Martha Careful
a year ago
Barrons wrote:

TikTok Is the Latest U.S.-China Battleground, What Investors Should Watch for Next.
And 5 Other Things to Know Before Markets Open.

The uproar in Congress over popular Chinese-owned social-media platform TikTok represents a steady evolution of tension between the world’s two biggest economies. It won’t be the last chapter.

On a day when the House of Representatives votes on a bill seeking to ban TikTok in the U.S., or at least force it to sever ties with its Chinese parent ByteDance, the issue underscores the value of big data—not just for marketing, but for national security.

The concern among lawmakers is that TikTok may be able to give the data harvested from its millions of users to someone else—the Chinese government, for example. That information could then be used for nefarious purposes—for example spying or extortion. TikTok denies that it is an agent of the Chinese state or any other, and says it poses no greater risk to the U.S. than YouTube or Instagram, owned by Alphabet and Meta Platforms respectively—two American companies.

Still, it isn’t a crazy idea. Anyone who’s seen an advertisement pop up on their phone for a product they might have casually talked about with friends understands how intrusive modern-day technology can be.

To be fair, an app as widespread as TikTok might have become a worry for U.S. officials even if it were owned by a close ally such as the U.K. or Japan. But the reason it’s a problem now is because of the emerging economic rivalry with China.
...
—Brian Swint

Can someone explain to me in simple terms (predicated on my following political belief that China is the greatest external threat to our freedoms and our way of life) the following:

1. Why Tiktok being owned by the Chicoms matter...I know its not ideal, but how is it different that Meta selling the data they collect to third parties which will ultimate get to Chicoms anyway?

2. As the article mentions, when you are searching for and item (I am not sure about having a conversation) then get pop-up ads...how is that kosher/legal. How do I turn off the phones ability to sell or provide conversation/search results to anyone?

3. Moreover, aren't there (shouldn't there be) privacy settings on phones and computers which limit access and/or distribution or our data?
Go Packers!!!!
Zero2Cool
a year ago
I don't know who or what a Chicom is, nor if they own TikTok.

The bill to ban TikTok is going to give the Government too much control over the internet. It's basically a poison pill bill. What's new with the Government though.
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dfosterf
a year ago
Chinese communists
Zero2Cool
a year ago
When this was brought up about a year ago, I tried disclosing some warnings/concerns of mine.

If this is passed, it's horrible.
How Government going to remove the TikTok from devices?
How Government going to know who has it installed?

To know who has it installed, our devices will be scanned and then flagged as such. If the device is flagged, then it'll be "cleansed" of the app. This will be done remotely and unlikely to be under our control. And guess what? That little process that scans the devices will remain there to ensure TikTok is NOT once again installed. Hello Big Brother!

You can call me conspiracy nut, but technology is one thing I'm familiar with. I am telling you, we cannot let this happen. I hate TikTok, rather, I hate how it's misused, but that's a HUMAN problem, not a Government overreaching political toy.
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Martha Careful
a year ago
thank you so much for replying. I greatly value your opinion. I will call my senators and urge them not to vote for the legislation.
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Zero2Cool
a year ago

thank you so much for replying. I greatly value your opinion. I will call my senators and urge them not to vote for the legislation.

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful 


Probably good idea. If there's no disclosure on HOW they'll know who has it installed and HOW they will remove it. I'm not liking that open-ended intrusion.
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wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
a year ago

Probably good idea. If there's no disclosure on HOW they'll know who has it installed and HOW they will remove it. I'm not liking that open-ended intrusion.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



I was reading an article about social media access in North Korea. Or the lack thereof. Phones are set up to only engage within North Korea. Fines and prison are given to violators. No phones from outside countries are allowed.

I don't have tik tok. I don't want it. I can't imagine ever wanting it. If people know that it's owned by a Chinese corporation (and by now they should its been in the news often enough over the past 5 years.) that is THEIR CHOICE not Washington.

When I hear tik tok I think of
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Zero2Cool
a year ago

I was reading an article about social media access in North Korea. Or the lack thereof. Phones are set up to only engage within North Korea. Fines and prison are given to violators. No phones from outside countries are allowed.

