djcubez
14 years ago
I agree with Rock here. I don't think there's any one thing that will take your team into the Super Bowl, otherwise everyone would be doing it. It's definitely a combination of different factors.

The one thing I dislike about stats is they never tell the whole story of a game. A football game is a lot about tempo, momentum and motivation. Whatever team wants it more is usually the team that's going to win.

I was not around in the Lombardi years but I feel that the team was good based on the inspiration of Vince. Anytime you have a man that can lead a team like that, regardless of the talent level of the players, you're going to fight and scrap for a win.

It's kind of like basketball. The teams that win the most aren't teams that are built around one superstar. They're the teams where players know their roles and have good chemistry. Where all the players fit in, work together and work hard.

Look at the Dallas Cowboys this year. Their morale was low you could see it on the field. Their body language said it all. Wade gets fired, Garret steps in and all of a sudden they have fire again, taking down the division leading Giants. Look at Rex Ryan. That team plays for him. The Vikings play in spite of Childress.

I love stats but I think that comes more with playing Fantasy and Madden than actual football.
peteralan71
14 years ago

The one thing I dislike about stats is they never tell the whole story of a game. A football game is a lot about tempo, momentum and motivation. Whatever team wants it more is usually the team that's going to win.

"djcubez" wrote:



Stats tell as much of the "whole story" of the game as anything else does. You may argue that the score tells more. A team can play VERY well but just not be able to finish it up. Stats tell the most about a game from a single standpoint, as far as I'm concerned.
Green Bay: Home of the Green & Gold. And the hunter orange. And the camouflage.
UserPostedImage
Pack93z
14 years ago
There is a myth that there is the perfect elite defense.. they are as rare as it gets. Most teams disguise their weakness very well and pass themselves off as a great defense.

The key to winning, isn't found in a single stat.. it is studying the opponent, identifying their weakness and being able to exploit them.

To be consistent game in and out.. you have to have the ability and the balance to be able to attack the opposition on any front.

You can win with a single faceted offense.. but if you truly want to be consistent and dominate.. you better be able to be able to do multiple things effectively.. because sooner or later a team you will run into will take away one or the other element of our offense.. and in game you will need to be able to adjust, force them out of their scheme and then hammer them with your strength.

You might think that only applies to offense, it doesn't.. the same is true on defense and most notably pass coverage. If you are cover two or zone defense.. teams will attack it and gouge you.. or if you are a man team they will employ presnap movement or stacked set and create natural space for the receiver release. You better be able to interchange effectively to adjust in game.. otherwise you are going to be attacked.

The equalizer is if you can dominate the line of scrimmage, but as you move on in the playoff, that is going to be less and less likely.

Again.. there is no single stat that will drive home a consistent dominate result.. pass happy, run happy, defense happy unless you possess a once in a decade type defense. I have seen two.. 85 Bears and 01 Ravens.. the rest.. great defenses, but they all could be attacked.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
zombieslayer
14 years ago
I didn't watch much football in 2001, but rooted for the '85 Bears because it was my only chance to see Wallie get a SB ring. I was a huge Wallie fan.

Yes, their D actually attacked. It was the only D I've ever seen where the D attacked instead of reacted.

I agree with you, Pack. It takes a complete team. That's why I specifically say there's no magical formula. Plus, an O that just sits on the field all day long getting first down after first down while dragging the morale down for the opposing team sure makes the D's job easy.

I'm an O guy. I hate D. I'd much rather see a team like the '09 Saints where the D kind of sucked but at the absolute right time, got a game saving INT. I love seeing an O that's so good that they just keep scoring. My favorite game of all time was in '83 when the Dickey led Packers beat the SB champs 48-47. I hate seeing punts. I want to see score after score.

But let's say you never watched the game before. You're blind, or whatever. All you got is stats. You can't see the minute details, you just get figures in braille. Or, you're a historian 1000 years in the future and there's this thing called the Super Bowl that was a big thing with the nation America. You want to see which numbers made it more likely to win a game. Well, the answer would be the #1 D was your best shot at winning the Super Bowl game. No guarantee, of course. It's just your best shot.

