Gilligan
8 years ago
Free speech is free speech, all the time.

I don't agree with all of Kaepernick's points, but I'll fight to the death for his right to say it.
I didn't spend 23 years in the Marine Corps so people could be offended by how others exercise their rights.

I liked a fellow veteran's comment the best:
"I never signed up to protect and defend a song, but I did sign up to protect and defend the right to protest and free speech."

I am chosen by many but taken by no one.
Cheesey
8 years ago
As I have said over and over, where is the outrage over black men killing other black men? Do black lives ONLY matter when a cop is involved?
Chicago just had its 500th murder of the year. How many of them were black on black murders?
Why arn't liberals like Hillary Clinton screaming about that fact?
Why did Kaperdink NOT protest his black "brothers" killing each other off literally every day across America?
Were those black lives ones that didn't matter?
Maybe I don't get it because I'm white and think that ALL lives matter, no matter the person's skin color.
Of course that was how I was raised. To accept all races and to expect all people to be responsible for their own actions.
As I hold myself accountable for my own actions, but not responsible for the actions of others.
I was born white skinned. I don't consider myself any better then anyone else. I actually feel there is only ONE race, the HUMAN race which God created.
It's the individual that chooses to build walls between those that don't look like themselves.
Either to hate them, or give them excuses for bad behavior. Both views which are 100% wrong.
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Zero2Cool
8 years ago

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PackFanWithTwins
8 years ago
Damage control.
The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
Nonstopdrivel
8 years ago
The solution to this problem is easy. Ditch the national anthem before sporting events. It's a dumb, outmoded practice that didn't emerge until after World War II, and it's long outlived its usefulness anyway. It has ceased to be an exercise in patriotism, having degenerated into an outlet for drunken, besotted, jingoistic jackals to beat their chests, howl at the moon, and intimidate anyone who happens not to be as caught up in the alcohol-fueled esprit de corps as they are. The practice makes me feel so uncomfortable, especially when the leagues trot service members out onto the field, that I've taken to waiting out in the concourse until after the song is over before taking my seat.

I can see playing the national anthem at the season opener, perhaps even at the championship game. But before every single game? That's ridiculous. Sporting events shouldn't be platforms for military recruiting. Save the displays of nationalistic ardor for events whose entire purpose is to stoke the flames of nationalism, like the Olympics and the World Cup, which only come around once every four years. (Thank God.) Scrap the playing of the national anthem, and no one gets to make a political statement by sitting and no one gets to take offense at the guy who fails to take off his hat or put his hand over his heart. It's a win-win situation for everyone.
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wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
8 years ago

The solution to this problem is easy. Ditch the national anthem before sporting events. It's a dumb, outmoded practice that didn't emerge until after World War II, and it's long outlived its usefulness anyway. It has ceased to be an exercise in patriotism, having degenerated into an outlet for drunken, besotted, jingoistic jackals to beat their chests, howl at the moon, and intimidate anyone who happens not to be as caught up in the alcohol-fueled esprit de corps as they are. The practice makes me feel so uncomfortable, especially when the leagues trot service members out onto the field, that I've taken to waiting out in the concourse until after the song is over before taking my seat.

I can see playing the national anthem at the season opener, perhaps even at the championship game. But before every single game? That's ridiculous. Sporting events shouldn't be platforms for military recruiting. Save the displays of nationalistic ardor for events whose entire purpose is to stoke the flames of nationalism, like the Olympics and the World Cup, which only come around once every four years. (Thank God.) Scrap the playing of the national anthem, and no one gets to make a political statement by sitting and no one gets to take offense at the guy who fails to take off his hat or put his hand over his heart. It's a win-win situation for everyone.

Originally Posted by: Nonstopdrivel 



I can live with that. I have to admit that I do like the jets when they scream overhead. helicopters, not so much. Even so I always think that was a waste of a few million dollars.
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Zero2Cool
8 years ago
When they have younger kids singing the anthem or just someone not a celebrity, I think it's a great experience and memory that will live with them forever. I've played in sports where the anthem was sang, it levels you and I wouldn't have it any other way.
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Nonstopdrivel
8 years ago
Though I still think it's unnecessary, overwrought, and often a little maudlin, I don't mind the practice nearly so much at local events, where it's performed by amateurs who actually seem to give a damn. It's the crassly commercial way professional leagues—especially the NFL—pimp patriotism out for the sole purpose of whipping the crowds into a frenzy that makes my skin crawl. The peer (beer?) pressure, the heckling, and the not-so-veiled threats of violence directed against anyone who chooses not to observe the ritual are downright creepy. It's so antithetical to the principles of freedom of expression, freedom of conscience, and freedom of assembly on which this country was founded.

