uffda udfa
7 years ago

See I told ya Kevin, it's an evil conspiracy plan by those evil people in charge. Kevin, why can't you see these evil people?

It's easy to spot them... anything positive said about the Packers administration is clearly a evil plot to trick you... don't fall for it.


Originally Posted by: beast 



You don't get it. Evil? Deflect with such terms. Wrong is a better term. Manipulative even better.

You believe you've never been manipulated by 1265. I know I have. Just recently, even. The difference is I recognize it. You don't even when it's laid out. Cling to trusting sycophants...I worked and talked with them every single day for years. I understand the machine while you're blissfully unaware of it's existence. I must be paranoid or crazy. All I am is right. I've seen it over and over but I know you know that I don't know what I'm talking about. So frustrating but you choose it.


UserPostedImage
Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


DoddPower
7 years ago

Your reasoning is perfectly circular: a GM must be a great talent evaluator; therefore Ball, who is not, is a bad hire.

THE QUESTION IS WHY! Evolved [not necessarily better] thinking was presented on this issue and this counters none of that!

Let’s try again. Let’s just talk the college draft here:

Info comes for a million places about THOUSANDS of college players. A GM has to contort this info into a draft board that ranks EACH player [GB into tiers]. Organizational skills are FAR MORE IMPORTANT than knowledge of scouting for this task. A great scout without great organization skills will FAIL.

The players are adjusted, moved in and out of various tiers, as the GM receives input from EVERY SINGLE SCOUT and OTHER PERSONEL GUYS. This is what, 15-20-30 guys [don’t forget they use some outside scouting services]? What’s more important: the input of one more guy [the GM] or the ability to listen and process info from 30 other people with an open mind? Ted no doubt had opinions about several players, some, no doubt, very strong. Ball’s opinions won’t be nearly as entrenched as Ted’s. Ball will absorb the info from these 30 other people like a sponge and the pure info will be less likely to be corrupted by Ball’s preconceived notions about the player’s skills.

Justin Harrell was the only puzzling pick I've seen Ted make. Did Ted use the unbiased raw consensus of the other 30 or so guys with input?

I could go on, but tell me WHY the GM MUST be a great talent evaluator! The above lays out an argument that a GM super scout is a DISADVANTAGE based on how egoless that GM is. I think Ted is as egoless as any GM can be. Most GMs like Dorsey and Schneider have HUGE egos, I’m certain Ball would be better than those to at GM, even though a lesser talent evaluator.

And this assumes Ball isn’t a great evaluator, he might be. As infants we were all as good as Ted in scouting, a great learner could be a great evaluator in 5-6 years.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 



Hey may be a good manager indeed. I don't think Ted was a good manager. He is a good talent evaluator and scout. Ball might be a great manager, but someone still has to be the lead talent evaluator. The best of the bunch likely won't stick around Green Bay for long if opportunities arise for them to a General Manager for another team. How will Green Bay keep General Manager-level talent evaluators around? There could be a lot of turnover. That's concerning.
uffda udfa
7 years ago
It is concerning but not to 1265. Mike McCarthy is involved in the GM search.

How many of you have ever helped hire your new boss? Show of hands? Ah, none. It is bizarro world.

There are two guys in similar situations to Russ...Loomis and Roseman. There are 25 teams set up with football people and 4 others who have football people in higher roles with bean counter GMs. We will make the 3rd team in league to set up this way. It will be with a guy who has never done it surrounded by his buddies above and below him. Not a more poorly set structure out there if this happens.

I've read the downside is a recurring turnstile of personnel types leaving. Russ will have to continually replace talent that departs that he will rely heavily upon.

If you love your Packers you have to hate what is happening.
UserPostedImage
Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


DoddPower
7 years ago

It is concerning but not to 1265. Mike McCarthy is involved in the GM search.

How many of you have ever helped hire your new boss? Show of hands? Ah, none. It is bizarro world.

There are two guys in similar situations to Russ...Loomis and Roseman. There are 25 teams set up with football people and 4 others who have football people in higher roles with bean counter GMs. We will make the 3rd team in league to set up this way. It will be with a guy who has never done it surrounded by his buddies above and below him. Not a more poorly set structure out there if this happens.

I've read the downside is a recurring turnstile of personnel types leaving. Russ will have to continually replace talent that departs that he will rely heavily upon.

If you love your Packers you have to hate what is happening.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa 



Yeah, as others have said, it COULD work. But it's more likely that it will not work so well. Give Ball a big raise and have him stay in his same role. Pair him with a traditional GM and win Super Bowls.
uffda udfa
7 years ago
^^^^^^^^^^. Not the goal. :(

Only care to be good enough to keep the money flowing. 7-9 didn't help interest therefore revenue falls. Will be interesting to see the books this year from last year and see percentage change and compare to other years.

Perhaps, this was solely done to reenergize the base with lies of change and a recommitment that isn't to anything fans who want rings would relate to.

That Ball set up is far more likely to fail but Mike and Ted will have jobs with Murphy. That's a big part, too. Status quo forever.
UserPostedImage
Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


Porforis
7 years ago

When they hire Ball, I will be spot on that all they did is hide Ted and let him run things out of the public eye.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa 



I mean, is there anything you can't twist into "I was right, the Packers are doomed"?
uffda udfa
7 years ago

I mean, is there anything you can't twist into "I was right, the Packers are doomed"?

Originally Posted by: Porforis 



Yeah, hiring a real GM and DC. Not Russ Ball and Darren Perry.