That's what I'm getting at. You put in details. Take them out. Just look at numbers and numbers alone.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
warhawk
14 years ago
I have been a big believer that the opportunity to make it to the SB coincides with having at least a top 5 D. If you have that you have a chance against anybody.

If you look at the BIG PLAY stats you know what you have.

Turnovers
Sacks/QB Pressures
Big Plays Allowed (30+yards)
Redzone stops
PA after a turnover

You look at the really good D's and their stats are at the top in these catagories. What do these stats represent? BIG PLAYS. MOMENTUM KILLING PLAYS. I agree momentum is HUGE. How do you get it?

It's a BIG PLAY league. The team making the most of them wins.

So if you don't think stats count for much work it backwards. Look at all these stats and find where your ranked and it will reflect back in the stat of Points Allowed. All the stats are doing is showing what's going on out there on the field.

We happen to be #1 in Points Allowed. You go back through and look at the stats I posted above and we are very high if not at the top of all of them. It's no coincedence since we have crept to the top in PA we are winning. The underlying stats that got us that ranking is the reason for it.
"The train is leaving the station."
zombieslayer
14 years ago
Well said, Warhawk.

Let's take a look at the past 3 years - 2008, 2009, and 2010. 2008, we had a top tier O but no D. We sucked. 2009, we had a top tier O and a pretty good D (but not elite). We made the Playoffs. 2010, we have a lesser O than either of those 2 years, but the best D in the NFL. Well, this year we have a better shot at winning the SB than we did in '08 or '09.

Also note that in '10, we're turning the ball over. Yet, we'd still beat the '09 team even though the '09 Aaron Rodgers does circles around '10 Aaron Rodgers and Ryan Grant does circles around Brandon Jackson. Plus the '10 WR unit as a whole is not as good as '07, '08, or '09.

Gotta give some props to Mr. Capers.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
Pack93z
14 years ago

Well, this year we have a better shot at winning the SB than we did in '08 or '09.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



Ahhh... I shall ask the historian to quantify via stats why we have a better chance this season as last?
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
zombieslayer
14 years ago

Well, this year we have a better shot at winning the SB than we did in '08 or '09.

"pack93z" wrote:



Ahhh... I shall ask the historian to quantify via stats why we have a better chance this season as last?

"zombieslayer" wrote:



This time last year we were 5-4. Today, we have the 2nd most wins in the NFC, and the 4th most wins in the NFL.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
Pack93z
14 years ago

Well, this year we have a better shot at winning the SB than we did in '08 or '09.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



Ahhh... I shall ask the historian to quantify via stats why we have a better chance this season as last?

"pack93z" wrote:



This time last year we were 5-4. Today, we have the 2nd most wins in the NFC, and the 4th most wins in the NFL.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



So.. when asked.. you turned to the wins instead of the defensive ranking, TOP, TO ratio or what not.

