ILikeThePackers39
15 years ago


I like the 4-3 better than the 3-4.
Why are the Packers switching to a 3-4 defense again??

seeing as Justin Harrell is a former 1st round pick, if he is healthy, i see no reason why he should not challenge for a starting de spot.

last year, the packers had no pass rush, i look forward to seeing Harrell, Pickett, Raji, can pressure the QB.

"dhpackr" wrote:



Main reasons -

- Stop the run; 3-4 D stops the run more effectively ... how does it do that? Well if the big 3 D guys stop it in the middle the OLBers can either penetrate or stop the run from the outside; thus effectively having 5 guys up front instead of 4.

- To confuse the offense <<< this is the main reason IMO. All last year with bob sanders defense; we hardly ever rushed the QB and when we did I could often tell when we were going to do this - and if I can see this from a casual observer I'm sure the opposing offenses could see this.

The 3-4 allows us to rush with 0 1 or both OLBers or even a ILB if so choosen (but theses guys usually stay back). Alot more options can be had with rushing the passer and this is usually done much more so in a 3-4 then a typical 4-3 (as I'm sure you could of seen last season we mainly rushed with only 4 guys and the offense knew this and so they usually blocked all 4 guys fairly well. Hence why we hardly ever got to the opposing QB and he could pick us apart).

- I assume that dom capers came here to install the 3-4; I dont think we decided to do the 3-4 and picked up capers cuz he could do it. (dont remember). But since we picked up DC and he has taught this defense successfully in a few different organizations ... now it's our turn.

- Kevin Greene said the 3-4 OLBers have the most important roll of them all; besides a solid NT. But the OLBers are required to do the most work but also have the most fun.

So this is why we are going to a 3-4

#1 Better run stoppage
#2 Confuse opposing offenses
#3 Better ability to rush the QB

From what I read we are slightly more vulnerable in the middle with short passes (having only 2 mid linebackers as opposed to 3). Hence why having our OLBers to be able to cover is ideal.

"Dulak" wrote:



great post, really good. I hope matthews (who i figure Ted Thompson drafted for olb) is a guy that can cover te and rb because i feel pretty confident if it falls into kampmans lap, opposing teams will exploit him on a regular basis.

"dhpackr" wrote:




Just my own opinion, but I think Matthews was drafted (over more pure pass rushers like Sintim) precisely because he does project well to handle coverage in those short zones (think Harrison's interception in the SB) - he's there to take that role and allow Kampman to concentrate on rushing the passer.

Don't get me wrong: I think he'll rush the QB himself a good deal, but he's got all-around skills and I think that's why he was the choice.
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ILikeThePackers39
15 years ago

What is great about our two #1 round picks is that both can play in either the 3-4 or the 4-3 (and we will play both) and they both can stay in the game on third down.

For those that really didn't want to see Raji what we get is a guy that will stop up the middle on early run downs and can shift over and penetrate from DT on passing downs when we put four hands down.

What we get from Mathews is not only a pass rusher but a guy that can cover so he can stay in the game and be effective.

What some people here are missing is that while we could have traded back gotten more picks and settled with a Ron Brace and Sintim is that these guys are situational players and the opposing team will not always cooperate and call a play the situation might warrant.

You can try to platoon players to their strengths but then it becomes much more of a chess game then in if you have players that can do the job regardless of what the opposing team calls.

Having guys with the talent to be able to adjust with the play call and be effective and can be in there all three downs makes us much more dangerous. The offense won't know what we will do whereas you put situational players in, i.e. Sintim, they pretty much know he's there to rush the QB or a Brace who they know probably won't create much penetration if they pass.

This is the difference between cornerstone type players that makes what you do effective vs. platoon and depth players that play a smaller roll in the success you hope to achieve.

It was much more critical, IMO, that we target cornerstone players for this 3-4 that we will be moving towards and fill in the balance of guys that will contribute from there.

