Contrary to popular belief the Packers sky is not falling· Page 4

musccy
Veteran Member

9 years ago

You want discourse then give it. Tell us how you feel about our TE position.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa

Instead of rambling about why you think Raji and Quarless suck, or how everyone except for you or DakotaT love it when the Packers lose in the divisional round, how about you say how Ted et al could have, or now should work to fix positions, specifically the TE since that's what this thread was about.

earthquake
Member

9 years ago

#32

If you told us exactly what it was and not speak in generalizations there would be no need for us to pigeonhole you the way we do... but, I really do believe the reason you don't is because we're right and saying nothing is the best course of action for you. That is my opinion. It might be wrong.

You want discourse then give it. Tell us how you feel about our TE position. Tell us how you feel about our overloaded with 1st round picks defense and tell us why it sucks, if you even think it does in the first place? Tell us how you feel about having the greatest QB of all time and routinely getting knocked out of the playoffs? Why does that happen?

A lot of this stuff has already been put out there. The majority here IS happy with the way things are. Good is the enemy of great. I see it in your postings all the time. Good is not good enough. Comparing us to Cleveland and their jealousy is an awfully childish way to speak about YOUR team. Cleveland and it's fans aren't relevant as aren't any others. Why is it you don't want to maximize this team's ability to get to the show and win? Why? Oh, it's NOT a video game where we can have studs everywhere? No duh. We have an all world QB and what else is great or even close that? I love RC18 but he's not the elite of elite. Nobody on D is even close to that. We have one superstar and a bunch of good players. Lacy might be ready to make the leap to superstar this season. It's PATHETIC that we have a TE position group like we do. Not a single good player there...a middling talent in Quarless an unknown in Rodgers and junk after that that ain't ready to take us anywhere. The D? DL is as bad as I can remember. Raji jumped the shark years ago. Guion is a meathead who played last year to resurrect a career that was on the verge of ending. Datone Jones is a JOKE of a 1st round pick. Who else? Pennel and Gaston? Are you kidding me? Those are the guys who are taking us places? A 2nd OLB has been an issue for how long now? Now, we're going to have to use our only good one at ILB. Oh, wait...we have a middle aged tall guy at OLB this season. Team doesn't even know if it wants to play him full time anymore. It's unreal. We have to take our star OLB and make him an ILB because we suck so bad there. All the while, lets not forget we just can't ever spend money on proven players unless their careers are over. We'd rather use some UDFA who sucks vs. a real player because of cost. We have the cap but we'll sit on it and live with guys who suck instead of spending where we could to help. (Here comes the tired question: Who could we have added?) this isn't just about THIS offseason, it's about the last 10. We all saw what Charles Woodson meant to us. Pickett, too. Good thing nobody wanted either or we wouldn't have gotten either of them. It just sucks sometimes to be a Packer fan despite how awesome it is to celebrate that Browns fans must be jealous.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa

What a lovely conversation you're having with yourself. Let me know when you develop the capacity to converse with others rather than shout rhetoric at them and I very well may take you up on your most generous offer to express my views.

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uffda udfa
Veteran Member

9 years ago

#33

Originally Posted by: musccy

Are you joking? I beat the drum so hard for Jimmy Graham the last few years I broke it. Seattle, not us, went out and got him. Rich get richer...while we decide to stay the same. Here comes the ...they lost their C and...

Would've LOVED to see Jermaine Gresham here. Quarless is a JAG. Richard Rodgers is as inspiring as DJ Williams to me.

Maxx Williams was a guy I wouldn't have minded in the draft. I wanted MyCole Pruitt ...kid scored a TD with the Vikes. I posted this on another forum. We were all asked to say who we wanted in the draft at the positions we drafted so there would be a record of who we thought was better. MyCole Pruitt was a guy I wanted. Instead, we're rolling with a guy in Quarless (who I still refuse to believe isn't going to be cut) and Richard freaking Rodgers and then Perillo and Harold Spears or my guy from WKU?

Trade for a guy like Charles Clay... work your Philbin connection. I think Miami has a million TE's. There is no way you're telling me we couldn't have obtained a better TE than Quarless or Rodgers. We're just going to let it roll with those guys. I don't get it.

BTW, I don't think anyone is happy when Pack goes out in playoffs every year but I do think the first thing that is thought of is ...Gee, what a great year even though the bad ending... that is never what I think. I think for the love of get someone who can play D and make a difference so we aren't hamstrung by that side of the ball. I think I wish we didn't have Mike McCarthy as a HC and the WORST ST'S IN THE NFL. You have the greatest QB, a horrible D and horrible ST's but somehow we've got the greatest GM in the game. Makes NO sense. NONE. Carried by our QB all the time. One guy. The total team is a sad state of affairs. Yes, I like our O a bunch minus the gaping hole at TE, weak LT, and G's who get praised for being so great but get manhandled vs any formidable front. Oh, but we win vs. the likes of Det, MN and Chi. so we must be great? We consistently lose vs. the better teams in the NFL...sure, we'll wins at home sometimes vs. them but almost never on the road.