Originally Posted by: wpr 



I think it's the data the US wants access to. TikTok syphons a crap ton of it. The US is probably like hey, HEY, we want in on that!! So, the likely outcome is some behind the scenes "agreement" where China shares the data with the US. Ultimately, the US isn't worried about our privacy. They're just wanting to infringe on it. At least, that is my speculation. Maybe the Edward Snowden thing has me unnecessarily pessimistic though. Especially with projects like ThinThread.

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earthquake
a year ago
Kevin's take on this is more or less where I stand. For context, I work in software development, though not in data/personal information management so I'm not an expert on this topic in particular.

Anyway, it's my understanding that there are a couple of issues here:
1. The US government would like better access to the information that TikTok gathers from its users, like they have with Facebook, Instagram, Google, etc. TikTok being owned by a Chinese company greatly complicates this. This is the main purpose of the bill/the push to force a sale of TikTok.
2. Many people under 30 years old get a significant amount of their information from TikTok. A lot of kids basically use TikTok as a replacement for Google - as a search engine - which is strange because it's more of a social media platform. Anyway, there's some McCarthy-esq handwringing over this and the general idea that TikTok is an evil communist propaganda tool that is brainwashing the children. We see this kind of alarmism every generation - it was Rock and Roll, MTV, and video games that were responsible for corrupting the youth, and now it's TikTok. This is a convenient smokescreen for some potentially insidious stuff (see #1).

As Kevin mentions, the government really should not be looking to control what websites we can visit or what applications we are able to install on our phones, aside from cases where the sites or apps in question break some kind of law (drugs, trafficking, black-market, scams, etc). Not only is it a gross violation of our basic freedoms, it's not even remotely practical for the government to enact such policies. Even if one would like TikTok to be banned, the precedence it would set for the government's ability to control information and how private corporations are run is concerning.

Thankfully most people in the government don't know how to use computers, let alone how the internet or apps work, so the likelihood of this happening or being successful is quite low. Additionally, it seems unlikely that the Senate will act on the bill the House passed in any case. It's more political theatre than anything approaching governance, as is all too common with bills that leave the House.
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earthquake
a year ago

3. Moreover, aren't there (shouldn't there be) privacy settings on phones and computers which limit access and/or distribution or our data?



Just to touch on this one. Sometimes the user has control over what information is available to an app or service. Sometimes (often) you not only agree to terms and conditions when you install the app, but agree to share or even give ownership of your information and other data (such as photos, videos, and any text you might post through the app). Often these agreements are mandatory if you want to install or use the application.

If anyone here has a Facebook account, please understand that all content you post there is effectively the legal property of Facebook. The typical justification for these kind of terms of service agreements is that without your express consent or transfer of ownership of the information, Facebook could not post it on your behalf. The more accurate (and cynical view), is that these companies mine and sell this information for all sorts of purposes. Generally, the information is anonymized, Facebook doesn't sell your name and address to its ad partners, but it does sell your interests, patterns, and behaviors.

There are more insidious uses for this information as well, training machine learning models (artificial intelligence) being one of them. The entire state of the AI industry is basically the wild-wild-west right now, with no one being quite sure if the models have been trained on data they were legally allowed to possess, or if any content created by the models could ever be owned - owned in the sense of intellectual property/copywrite. And people in the government - the same chaps I mentioned before that don't really understand how computers or the internet work - are going to have to figure out how to make laws governing this stuff. It's going to be an absolute mess.