UserPostedImage
Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


Zero2Cool
7 years ago

Yeah, hiring a real GM and DC. Not Russ Ball and Darren Perry.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa 



Who is a real GM and who is a real DC? What is John's list look like?
UserPostedImage
uffda udfa
7 years ago

Who is a real GM and who is a real DC? What is John's list look like?

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



My list looks like someone who has done the job, previously, at least at GM, like these two:

Scot McCloughan
John Schneider

DC? Rex Ryan...I like the aura, the bravado.
Mike Pettine...not a fair shot in Cleve as HC...confident guy with nice track record at DC


A young fiery, passionate, innovative, college guy who has coordinated against multiple pro style passing offenses and excelled.

Can't hand the D to someone on our staff. How can they? The D has been terrible for years and the fix would be to give the job to a guy on the staff who has never done it? That doesn't make any sense at all, especially given you can't say any part of the defense has regularly excelled.

DO NOT WANT INTERNAL CANDIDATES AT GM because Ted is still around. Had Ted been fired, then I'd be thrilled with Eliot or Brian. Having Ted around is bad form. Very tough to do your job and be you with your former superior still there. I was promoted over a group of people I'd worked for for some time, and that's not easy for them, either. I think it would be tough to give someone the gig inside. Outsider may cause just as many issues but they'd be different in nature and new guy easier path to getting rid of them as they aren't his guys.
UserPostedImage
Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


nerdmann
7 years ago

Hey may be a good manager indeed. I don't think Ted was a good manager. He is a good talent evaluator and scout. Ball might be a great manager, but someone still has to be the lead talent evaluator. The best of the bunch likely won't stick around Green Bay for long if opportunities arise for them to a General Manager for another team. How will Green Bay keep General Manager-level talent evaluators around? There could be a lot of turnover. That's concerning.

Originally Posted by: DoddPower 



That’s what Ted is. “The General Manager level talent evaluator,” who sticks around.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Fan Shout
Zero2Cool (14-Feb) : Packers are hiring Luke Getsy as senior offensive assistant.
Martha Careful (12-Feb) : I would love to have them both, esp. Crosby, but either might be too expensive.
Zero2Cool (12-Feb) : Keisean Nixon is trying to get Maxx Crosby and Davante Adams lol
Mucky Tundra (11-Feb) : Yeah where did it go?
packerfanoutwest (11-Feb) : or did you resctrict access to that topic?
packerfanoutwest (11-Feb) : why did you remove the Playoff topic?
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Tua’s old DC won a Super Bowl Year 1 with Tua’s former backup
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : *winning MVP
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Funny observation I've heard: Carson Wentz was on the sideline for both Eagles Super Bowl wins w/guys supposed to be his back up winning
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : NFL thought it would get more attention week preceding Super Bowl.
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Yes, the Pro Bowl. It was played Sunday before Super Bowl from 2010-2022
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : pro bowl
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : From 2010 to 2022, it was played on the Sunday before the Super Bowl
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : They moved it to the BYE week before Super Bowl several years ago.
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : it was always after the SB.....
beast (10-Feb) : Though I stop following pro bowl years ago
beast (10-Feb) : I thought the pro game was before the Super Bowl?
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : ok now for the Pro Bowl Game in Hawaii
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : If I was Philly I would try to end it instead of punting it
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : VICTORY! We have (moral) victory!
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Hey they mentioned that we 3-peted
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : seems to me the 49ers should have traded Aiyuk when they had the chance
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : if the Eagles get it down to the 1, do they Tush Push or give it to Barkley?
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : 49ers have a money problem if they want to sign their QB
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Wait for real? Didn't he just get an extension two years ago?
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : 49ers gonna trade Deebo. Interesting
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Replays always never seem to show the holdings
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Great throw by Hurts
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Where Carter falls prey to bad off the field influences (to be clear, not saying he'd clip someone though)
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Had Carter not gone to Philly were they already had a lot of old college friends, he ends up in a similar spot to Aaron Hernandez
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : I think some of his coaches told scouts to stay away
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : the street racing incident+conditioning and motivation problems
beast (10-Feb) : Then Carter was street racing, where the other car crashed and people died... and other teams were scared to pick Carter for some reason
beast (10-Feb) : I think the Saints traded up, giving their next year 1st to the Eagles, and then they sucked and Eagles got the 10th overall pick
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : wtf Barkley?
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : Getting Carter and Nolan Smith in the first round in 2023 was pretty darn good
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : for some reason i'm thinking of a draft where the Eagles where in the mid 20s and a top player fell all the way to them
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : I think so. I would need to look it up. Think it may have been Carolina's pick.
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : i'm not sure who i'm thinking of now
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : oh fuck me i messed that up
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Jordan Davis was 13th overall
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Carter was 9th overall
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Eagles had 15th and 10th selections, moved to 13 and 9 to get Davis and Carter back to back
Zero2Cool (10-Feb) : Eagles traded up for Carter, didn't they?
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Obviously he was a huge risk but getting a top 5 talent on the dline in the mid 20s is fortuitous
Mucky Tundra (10-Feb) : Jalen Carter falling into their lap certainly helps
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : And we could only wish to have this type of D
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : It's not like Philly has had low draft picks, but has managed to get themselves a top notch pass rush. We spend so much draft capital of D
packerfanoutwest (10-Feb) : another crap halftime show
TheKanataThrilla (10-Feb) : I think it is over, but then I think of Atlanta and want Philly to go in with the same intensity in the second half
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