It really does seem like some holes are just completely avoided like we're just going to ride her on 3 tires until another one blows and then maybe we'll do something.

Richard Rodgers gets hurt this year and then what? This assumes he's even anywhere near as good as some here think. I don't. Assuming RR is good...he goes down...then what? Quarless is out for how many games, if he's even on the roster. We have NOTHING but UDFA's behind these guys. Gresham made TONS of sense. Vet who can play. We had more than enough money. Hold onto it. Just pluck someone's PS TE when the time comes if you "don't like the guys we've got" which he said about his ILB's for years. Safety after Collins... Sorry, but him liking the guys he's got horrifies me.

EDIT: Quake...you need no invitation from me to do anything. If you wanted to express your views you surely would've long before this thread.

Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."

Barfarn
Senior Member

9 years ago

#34

The key to any scholarly debate is that both sides honesty recognize the facts.

Fact #1: The ONLY way to win SB is to have several 1st contract studs.

Fact#2: If a 250 yard Rodgers is replaced with a 1200 yrd Graham, the offense does not improve by 950 yards because as Graham gets those 950 yards targets/receptions/yards will taken from Jordy, Cobb, Lacy, et al. At best a few extra 1st downs and plays are gained improving the O by 4-500 yards. Note: Graham replacing a broken down Shockey at TE actually caused NO’s Offenses to average fewer yards/gm over past 5 years.

FACT #3: Graham’s cost to Seattle =: huge downgrade Maxwell to Williams; Super Huge down grade Unger to JLP or Novak; the loss of the highest 2015 potential 1st contract stud; Chancellor not being in camp; and the loss of starting DT, McDaniel. Seattle paid 16M for C. Williams [6M] and Graham [10M] as opposed to keeping Wilson at TE, CB Maxwell [10.5M], C Unger [1.6M], DT McDaniel [1.9M] and 2.M would be left to add to Happify Chancellor’s contract. So the improve from Wilson to Graham; Hawks get much worse at C, CB and S; worse at DT; and lose 2015's highest potential 1st contract stud.

FACT #4: every team has weaknesses [plural] in cap era!

Fact #5: On O, if you’re gonna have one weakness, you want it at TE [FB is no longer a position].

FACT #6: In a 3-4 D, if yer gonna have one weakness, you want it at ILB.

texaspackerbacker
Veteran Member

9 years ago

#35

This may rub both sides in this glorious debate the wrong way hahahahaha.

I've said for a long time, you have a great regular season record by overall quality and consistency. That probably carries forward into the early rounds of the playoffs. However, when you get far enough along, conference championship, Super Bowl, LUCK has a LOT to do with it.

Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.

QCHuskerFan
Member

9 years ago

#36

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker

This may be one of the smartest posts you have ever made!

BAD EMAIL because the address couldn ot be found, or is unable to receive mail.

uffda udfa
Veteran Member

9 years ago

#37

Yeah, let's just rest on LUCK... that way it's not anyone's fault. It's just plain dumb luck. I'm sure the past 49 SB Winners all won because they just got lucky? Our Packers dominated the first two SB's...no luck involved at all. We rocked New England...there was no luck involved in that one.

Pittsburgh was interesting. We had lost so many guys to IR and then during the game. When Jarrett Bush makes a play anytime there must be an element of luck so I'm confused now. We barely got in that year. Had the Bears had something to play for we likely aren't in the playoffs that year at all. Rodgers got hot and we rolled behind him.

None of these luck or no luck debates has a thing to do with having nobody at your TE position or a poorly performing D loaded with high picks in it. Those are things you can do something about.

Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."

Barfarn
Senior Member

9 years ago

#38

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker

Ya and this goes especially for the Colts...LOL

And Tex, I agree 100%. Sometimes its luck that a guy doesn't bring his A game or a guy is sick or tweaks a hammy in Wednesday before the game. Little is said about Cobb's mistakes in the Champ game, "dropped" a key tough pass he usually catches, ran a route wrong for an INT, couldn't get separation at end of 4th Q; then ya find out he was hurling his guts out all night undoubtedly because of something Carroll slipped in his food LOL. Its bad luck line judge misses an offside call allowing the Sherman INT; one could go on. Maybe if the onside was a little higher or had a little more or less spin Bostic makes the catch or decides to let Jordy get it. The fact is a team can only control a certain % of what happens to them.

It's luck that establishes the FACT that the best team doesn't always win! Even the greatest teams like 1963 and 64 Packers couldn't win even with the great Vince Lombardi. Ted Thompson could could make gambling acquisition to possibly make the 2015 team better and certainly harm future teams; but those additions wouldn't make a difference to winning in 2015. The reality is, winning in football is usually about a team being right in the head and playing harmoniously, rather than great individual players doing their thing. This is why most teams that were good the year before, add "key pieces" so as to look unbeatable on paper, and then they get worse because that team is less right in the head though more talented.