"warhawk" wrote:




Great explanation - thanks.
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earthquake
15 years ago
This is how i see it, going with Chillar over Barnett for injury concerns and nothing else, if healthy i expect Barnett to be in, but not sure that will be the case opening weekend.

3-4  

         Collins
                                    Bigby
                   Chillar  Hawk
       Matthews                       Kampman
                Jenkins  Picket  Raji
Harris                                        Woodson


4-3

          Collins
                                    Bigby
              Matthews  Chillar  Hawk
                             
           Jenkins  Picket  Raji  Kampman
Harris                                        Woodson


Nickle


         Collins
                                    Bigby
                    Matthews Chillar
      Williams                   
           Jenkins  Picket  Raji  Kampman
Harris                                        Woodson

blank
Zero2Cool
15 years ago
Very impressive use of the Code box!
UserPostedImage
Dulak
15 years ago

This is how i see it, going with Chillar over Barnett for injury concerns and nothing else, if healthy i expect Barnett to be in, but not sure that will be the case opening weekend.

3-4  

         Collins
                                    Bigby
                   Chillar  Hawk
       Matthews                       Kampman
                Jenkins  Picket  Raji
Harris                                        Woodson


4-3

          Collins
                                    Bigby
              Matthews  Chillar  Hawk
                             
           Jenkins  Picket  Raji  Kampman
Harris                                        Woodson


Nickle


         Collins
                                    Bigby
                    Matthews Chillar
      Williams                   
           Jenkins  Picket  Raji  Kampman
Harris                                        Woodson

"earthquake" wrote:



I see you have chillar in there quite a bit - barnett was excellent pre-injury. And although I liked chillar with his pass-coverage I'm not sure how good he will be with tackleing.
I have a feeling that barnett will be in the game a bit more then chillar but well see ...

We will be playing the 4-3 most of the time next season (well as told by DC when he was hired) ...
So I wonder how well those front 4 guys will do - jenkins, pickett and raji and then kampman.

I think they should do very well - as long as jenkins fully recovers (anyone here anything yet on his injury status) and matthews can always pop in to blitz when needed.

I really hope we keep man to man with our corners ... are we planning on playing zone next season with them?
Rockmolder
15 years ago
I'd like to have Barnett in there aswell. He might be undersized, but we should give it a shot. Or are you anticipating a trade or so?

And I don't like our corners being offside the entire time.
Dulak
15 years ago

I'd like to have Barnett in there aswell. He might be undersized, but we should give it a shot. Or are you anticipating a trade or so?

And I don't like our corners being offside the entire time.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



ya I think barnett led our team in tackles the past few years
he wont get traded at least this year IMO ... but if he is still injured not sure

ya I loved watching woodson and harris dog the opposing receivers the whole game... I can just imagine it must of really pissed them off.

I can imagine them getting even more picks this season with some pressure on the QB
gergobacsi
15 years ago
In what position do you guys think Jeremy Thompson can contribute on the Packers' new 3-4 and 4-3?
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Rockmolder
15 years ago

I'd like to have Barnett in there aswell. He might be undersized, but we should give it a shot. Or are you anticipating a trade or so?

And I don't like our corners being offside the entire time.

"Dulak" wrote:



ya I loved watching woodson and harris dog the opposing receivers the whole game... I can just imagine it must of really pissed them off.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



I was reffering to the Offsides penalty, because our corners are playing past our D-line in the code.

Anyway, I asume you're after the press coverage? I'm hoping we'll run that aswell. I doubt that Harris will be able to cover receivers very long when he doesn't get that extra jam. He isn't the fastest (anymore).

In what position do you guys think Jeremy Thompson can contribute on the Packers' new 3-4 and 4-3?

"gergobacsi" wrote:



I asume he might play some rotational OLB in the 3-4 and rotational DE in the 4-3. I think he has a bigger chance to see the field in the 3-4 than in the 4-3 though, but that's just a hunch.

