The 2017 GB Defense· Page 3

beast
Select Member

7 years ago

Thank you Coach Beast. You will of course keep us, the uninformed up to speed on all Packer/League trends/changes. KC has an opening for a GM by the way.

Originally Posted by: Smokey

You are so welcome! It's always nice to help the uninformed, get up to speed on this great game that we all love! And it's so great that you appreciate the knowledge you have learned from others. [biggrin]

[cheers]

beast
Select Member

7 years ago

#22

NFL Networks' NFL Analytics expert Cynthia Frelund just said (when talking about the NFL in general that) she thinks Mike Daniels is underrated, because he was about on the field for about (I believe she said) 16% of 3rd downs, so he didn't get as many chances at high profile stats like sacks.

If correct, that's interesting they they rotated Daniels off the field on 3rd downs so often... though I remember seeing Peppers rushing up the middle on the DL a lot more on 3rd downs than in past years... but that has to be a huge reason they went after DT Montravius Adams, because he should be very good in that role as a 3rd down penetrator.

Smokey
Veteran Member Topic Starter

7 years ago

#23

With Guion in trouble , again , and hopefully on his way from rejoining the Packer's in 2017 and in spite of the 4-2 Defensive theory , who will join Mike Daniels in the Packer's 4-3 Defensive line ? I've reexamined the positions and can't now settle on the two players that will start beside Mike Daniels .

Who do you see on the DL with Mike Daniels in 2017 ? [cool]

nerdmann
Premier Member

7 years ago

#24

Originally Posted by: Smokey

Kenny Clark and Montravius Adams. Although I like Francois too. I consider this an area of depth.

“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”

Smokey
Veteran Member Topic Starter

7 years ago

#25

One respected source thinks the Starting DL for the 2017 Packers will be :

DT - Rickey Jean-Francois
NT - Kenny Clark
DT - Mike Daniels

With Guion likely to be hitting the road , the back-up players will be determined at TC .

This starting line-up looks most likely to me . [biggrin]

beast
Select Member

7 years ago

#26

in spite of the 4-2 Defensive theory

Originally Posted by: Smokey

Smokey, what are you looking for? You said you are looking for the "starting line-up"... but are you looking for the 3-4 depth chart? ... or are you looking for who actually starts?

Who actually starts will be a 4-2-5... just like it was last year. There is no theory here, it's fact.

Number of DL starts last year
16 Daniels
15 Guion
2 Clark

Sum of 33, divided by 16 games and that's an
average of 2.0625 DL starts per game.

The only game (including the playoffs) that the Packers started with 3 DL was week 6 game against the Cowboys

Number of DB starts last year
16 Dix
15 Burnett
15 Gunter
11 Hyde
10 Rollins
9 Randall
3 Goodson
1 Shields
1 Brice

Sum of 81, divided by 16 games and that's an
average of 5.0625 DB starts per game.

With the number being above 5, it means that the Packers started more games with 6 DBs on the field than 4 DBs on the field

So CLEARLY the Packers have started with 5 DBs on the field

Nickel/Dime Defense is the most used defense in the NFL, as teams are running more and more of it each year. Base defense are no longer the most used defense.

In fact, the Packers have now gone an entire game without lining up in the 3-4 defense.

They maintained that astounding streak against the Giants’ offense, despite never lining up in their base 3-4 defense on a single snap throughout the entire game.

acmepackingcompany wrote:

beast
Select Member

7 years ago

#27

Who actually starts will be a 4-2-5... just like it was last year. There is no theory here, it's fact.

Originally Posted by: beast

As explained in greater detail in the message above, the Packers only started two DT last year in all of their games expect the regular season game against the Cowboys.

One respected source thinks the Starting DL for the 2017 Packers will be :

DT - Rickey Jean-Francois
NT - Kenny Clark
DT - Mike Daniels

Originally Posted by: Smokey

For the 3-4 depth chart, I think that's correct. Like I've been saying, Clark is in at NT.

And it will be Jean-Francois or Lowry joining Daniels on the outside in the 3-4 depth chart. But the Packers like all 32 teams play over 50% of the time with 5 or more DBs on the field... as it has been increasing each year.

Here's the thing, though: no matter which set your favorite team plays out of, you're picturing the wrong thing. That's because the nickel defense has taken over the NFL. Here, via Peter King at The MMQB, is the evidence.