Daily portion of giving Zombie a quick zing complete.. continuing the regularly scheduled program. 😉
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
zombieslayer
14 years ago
My brain just blew up.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
Fan Shout
dfosterf (6-Jun) : Semper fi !
Cheesey (6-Jun) : This is why I have so much respect for those that have gone through battles
Cheesey (6-Jun) : I can't even imagine what that would have been like
wpr (6-Jun) : "Come on, you sons of bitches. Do you want to live forever?"
wpr (6-Jun) : Facing a line of machine guns 2 time medal of Honor recipient, First Sergeant Dan Daly told his men,
wpr (6-Jun) : Another detachment went into the Belleau Wood.
wpr (6-Jun) : On the 6th the Marines took Hill 142 but suffered terrible losses.
wpr (6-Jun) : It’s time to remember dfoster’s Marine brothers in Belleau Wood. The battle went on from June 1-26. Nearly 10,000 casualties.
packerfanoutwest (6-Jun) : Nick Collins and Morgan Burnett have signed with the PACK
packerfanoutwest (6-Jun) : he won't be wearing #12, maybe he will wear number two
packerfanoutwest (6-Jun) : He will fail this season, should have retired
Mucky Tundra (5-Jun) : Thus the cycle of Hall of Fame Packer QBs going to the Jets and then the Vikings is broken
bboystyle (5-Jun) : Rodgers to steelers on 1 year contract
Zero2Cool (5-Jun) : It's the cycle of civilizations. Get lazier, lazier, softer, softer and vanish.
Martha Careful (5-Jun) : great point. every aspect of society, including art, culture and sports has degraded.
dfosterf (4-Jun) : Green Bay sweep meant something to society about stopping pure excellence. We have the tush push now
dfosterf (4-Jun) : We old Martha.
Martha Careful (4-Jun) : *front four
Martha Careful (4-Jun) : Re frout four, I wish we had some Green "People Eaters" or a fearsome foursome
dfosterf (4-Jun) : *directions*
dfosterf (4-Jun) : Just don't ask him for driving direct
dfosterf (4-Jun) : Jim Marshall was an all-time great DE for the Purple People Eaters. Didn't like him. That's a compliment. RIP
Zero2Cool (3-Jun) : ooppppss
Zero2Cool (3-Jun) : “Kenny Clark played all of last season hurt by the way and got surgery to fix it in January”
Mucky Tundra (3-Jun) : @ByRyanWood How much did the injury affect him last fall? “A lot.”
Mucky Tundra (3-Jun) : @ByRyanWood Kenny Clark said he had foot surgery in January. Injured his foot in opener against Eagles and played through it all year.
Zero2Cool (3-Jun) : Golden is wearing guardian cap again. I bet he plays with it on too.
Mucky Tundra (3-Jun) : All the stuff I'm reading from Lions fans are pointing at his toe; he more or less has permanent turf toe in one of his big toes
dfosterf (3-Jun) : Kenny played through it, and a shame he gets little credit for that, imo
dfosterf (3-Jun) : Big men. I hope it's not the undoing of Kenny Clark
dfosterf (3-Jun) : Probably his toe. Pretty much a great center. Toe injuries are brutal to bigen
Mucky Tundra (2-Jun) : Lions All-Pro C Frank Ragnow retires
wpr (30-May) : It's all good.
beast (30-May) : Yeah, and I enjoyed your comments and just attempted to add to it. Sorry if I did it incorrectly.
wpr (30-May) : Beast I never said Henderson was the salt of the earth. Nor even that he was correct. Just quoting the guy.
Zero2Cool (29-May) : What did you do??
Zero2Cool (29-May) : Whoa
beast (29-May) : OMG the website is now all white, even some white on white text
beast (29-May) : Henderson, who admits to taking cocaine during the Super Bowl against the Steelers, might dislike Bradshaw as he lost two Superbowls to him
wpr (28-May) : Hollywood Henderson said Bradshaw “is so dumb, he couldn't spell 'cat' if you spotted him the C and an A.”
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : Cooper stock=BUY BUY BUY
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : Also notes he’s playing with more confidence.
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : @AndyHermanNFL MLF says there was a time last year where Cooper was at 220 pounds. Now he’s at 240 and still flying around.
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : And don't even get me started on Frank Caliendos "impersonations"
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : I got tired of them being circle jerks with them overlaughing at each others jokes.
Zero2Cool (28-May) : It used to be must watch TV for me. now it's "meh" maybe to hear injury update
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : I haven't watched the pregame shows in years and I don't feel like I've missed a thing
Zero2Cool (28-May) : Love says knee affected him all season, groin injury didn't help matters.
Zero2Cool (28-May) : I used to enjoy him on FOX Pregame. Now it's like a frat party of former Patriots.
Zero2Cool (28-May) : LaFleur on Watson: “Christian is doing outstanding. I would say he’s ahead of schedule.”
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
7-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

7-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

6-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

5-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

5-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

1-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

29-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

27-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

27-May / Random Babble / Martha Careful

24-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

23-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / greengold

23-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / earthquake

22-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

22-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

21-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / greengold

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.