Makes you think though, our defense will most likely be made up off (nearly) the excact same personel in both the 4-3 and the 3-4. That ought to easen the transition alot.
earthquake
15 years ago
No i dont think Chillar will beat Barnett our or anything like that, i'm just worried that he may not be fully healthy on opening day. I full expect him to take over the starting role at some point, and wont be surprised if he was ready to go in the opener, just a little worried is all. In that scenerio i think Chillar has the best skills(coverage mainly) to play the position Barnett will be expected to play.

I also think i could have been a little more creative with the front 4 in the nickle. Lets say this for the nickle:

Thompson , Jenkins, Raji, Kampman.

I dont really see Matthews popping it at DE in a 4-3 or nickle, i think they'll have a couple converted/Undersized DEs on the roster that would fit that position a little better, like Thompson, Wynn or Montgomery.
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packerfanoutwest (6h) : or did you resctrict access to that topic?
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Zero2Cool (21h) : Tua’s old DC won a Super Bowl Year 1 with Tua’s former backup
Mucky Tundra (23h) : *winning MVP
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Funny observation I've heard: Carson Wentz was on the sideline for both Eagles Super Bowl wins w/guys supposed to be his back up winning
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : NFL thought it would get more attention week preceding Super Bowl.
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Yes, the Pro Bowl. It was played Sunday before Super Bowl from 2010-2022
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : pro bowl
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : From 2010 to 2022, it was played on the Sunday before the Super Bowl
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : They moved it to the BYE week before Super Bowl several years ago.
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : it was always after the SB.....
beast (10-Feb) : Though I stop following pro bowl years ago
beast (10-Feb) : I thought the pro game was before the Super Bowl?
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : ok now for the Pro Bowl Game in Hawaii
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : If I was Philly I would try to end it instead of punting it
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : VICTORY! We have (moral) victory!
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Hey they mentioned that we 3-peted
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : seems to me the 49ers should have traded Aiyuk when they had the chance
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : if the Eagles get it down to the 1, do they Tush Push or give it to Barkley?
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : 49ers have a money problem if they want to sign their QB
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Wait for real? Didn't he just get an extension two years ago?
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : 49ers gonna trade Deebo. Interesting
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Replays always never seem to show the holdings
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Great throw by Hurts
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Where Carter falls prey to bad off the field influences (to be clear, not saying he'd clip someone though)
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Had Carter not gone to Philly were they already had a lot of old college friends, he ends up in a similar spot to Aaron Hernandez
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : I think some of his coaches told scouts to stay away
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : the street racing incident+conditioning and motivation problems
beast (10-Feb) : Then Carter was street racing, where the other car crashed and people died... and other teams were scared to pick Carter for some reason
beast (10-Feb) : I think the Saints traded up, giving their next year 1st to the Eagles, and then they sucked and Eagles got the 10th overall pick
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : wtf Barkley?
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Getting Carter and Nolan Smith in the first round in 2023 was pretty darn good
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : for some reason i'm thinking of a draft where the Eagles where in the mid 20s and a top player fell all the way to them
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : I think so. I would need to look it up. Think it may have been Carolina's pick.
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : i'm not sure who i'm thinking of now
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : oh fuck me i messed that up
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Jordan Davis was 13th overall
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Carter was 9th overall
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Eagles had 15th and 10th selections, moved to 13 and 9 to get Davis and Carter back to back
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Eagles traded up for Carter, didn't they?
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Obviously he was a huge risk but getting a top 5 talent on the dline in the mid 20s is fortuitous
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Jalen Carter falling into their lap certainly helps
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : And we could only wish to have this type of D
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : It's not like Philly has had low draft picks, but has managed to get themselves a top notch pass rush. We spend so much draft capital of D
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : another crap halftime show
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : I think it is over, but then I think of Atlanta and want Philly to go in with the same intensity in the second half
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : And with a Pass Rush that might as well be on a milk cartoon and no Jaire
Martha Careful (10-Feb) : I cant help but feel good about how well the Packers D played in Philly during the playoffs
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : this game is over
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : This might be the kill shot here
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