beast
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8 years ago

If the Packers finally move on from defensive coordinator for life Dom Capers after the season, let's hope they move on from the 3-4 scheme as well. It would only make sense considering general manager Ted Thompson has been drafting mostly 4-3 defensive linemen and outside linebackers for the past six years. Since 2010, Thompson has selected 11 defensive linemenContinue Reading›› 

Continue Reading @ Michael Rodney 

Michael Rodney wrote:



More talk about players not fitting the 3-4 scheme... but really are the Packers a 3-4 defense anymore?

I don't think any of the 3-4 defense are pure 3-4 defense anymore... since teams mostly play nickle defense (yes nickle defense is played more than base, despite the name base defense)... and really base defense seems to be playing less as well as teams play more dime defense... to stop all the pass happiness.

And in nickel and dime defense... the there is no 3-4... it's normally a 4 man front... so all 32 teams are really 4-2 defense teams. So teams want players that can play in the 4-2 defense most. And this article suggest the players might a good fit for the 4-3 (which is a lot like the 4-2).
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Dulak
8 years ago
I think the last 4-3 we had we had some dude named sanders (actually my last name) as DC and he sucked; never blitzed etc and our d always sucked ... well least it wasnt fun to watch. Enjoy all the cool stuff capers does - its just some things I hate to see also ... rushing 6 and then seeing the qb connect with a 40 yard play etc 4-3 are quite predictable ... if we had a guy that would change things up thats another story. the titans dc Dick LeBeau he sure messed with our offense. Think the titans ran a 3-4
The_Green_Ninja
8 years ago
How quick we all forget how much we hated 4-3 defenses. A 3-4 defense won us a Super Bowl.
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beast
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8 years ago

How quick we all forget how much we hated 4-3 defenses. A 3-4 defense won us a Super Bowl.

Originally Posted by: The_Green_Ninja 



In today's NFL... ALL TEAMS are 4-2 teams first... and the rest are sub packages... as the nickel package has taken over today's NFL.

The defenses are slowly combining into hybrid systems. Certain defenses are dying or dead in the NFL... such as the traditional conservative 3-4 defense... and the 4-3 Tampa 2 ... and while every team probably runs cover 2... I don't think any team is exclusively running it like they used to.

So the argument IS NOT 4-3 or 3-4... as that's already been settle as the entire NFL has gone to the 4-2 defense... the 4-2 package is what teams need to focus for getting talent... as the rest are just subpackages.
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nerdmann
8 years ago

I think the last 4-3 we had we had some dude named sanders (actually my last name) as DC and he sucked; never blitzed etc and our d always sucked ... well least it wasnt fun to watch. Enjoy all the cool stuff capers does - its just some things I hate to see also ... rushing 6 and then seeing the qb connect with a 40 yard play etc 4-3 are quite predictable ... if we had a guy that would change things up thats another story. the titans dc Dick LeBeau he sure messed with our offense. Think the titans ran a 3-4

Originally Posted by: Dulak 



Jim Bates was the DC under Sherman, he REALLY wanted a shot at HC. He was so disappointed that he wouldnt come back. Since the D had not had continuity for like 4 years in a row, Mike decided to keep the same defensive system. However, since Bates wouldn't coordinate, he had to go with Bob Sanders, Bates' right hand man. It easn't quite the same.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
hardrocker950
8 years ago

In today's NFL... ALL TEAMS are 4-2 teams first... and the rest are sub packages... as the nickel package has taken over today's NFL.

The defenses are slowly combining into hybrid systems. Certain defenses are dying or dead in the NFL... such as the traditional conservative 3-4 defense... and the 4-3 Tampa 2 ... and while every team probably runs cover 2... I don't think any team is exclusively running it like they used to.

So the argument IS NOT 4-3 or 3-4... as that's already been settle as the entire NFL has gone to the 4-2 defense... the 4-2 package is what teams need to focus for getting talent... as the rest are just subpackages.

Originally Posted by: beast 



A lot of truth in this. Rather than nickel being a 3rd and long solution, more teams are opting for the extra DB on the field quite often - which is not surprising with modern offensive philosophy.

I feel that the 4-3 has become outdated and doesn't stack up well against a modern offense. If we went to a 4-3 I would imagine our opponents would just use their TE more and destroy the middle of the field even more than they do now (if that is possible.)

The bottom line though - you have to find a way to put your best players on the field. With our current situation Dom needs to find ways to generate a pass rush to help the banged up secondary. I don't see us improving in that category with that change (but I have been wrong before.)
beast
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8 years ago

A lot of truth in this. Rather than nickel being a 3rd and long solution, more teams are opting for the extra DB on the field quite often - which is not surprising with modern offensive philosophy.

I feel that the 4-3 has become outdated and doesn't stack up well against a modern offense. If we went to a 4-3 I would imagine our opponents would just use their TE more and destroy the middle of the field even more than they do now (if that is possible.)

The bottom line though - you have to find a way to put your best players on the field. With our current situation Dom needs to find ways to generate a pass rush to help the banged up secondary. I don't see us improving in that category with that change (but I have been wrong before.)

Originally Posted by: hardrocker950 



I decided not to add my opinion in the last post, but I was thinking about talking about some of the hybrid systems.. specifically stating that I clearly prefer the 3-4 concepts. Even in a 4-3 design. The two teams I've noticed first do 3-4 concepts in the 4-3 design the were the Seahawks and Broncos.

The Seahawks with Pete Carroll's first year... ran a 4-3 system where they moved NT Red Bryant to 4-3 DE. Bryant was basically a five technique 3-4 using his run clogging skills like a NT would... and simply blitzed their OLB to that side a lot. So it was basically a 3-4 system, where the ROLB had his hand in the dirt every single play.... I couldn't help but think the Packers should of used Kampman like that (but on the left side). I'm not sure if the Seahawks still run this style defense or not... I think they might of moved away from it... but I'm not sure.

And the Broncos are now in a 3-4 defense... but note long ago, I swear their depth chart had a 4-3 design... with Von Miller as a 4-3 OLB and DeMarcus Ware as a 4-3 DE... but they still used a 3-4 concept with that, as Von Miller would surely be blitzing heavily.

I've wondered if the Packers could use a 4-3 system design with 3-4 concepts like the Broncos did...

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68md
8 years ago
It really depends on personal rather then 'this is better then that" issue. Seattle.. Minnesota and Philly all have top 10 defenses running a 4-3 system that gives teams fits. The 3-4 defense was popular in the 70's and early 80's and then faded to the 4-3 scheme.... then it reverted back.

There are multiple ways of running a 34 or 43 scheme... if you have the right personal one is just as effective as the other.

In GB that won't matter much when your corners get beat like a drum and your front 7 only decides to play 1 out of 3 plays and getting gashed the other 2.

Hard cold reality..we just are not very good right now.[twocents]
DakotaT
8 years ago
I don't care which one you run, until we get some speed and talent at ILB, this defense is going to suck. The good defenses around the league have studs at linebacker.

What's really disappointing is that Ted Thompson was a linebacker and still can't find players for the position. So the problem remains from the front office, through the coaching staff, to the players and the product all us momulucs watch on Sunday afternoons.

Also, why so many injuries every year? Do we need a new training staff?
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steveishere
8 years ago
Whatever scheme we need somebody better than Capers to call it. Other teams have injuries on defense and don't have consistently embarrassing performances like this team does. Dom does absolutely shit to cover for weaknesses. He just lets them get exposed over and over again while sticking to the plan regardless of how the game is working out.
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