The 2015 season was the seventh straight year for an increase in the number of defensive snaps in the NFL with five defensive back or more on the field. Per Pro Football Focus here is the percentage of plays in NFL games with five DBs or more on the field in every season since 2008:

2008: 43.4%
2009: 45.1%
2010: 48.8%
2011: 52.5%
2012: 54.4%
2013: 58.3%
2014: 60.3%
2015: 63.4%

cbssports wrote:

Smokey
Veteran Member Topic Starter

7 years ago

#28

Teams that line up in the same defense all the time are subject to getting burned for it . However teams that disguise their Defenses are not as predictable . Lining up in the 4-2 Defense is an invitation to opposing teams to RUN the ball . Yes Offenses do throw the ball more than in the past , but Coaches still look at getting 1st Downs and moving the sticks another 10 yards down the field . Therefor gaining the 3 or 4 yds. needed for a 1st Down will still be a RB priority play. Also , Goal Line stands do still take place , and the 4-2 Defense is not the best Beefy D-Line that is sometimes called for.

Yes , the 4-2 is one of the Defenses that GB will use , but it will not be the only one utilized . For this reason it is proper to name three (3) D-Line Starters .

IMO , the most closely watched positions in GB's 2017 Training Camp will be the CB's , and should be as that part of GB's 2016 Defense was so poor .

[twocents]

beast
Select Member

7 years ago

#29

Yes , the 4-2 is one of the Defenses that GB will use , but it will not be the only one utilized . For this reason it is proper to name three (3) D-Line Starters .

Originally Posted by: Smokey

Then wouldn't it be proper to both name base DL starter and a Nickel DB starter as well?

DE: Lowry (or Jean Francois)
CB: Randall (or Burnett)

It seems like the reason the teams are still showing the base set-ups as starters, is because the NFL to fans is very slow and very reactive. Just like they had FB in the All-Pro voting for years or decades after FB because a less important positions and just recently got to changing it.

Also the NFL loves to put labels on things and over simplify them, to the point that it becomes confusing and easy to get screwed up... such as the position "DE". A 4-3 DE (edge rusher) and a 3-4 DE (interior linemen) are two very different things. But they're calling both DEs.

Another one, is PUP... there is the preseason/offseason PUP, which mainly just means you haven't yet passed a physical yet... and the inseason PUP, which means you have to miss the first 6 games of the season, and then have a window when you move be moved off the PUP.

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Mucky Tundra (24-Nov) : Two players out and Williams had an injury designation this week but Oladapo is a healthy scratch

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packerfanoutwest (22-Nov) : 49ers are underdogs at Packers, ending streak of 36 straight games as favorites

Zero2Cool (22-Nov) : 49ers might be down their QB, DL, TE and LT?

packerfanoutwest (22-Nov) : Jaire Alexander says he has a torn PCL

Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : Even with the context it's ... what?

Mucky Tundra (20-Nov) : Matt LaFleur without context: “I don’t wanna pat you on the butt and you poop in my hand.”

beast (20-Nov) : We brought in a former Packers OL coach to help evaluate OL as a scout

beast (20-Nov) : Jets have been pretty good at picking DL

Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He landed good players thanks to high draft slot. He isn't good.

Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He can shove his knowledge up his ass. He knows nothing.

beast (20-Nov) : More knowledge, just like bring in the Jets head coach

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : What? Why? Huh?

beast (19-Nov) : I wonder if the Packers might to try to bring Douglas in through Milt Hendrickson/Ravens connections

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : The Jets fired Joe Douglas, per sources

packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Jets are a mess......

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Pretty sure Jets fired their scouting staff and just pluck former Packers.

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Jets sign Anders Carlson to their 53.

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : When you cycle the weeks, the total over remains for season. But you get your W/L for that selected week. Confusing.

packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks

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Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : I don't follow what you are saying. The totals are not the same as last week.

packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : ok so then wht are the totals the same as last week?

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : NFL Pick'em is auto updated when NFL Scores tab is clicked

Martha Careful (19-Nov) : The offense was OK. Let's not forget the Bear defense is very very good.

packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Who updates the leaderboard on NFLPickem?

beast (19-Nov) : Has the Packers offense been worse since the former Jets coach joined the Packers?

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Offense gets his ass in gear, this could be good.

Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Backup QB helped with three wins. Special Teams contributed to three wins.

bboystyle (18-Nov) : Lions played outside thats why. They scored 16 and 17 in the only 2 outside games this year

Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : The rest of the NFL is catching up to Packers ... kicking is an issue throughout league

packerfanoutwest (18-Nov) : Packers DL Kenny Clark: We knew 'we were going to block' Bears' game-winning field goal attempt

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