It never ceases to amaze me that the very people who most fear government infringement of their liberties often have no problem whatsoever imposing their preferred version of nationalism on everyone else. Treading on the liberties of the minority is still tyranny, even (or particularly!) when it's performed by the majority on behalf of the homeland. Who needs government to take away freedom when your fellow citizens are more than happy to do it for you? Sometimes I can't help but be reminded me of that line from Star Wars Episode III:






And yes, I recognize that I am being a little hyperbolic. Bite me.
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Nonstopdrivel
8 years ago
Double post
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Cheesey
8 years ago
When I got to sing the anthem at a Milwaukee Brewers game in 2010, it was one of the biggest honors of my life.
I was raised a Jehovah's Witness, where we were not allowed to stand or sing it.
I never understood that, and love my country. So to me, having the freedom, which is sung about in the anthem gives me a feeling of love and respect for those who fought for me to have that freedom.
To give a couple of minutes to show that, is that too much?
Not to me.
I guess some take things for granted.
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Fan Shout
Mucky Tundra (5h) : beast, this is news to me! Tell me more about these, "draft picks." They seem mighty mysterious! 😉
beast (7h) : Yes, the Ravens have draft picks
dfosterf (8h) : Good luck to him.
Zero2Cool (9h) : Eric Stokes signs with Raiders
Martha Careful (10h) : Tyler Linderbaum C
Mucky Tundra (10h) : Cap space?
Zero2Cool (10h) : Do Ravens have anything we'd even entertain to have?
Mucky Tundra (12h) : I've seen trade ideas of Jaire going to the Ravens all offseason
beast (13h) : A probably false rumor is suggesting CB Jaire Alexander is being traded to the Ravens, again probably false
beast (13h) : Commanders might have a dominant offense the next 3 years at least
Zero2Cool (15h) : San Francisco 49ers announced they have released DL Leonard Floyd.
Mucky Tundra (16h) : Er getting traded twice like that
Mucky Tundra (17h) : Huh, LT Laremy Tunsil traded from Houston to Washington. Never heard of a top OT getting traded in his career like that
Martha Careful (11-Mar) : Minnesota Vikings cornerback Byron Murphy Jr. is returning on a three-year, $66 million deal
Zero2Cool (11-Mar) : Damn
Martha Careful (11-Mar) : Saints are re-signing DE Chase Young to a three-year, $51 million deal worth up to $57 million.
Martha Careful (11-Mar) : 49ers releasing FB Juszcyk any interest?
Zero2Cool (11-Mar) : digits of four
Zero2Cool (11-Mar) : four digits
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Eh, don't think so. better to split
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : on new site, would Fan Shout and GameDay Chat show same messages?
Mucky Tundra (10-Mar) : The Hall of Fame stuff probably came from a scout as Zero said; at this point though it's hard to see them moving ZT from RT
Mucky Tundra (10-Mar) : Regarding ZT at C, Gute had said he felt C was ZTs best position after he was drafted.
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : LB Oren Burks to sign a 2-year, $5M deal with the Bengals.
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Based on how it was worded at the time, probably scout.
beast (10-Mar) : I don't think the media person ever told the public the source, but Gute or LaFleur did say they thought Tom has earned his spot at OT
beast (10-Mar) : I think it was supposedly unnamed Packers source
buckeyepackfan (10-Mar) : Was that Gute or Lefleur or someone else?
buckeyepackfan (10-Mar) : Zach Tom could be a really good guard, an all pro tackle, but probably be a HOF Center. Who said that?
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : It's March 10th. I don't think anything is done.
Martha Careful (10-Mar) : if we think CB is done, we have a poor roster
Mucky Tundra (10-Mar) : CB and OG in FA, narrows down the top of the draft board a little
Martha Careful (10-Mar) : Meh....I hope we can get Ward 49ers or Murphy Vikings
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Yes
Martha Careful (10-Mar) : did Nate Hobbs just sign with us CB Raiders?
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Jets have agreed to terms with former Ravens CB Brandon Stephens
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Aaron Banks’ PFF grade was 0.1 worse than Elgton Jenkins last year.
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Muwahaha
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Oh awesome! Nostrawrongus says 4th so SUPER BOWL ON TRACK!!
dhazer (10-Mar) : to be honest the freee agent market isnt that great this year so I can handle a 500 yr or sub 500 is fine, i see us as 4th in division
dhazer (10-Mar) : Hi Dave long time no see
Mucky Tundra (10-Mar) : Slaton to the Begals=Guaranteed Big Boy in the first 3 rounds
Mucky Tundra (10-Mar) : WE SIGNED SOMEONE!!!!!!1!
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Former #Packers DT TJ Slaton headed to the #Bengals on a 2-year $15.1M deal.
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : 4-year $77M for Packers new guard Aaron Banks
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : OL Patrick Mekari to sign with the Jaguars.
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : oops
Zero2Cool (10-Mar) : Josh Sweat to Cardinals
Martha Careful (10-Mar) : Josh Sweat to the Arizona Cardinals.
Mucky Tundra (10-Mar) : Surprises the Seahawks signed Darnold for that money
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