Anyway, getting back on track here, often the only way to completely opt out of these data mining operations is to not use these services or applications at all. If you don't want any information getting out there, you probably shouldn't own a computer, smart phone, or use the internet either. That is to say, some aspects of your online activity are being constantly tracked, and there's not a whole lot you can do about it.
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wpr (30-May) : It's all good.
beast (30-May) : Yeah, and I enjoyed your comments and just attempted to add to it. Sorry if I did it incorrectly.
wpr (30-May) : Beast I never said Henderson was the salt of the earth. Nor even that he was correct. Just quoting the guy.
Zero2Cool (29-May) : What did you do??
Zero2Cool (29-May) : Whoa
beast (29-May) : OMG the website is now all white, even some white on white text
beast (29-May) : Henderson, who admits to taking cocaine during the Super Bowl against the Steelers, might dislike Bradshaw as he lost two Superbowls to him
wpr (28-May) : Hollywood Henderson said Bradshaw “is so dumb, he couldn't spell 'cat' if you spotted him the C and an A.”
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : Cooper stock=BUY BUY BUY
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : Also notes he’s playing with more confidence.
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : @AndyHermanNFL MLF says there was a time last year where Cooper was at 220 pounds. Now he’s at 240 and still flying around.
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : And don't even get me started on Frank Caliendos "impersonations"
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : I got tired of them being circle jerks with them overlaughing at each others jokes.
Zero2Cool (28-May) : It used to be must watch TV for me. now it's "meh" maybe to hear injury update
Mucky Tundra (28-May) : I haven't watched the pregame shows in years and I don't feel like I've missed a thing
Zero2Cool (28-May) : Love says knee affected him all season, groin injury didn't help matters.
Zero2Cool (28-May) : I used to enjoy him on FOX Pregame. Now it's like a frat party of former Patriots.
Zero2Cool (28-May) : LaFleur on Watson: “Christian is doing outstanding. I would say he’s ahead of schedule.”
Martha Careful (28-May) : Bradshaw is a dumb ass cracker. I am so tired of his "aw shucks" diatribe. He should shrivel up and go away.
buckeyepackfan (28-May) : He wad all butt hurt because Aaron duped the media saying he was immunized.
buckeyepackfan (28-May) : Bradshaw needs to retire. He's been ripping on Rodgers ever since the covid crap. He was all hury
Zero2Cool (28-May) : Terry Bradshaw doesn't want Rodgers in Pittsburgh lol wow
Zero2Cool (27-May) : one day contract, which he also feels is pointless, but if Packers came to him, he would
packerfanoutwest (27-May) : Aaron Rodgers talks possibility of retiring with Packers, just another rumor
dfosterf (27-May) : Go watch 2001
Zero2Cool (26-May) : 1984
dfosterf (26-May) : That movie sent a chill through many. 1968.
dfosterf (26-May) : "Open the pod bay doors, HAL"
buckeyepackfan (25-May) : Haven't we all seen thus movie? It doesn't end well!! Lol
Zero2Cool (25-May) : lol Anthropic’s new AI model turns to blackmail when engineers try to take it offline
dfosterf (25-May) : Claude Opus 4
dfosterf (25-May) : AI system resorts to blackmail when its developers threaten to take it offline
beast (22-May) : Colts Owner Jim Irsay has passed away
Zero2Cool (21-May) : Well, emailing should work now. After not working for almost a year. Oops.
Zero2Cool (21-May) : Brotherly Shove did not get enough votes.
Zero2Cool (20-May) : lol our email hasn't worked in months. 7 pages of unverified users
Zero2Cool (20-May) : MySpace Screaming Lord Byron ... Brett Favre.
Zero2Cool (19-May) : Packers have signed first-round pick Matthew Golden, leaving second-round tackle Anthony Belton as their only unsigned draft pick
beast (19-May) : Supposedly he has to take his image, and name off of it... but otherwise could keep selling wine if he wanted to.
Zero2Cool (19-May) : he giving up his win business?
beast (19-May) : Speaking of Woodson, sounds like he'll be a minority owner (0.1%) of the Browns
Mucky Tundra (15-May) : Zero, regarding Woodson, that'd why I find the timing with Williams peculiar
dfosterf (15-May) : Ryan Hall y'all does a great job of tracking thesr
Zero2Cool (15-May) : Fear not!! I planned to do 33mi bike ride tomorrow morning, so ... yeah
Zero2Cool (15-May) : We got some dark clouds and nasty winds right bout now.
Zero2Cool (15-May) : Madison they had hail 4pm.
dfosterf (15-May) : Sure looks like these tornadoes are headed towards Green Bay
Zero2Cool (15-May) : Woodson of Charles fame was reluctant and then loved it. that didn't really come out until post career
Mucky Tundra (15-May) : IE "We bought into the Bears and they let us down, we have no choice to seek alternatives"
Mucky Tundra (15-May) : Or that Williams and his family are preparing an exit ramp if they don't like how things are going in a few years
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