Member

14 years ago

#26

Pop on the game against San Francisco. Quinn Johnson made some outstanding lead blocks for Ryan Grant. During that game, I saw some of the best blocking by a Green Bay FB since William Henderson IMO.

Also, he really is just a one dimensional player. He's a lead blocker. That's kind of it. He's not going to stand out unless the pads are on and there is hitting.

"all_about_da_packers" wrote:

That's the thing though, you see some good stuff but when you watch game film you see Quinn Johnson is pretty damn slow. Outside of thumping people, he doesn't do much.

He's not offering you much in the passing game as a FB-receiver option or much in the run game as a short yardage back option. With our offensive system, you'd like some agile and versatile players. Johnson, simply put, isn't that versatile. Khun and Hall, on the other hand, actually are more-so than him.

"porky88" wrote:

Well yeah and that's something the Packers are going to have to decide. Do you want versatility? Personally, I want a thumper as a FB. I feel like a lead blocker is more important to the team than a pass catcher out of the backfield. I make life as easy for Ryan Grant as possible.

I've said this before, but just because everyone says Jarrett Bush is a good special teams player, doesn't mean he actually is. When is the last time you can remember Jarrett Bush making a good play on special teams? Exactly.

Similar to how everyone says Brett Favre is a clutch qb. Actually , he sucks when the game is on the line. Great regular season qb. Playoffs/when the game is on the line, not so much. As much as he's choked in these situations, it doesn't stop people from saying, "Brett Favre is the guy I want on my team when its clutch time."

And with Bush, it doesn't matter how many bone headed plays/penalties he makes on ST, people will still say that he is a ST ace. I don't get it.

That said, I don't think Jarrett Bush gets cut. He has an unofficial lifetime contract with the Packers it seems.

"IronMan" wrote:

There is much more to special teams play than racking up tackles. Are you disciplined? Are you in the right position? Bush is all those things. I wouldn't call him a league wide special teams ace, but as far as the Packers are concerned, he's one of the better special teams players on the team, which helps his cause.

Will Blackmon has shown potential to be more than just a return man. If he's healthy, he could knock Bush out. I think that's a tidbit worth watching.

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earthquake
Member

14 years ago

#27

I honestly dont think we need someone who is a receiving threat and all these other things as a lead-blocking fullback. With our FB(Hall or Kuhn) and TE's, we have enough of those sort of "tweener" guys that can do some blocking and do some catching. Johnson was drafted for a reason, and that is to lay people the F out.... Is that enough to stay on the roster? Well, it was enough for them to use a draft pick on the guy, so there must be some people who think so.

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Zero2Cool
Elite Member

14 years ago

#28

But my point is that it's pretty silly to anoint Johnson as having one of the two spots locked up, and thinking it'll be up to Kuhn and Hall to compete for the other one.

"all_about_da_packers" wrote:

No sir, I do not think he has one 'locked up'. I do however think his play will lock one up for him though. I think he'll prove to be a punishing blocker. I tried finding it, but failed, although Ryan Grant said he likes it when Quinn is in front of him. I don't recall him saying something similar about Kuhn or Hall. So, it may have been just one of those 'ill throw in a good word' type of comments.

Bigbyfan
Member

14 years ago

#29

I think Hall is the odd man out in the FB battle. The main reason is availibilty. I may be wrong, but it seems Hall has been consistently injured the past couple seasons.

blank

zombieslayer
Registered

14 years ago

#30

I got a little worried when I saw the title of this thread, then I started to calm down after I saw the names.

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beast (30m) : Merry Christmas 🎄🎁

beast (8h) : Sounds like no serious injuries from the Saints game and Jacobs and Watson should play in the Vikings game

packerfanoutwest (13h) : both games Watson missed, Packers won

Martha Careful (15h) : I hope all of you have a Merry Christmas!

Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Oh I know about Jacobs, I just couldn't pass up an opportunity to mimic Zero lol

buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : Jacobs was just sat down, Watson re-injured that knee that kept him out 1 game earlier

buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : I needed .14 that's. .14 points for the whole 4th quarter to win and go to the SB. Lol

Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Jacobs gonna be OK???

Zero2Cool (24-Dec) : Watson gonna be OK???

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : Inactives tonight for the Pack: Alexander- knee Bullard - ankle Williams - quad Walker -ankle Monk Heath

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : No Jaire, but hopefully the front 7 destroys the line of scrimmage & forces Rattler into a few passes to McKinney.

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : minny could be #1 seed and the Lions #5 seed

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : We'd have same Division and Conference records. Strength of schedule we edge them

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I just checked. What tie breaker?

bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes its possible but unlikely. If we do get the 5th, we face the NFCS winner

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ahh, ok.

bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes due to tie breaker

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I mean, unlikely, yes, but mathematically, 5th is possible by what I'm reading.

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : If Vikings lose out, Packers win out, Packers get 5th, right?

bboystyle (23-Dec) : Minny isnt going to lose out so 5th seed is out of the equation. We are playing for the 6th or 7th seed which makes no difference

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, the ad revenue goes to the broadcast company but they gotta pay to air the game on their channel/network

beast (23-Dec) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th

beast (23-Dec) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.

bboystyle (23-Dec) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno

beast (23-Dec) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?

packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I see what you did there Mucky

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : dammit. 3:25pm

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Upon receiving the news about Luke Musgrave, I immediately fell to the ground

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Yeah baby!

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : LUKE MUSGRAVE PLAYING TONIGHT~!~~~~WOWHOAAOHAOAA yah

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I wanna kill new QB's ... blitz the crap out of them.

beast (23-Dec) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : However, we seem to struggle vs new QB's

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.

packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : ok I stand corrected

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ok, yes, you are right. I see that now how they get 7th

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : 5th - Packers win out, Vikings lose out. Maybe?

beast (23-Dec) : Saying no to the 6th lock.

beast (23-Dec) : No, with the Commanders beating the Eagles, Packers could have a good chance of 6th or 7th unless the win out

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think if Packers win, they are locked 6th with chance for 5th.

beast (23-Dec) : But it doesn't matter, as the Packers win surely win one of their remaining games

beast (23-Dec) : This is not complex, just someone doesn't want to believe reality

beast (23-Dec) : We already have told you... if Packers lose all their games (they won't, but if they did), and Buccaneers and Falcons win all theirs

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I posted it in that Packers and 1 seed thread

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I literally just said it.

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