Cheesey you first have to understand how science works. It starts with a theory based on a curiosity, an attempt to discover how something works. The theory is then tested. Testing is interesting because a lot of time tests are done to prove theories wrong, not right.

"In science, theories are never proven to be true. Proof is something that happens in geometry, not science. The only proof of which science is capable is proof that a theory is false. That will happen when something is verifiably observed that undeniably contradicts an essential feature of the theory.
Instead of being proven true, a scientific theory can aspire only to being solidly supported by tests and observations. In science its the accumulation of supporting evidence that raises an untested hypothesis to the ultimate status of being a well-tested and therefore widely accepted theory."
http://sensuouscurmudgeon.wordpress.com/2009/01/25/wheres-the-proof-evolutions-smoking-gun/ 

However I find science and religion differ in one extraordinary aspect:
In religion, I can pray to God for the Packers to be a better team and to win, if:
A) The Packers win, they are the better team and God answered my prayer so therefore he exists
B) The Packers lose, they are the worse team and God didn't answer my prayer but for some really odd reason beyond me, he can still exist?

In science, I can test the Packers against an opponent in an attempt to prove that they are the better team and will win, if:
A) The Packers won, it's because they scored more and were probably the better team
B) The Packers lost because their opponent scored more and were probably the better team

Science isn't exact, but it can provide much better evidence than a belief in God.

In the end arguing science versus God sucks because I could simply claim that I created the universe and nobody could prove me wrong. I mean you believe in creationism? Great, what myth then? The Babylonian one or the Egyptian? Maybe the Zoroastrian!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creation_myth 

With so many different stories created to explain how the world started, why is it so hard to believe a scientist's theory that is explained in an understandable, tested way instead of a fairy-tale?

it's not hypocritical...it's faith. you can't explain it, quantify it, or make light of it. faith is faith.

So, i'm to believe, science can't prove something happened, only that it didn't happen.
So once again, it takes blind faith to believe that "millions of years ago" they say something happened....even though they can't prove it. But because they can't prove it DIDN'T happen that way, it MUST HAVE happened that way? HUH???

I understand, there are some things science CAN prove, because they are things that are still happening, and they can use that to figure things out. But just because they can't dissprove evolution, doesn't mean it happened.
They can't prove God made everything, or prove He didn't.

Science works this way. Lets say you walk into a room, and a candle is burning. You can watch the candle, and mathmatically figure out how much longer it will take the candle to burn down to nothing.
Then you can calculate backwards to see how long the candle was hours ago, days ago, weeks ago, months ago, years ago, decades ago. Right?

Of course to do that, you have to take some things for granted. Like, that the candle was ALWAYS burnng at the same speed, meaning the oxygen in the room was exactly the same back then as it is now.
And you really don't know how long the candle was, do you?
Or how about when exactly was the candle first lit?
Science can only prove what is, not what once was without undeniable PROOF.
When they find fossils, they have definite proof that that animal lived at one time. But that does not prove how many years ago, does it?

They find ONE partial skeleton (40% of the bones) and label it as the "missing link" in man's evolution. Maybe if they found 500 of the same exact type of skeleton, their supposed "proof" would make at least SOME sense. But ONE? That proves that that one ape or person lived at one time, nothing more. If it was a complete skeleton, not more then half of it made up of "I guess it might have looked like THIS" so called science, it would make some sense.
Tooth of an extinct pig, whale bones lied about as supposed "pelvis bones" ....their track record remains intact.

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Dcubez......you keep saying stuff like this "Evolution at least has scientific evidence in it's favor."
And use that to say what i believe makes no sense.
Yet as i have pointed out already, none of the supposed "proof" your scientists use is proof at all.
The "fossil record" is more proof of a world wide flood then evolution.

One partial skeleton.....is that what you base your beliefs on?

There is REAL science, and then the "I think it happened this way, so lets write it up" science.
One is provable, the other is "science fiction."

I'm not at all upset, and if thats what you want to put your faith in, by all means, you are free to do so. All i want to show you is how really full of holes your science is. Just because these men are smart, doesn't mean they are always right. They are making up stories, writting their own "bible" to follow. Thats the same thing many organized religions do. If they don't like what they see in the Bible, they write their own.
Thats where the trouble begins.

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While I believe there is a higher being, or GOD, I do not believe everything that religion tells us..

To say GOD did it.... sometimes is just not enough of a reason to "believe" something happened..those people that need to have hard evidence to satisfy their mind...And there is nothing wrong with that..

You can't "make" someone out of the blue to have blind faith..That grows over time..so all facts or non facts of Lucy, mammoths and the like, just wont satisfy this debate...


No one is going to change anyone's minds, so the debate is sort of like Ted vs Brett...

It gets to be redundant and its same arguments over and over again

Saw this on another forum


I believe what I believe.

You believe what you believe.

Why do you bother trying to convince me that what I believe is untrue?

Could I convince you that you are wrong

That maybe so LT....but did you ever think that maybe OTHERS that are reading this arn't so "Ted or Brett" over the Bible VS. Evolution stance?
Maybe this thread is for them. Maybe THEY are getting some answers to questions that they have, and they don't know who to ask.
Sometimes what we say isn't so much for who you think it's for. Sometimes it's for others that are still trying to figure out WHAT to put their faith in.
I KNOW that the chance of me changing the mind of those who have their minds already made up is probably zero percent.
Maybe this all has been for someone thats 50-50, and doesn't know what to believe.

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...Keepin' it on topic, everyone is remembering how sensitive this can all be...

Keepin' all personal stuff out of it.....


Yes?

I didn't see any personal stuff, what do you mean Dfost?

I know some think i'm crazy for what i believe.....some just think i'm crazy!

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Just keeping an even keel, Alan---

Not directed at anyone or anything...

The objective is to allow the conversation and thread to stay right where it is.