EDIT: BTW, do you have a LINK to ANYTHING I've posted about PFF that is inaccurate? You make me smile...you think I made "blank" up? Nope. I asked you last night who these guys were...you were a subscriber and DID NOT KNOW. That's pretty amazing to me...you waste your own money on something and don't even care to know who you're giving it to? I didn't care to know about PFF's people because they don't mean anything to me. Last night after your nice chart trying to validate the wonders of Corey Linsley I decided to look for myself...took me just a few minutes of research to realize their 2013 grade on EDS is higher than Linsley's current grade and the main grader over there is a guy who studied ecology in the United Kingdom. I not for your subscription and you were starting at this fresh and you knew their site was run by some UK guys WHO DO NOT KNOW FOOTBALL nor have ANY BACKGROUND IN IT, you would conclude like me that these amateurs are highly questionable. You like to tout who uses them...Jimmy Haslam used a HOMELESS MAN in picking Manziel. Your sad deification of things like PFF are no surprise considering how you pedestalize other things you hear. I've been involved in this stuff...did it for years. It's like the Wizard of Oz...it's all a show...not really all that impressive. Look at Mike Florio... a lawyer who got involved with Jason Peery, whom I met and tried to help forge a partnership with at an old network of mine, is now on SNF every single week. It ain't some mystical thing where they're so much better than you, you just believe that and that is your choice. I don't believe it nor do I hail them or think what they're doing is some great accomplishment.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa 

Oops, just noticed you edited a post.


Sorry, where did I say I didn't know anything about the analysts? Please quote me and bring that to my attention. Prior to subscribing, I noticed many high profile (ESPN, SI, FOX Sports) and local media who trust them and after researching a bit on my own figured the reward was worth the risk.

It appears you seek any means to discredit them, even if it means twisting quotes from over three years ago out of context to do so and ignoring 7 years of experience in the process. I don't know how you can watch and analyze over 1,700 NFL games and not know anything about the game. That accusation is just mind boggling to me.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 

You are right, I had no idea the guy was from the UK or had an ecology major, nor do I find it the smoking gun you seem to, and I still fail to see the relevance to the topic at hand.

What if you started up a similar service? Well, this is entirely theoretical, so its not really worth much brain power to ponder. Why don't you put your money where you mouth is and actually start the service? You seem dead set on the idea that you could do it as well as anyone else, so why don't you actually do it? I can claim to be able to perform any task as well as any other individual that is known for that task, but talking is one thing and doing is something entirely different.

So, what do you have, the ability to talk, or the ability to do? Without actually proving to me that you can rate players (not one or two but the entire league) just as accurately as PFF, your argument rings hollow.

Originally Posted by: earthquake 

Regarding their merits, well, ask ESPN, Sports Illustrated, FOX Sports and the dozen of other large outlets that trust their ratings enough to publish the same information in their articles. That's not to say they are the gold standard of ratings and agents should use them to negotiate contracts, lol.

Zero2Cool wrote:

If there were some concrete way to evaluating players, don't you think it would be used? There is no 100% accurate measurement. The inclusion of the ProFootballFocus ratings was not, nor was it implied to be the God rating system. It is simply another perspective. Why that can't be understood is really irritating.

Zero2Cool wrote:

And no, I am not saying we should 100% trust each rating of every player by ProFootballFocus. I'm simply saying it's a good tool to compare Player A to Player B.

Zero2Cool wrote:

I never expected you to change your mind and go OMGoodness PFF is the goodest ever!!! Hell, I don't even think that myself ... I was just trying to shed some light that you could maybe consider the source as part of an evaluation. Unfortunately, you've decided in your arrogant way that only your eye balls accurately grade players. I respect that, even though I think your'e freaking asinine for it, lol.

Zero2Cool wrote:

uffda udfa wrote:

Your silence was deafening last night. YOU DID NOT KNOW...what you did know is exactly what you posted last night that they are used by ESPN, FOX, etc... that does NOT mean you knew about the analysts because you didn't. You ASSUMED they were legit guys because you saw them quoted on sources you trust. However, you never thought to look at whether ESPN, FOX, etc. were making good decisions in trusting them. Sadly, I had to tell you about the analysts you pay to read and believe. Those are facts.

It would be nice of instead of false bravado you could just calmly and politely admit you had no idea who was putting out the ratings you were paying for. Nope. Have to go around and around and try intimating you did know when you know and I know that you didn't. it's okay...I didn't know either but then again I wasn't paying them nor do I hold them in high regard.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa 

From Zero's second post:


From Zero's fifth post:


From Zero's sixth post:


From Zero's ninth post:


Cute indeed.

Zero, so you know you're not going crazy, there's at least four separate instances in which you previously referred to it as a source, not the be all end all final say in player evaluations.

Uffda: all sizzle, no steak.

Originally Posted by: mi_keys