Disclaimer: I am not suggesting we do nothing and rely 100% on Luck...LOL The steady GM puts his team in position to win every year; it's the dumb GMs that gamble and 99% of the time their gambles take a good team and make them worse or turn them into stinkers [see Bears, Denver, Seattle and SF in 2014].

uffda udfa
Veteran Member

9 years ago

#39

Originally Posted by: Barfarn

I've read it all now... we've seen the erudite Barfarn jump about the LUCK bandwagon...I never...

Let's just not draft or add UDFA's...it's just about luck, anyway. Why try hard? When we lose there is no one to blame. It was all luck...Slocum shouldn't have been fired. Sherman should still be here...it was just bad luck for him that things went as they did when Ted Thompson purposely hamstrung the roster.

Now, I don't believe a person has total and full control of much in life but to throw your hands up and say LUCK is how we're going to be champs is LUDICROUS. 2010 was just a lucky run. I can see now why you guys love Ted Thompson as you do... He has the QB...we might get lucky. Just like in the Favre days when idiot fans bought the: When you have Brett, you always have a chance pile of dung.

Heck, I'm mad now. We should've pinched the penny and saved our cap by not resigning RC18 or BB. Why do that? It's just luck, anyway? Save that cap...make a profit. The fans are fat dumb and happy anyway. They're believing it's all luck now.

Hey 12...stop training hard. It's just luck that determines champions. Hey Jordy...just take TC off. It's about luck anyway. Preparation? Ah, that's not true...it ain't prep...it's luck. Mike McCarthy has never shat himself. It's just bad luck.

Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."

DakotaT
Select Member

9 years ago

#40

What happened to the other 4 pages of this thread? Packers fans should be pissed about how our season ended last year, not giving Mike McCarthy and Ted Thompson a pass. But then Packers fans are used to that sort of behavior, with all the irresponsible play of #4. As bad as that 4th and 26 playoff game was, that Seattle game was exponentially worse. Elite quarterbacks tend to make coaches and GM's appear a lot better than they really are.

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Zero2Cool (3h) : Merry Christmas!

beast (11h) : Merry Christmas 🎄🎁

beast (20h) : Sounds like no serious injuries from the Saints game and Jacobs and Watson should play in the Vikings game

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : both games Watson missed, Packers won

Martha Careful (24-Dec) : I hope all of you have a Merry Christmas!

Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Oh I know about Jacobs, I just couldn't pass up an opportunity to mimic Zero lol

buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : Jacobs was just sat down, Watson re-injured that knee that kept him out 1 game earlier

buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : I needed .14 that's. .14 points for the whole 4th quarter to win and go to the SB. Lol

Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Jacobs gonna be OK???

Zero2Cool (24-Dec) : Watson gonna be OK???

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : Inactives tonight for the Pack: Alexander- knee Bullard - ankle Williams - quad Walker -ankle Monk Heath

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : No Jaire, but hopefully the front 7 destroys the line of scrimmage & forces Rattler into a few passes to McKinney.

packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : minny could be #1 seed and the Lions #5 seed

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : We'd have same Division and Conference records. Strength of schedule we edge them

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I just checked. What tie breaker?

bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes its possible but unlikely. If we do get the 5th, we face the NFCS winner

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ahh, ok.

bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes due to tie breaker

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I mean, unlikely, yes, but mathematically, 5th is possible by what I'm reading.

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : If Vikings lose out, Packers win out, Packers get 5th, right?

bboystyle (23-Dec) : Minny isnt going to lose out so 5th seed is out of the equation. We are playing for the 6th or 7th seed which makes no difference

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, the ad revenue goes to the broadcast company but they gotta pay to air the game on their channel/network

beast (23-Dec) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th

beast (23-Dec) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.

bboystyle (23-Dec) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno

beast (23-Dec) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?

packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I see what you did there Mucky

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : dammit. 3:25pm

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Upon receiving the news about Luke Musgrave, I immediately fell to the ground

Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Yeah baby!

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : LUKE MUSGRAVE PLAYING TONIGHT~!~~~~WOWHOAAOHAOAA yah

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I wanna kill new QB's ... blitz the crap out of them.

beast (23-Dec) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : However, we seem to struggle vs new QB's

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.

packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : ok I stand corrected

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ok, yes, you are right. I see that now how they get 7th

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : 5th - Packers win out, Vikings lose out. Maybe?

beast (23-Dec) : Saying no to the 6th lock.

beast (23-Dec) : No, with the Commanders beating the Eagles, Packers could have a good chance of 6th or 7th unless the win out

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think if Packers win, they are locked 6th with chance for 5th.

beast (23-Dec) : But it doesn't matter, as the Packers win surely win one of their remaining games

beast (23-Dec) : This is not complex, just someone doesn't want to believe reality

beast (23-Dec) : We already have told you... if Packers lose all their games (they won't, but if they did), and Buccaneers and Falcons win all theirs

Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I posted it in that Packers and 1 seed thread

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