Zero2Cool
10 years ago
What is the problem with our country today?

It is us, we are the problem. Why is that?

What is the difference between this generation and the generations in the past?

Studies have shown that from infant to age five is when we are most influenced and is when our personalities are essentially decided.

The primary difference between generations is that the mothers were raising our children back then whereas now mothers are working to pay someone else to raise our children in a "kid is a number" type of setting known as Child Care.

I'm very much for equality regardless of age, sex, skin, sexual preference, and whatever other issue. And this is not saying a woman's place is the kitchen or house-maker, but think about it, who would you rather raising your children during the most critically important years of their life? An individual who most surely cares for your child, but can they possibly care for as much as your child's mother?

When people hear someone is a stay at home parent, immediately there is a negative connotation attached to them that they are freeloading or using Government assistance. Most of the time the harshest critics are women bashing women for being stay at home parents. "Oh, you don't work? I'm sorry to hear that".

When you put a child in child care, you're facing upwards to $200 a WEEK and those child care workers are not paid well either. If you're fortunate, maybe $10 an hour. So you're paying $750 to over $1,000 a month for someone to raise YOUR child during the most important years of their life.

If a tax break for MARRIED couples who have a child were doled out for families who have a stay at home parent, I would be all for it. I would gladly pay a little more in taxes so the parent is raising their child during those first five years than a child care teacher who has around four children at once to monitor.


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dfosterf
10 years ago
I don't place negative connotations on stay at home parents that have a husband, wife or significant other working. I don't place negative connotations on stay at home parents that suck off their parents or if they flat-back, or whatever...

Just don't come for my money if you had a kid or kids and you can't pay the freight. I didn't get to screw anybody in someone else's family to make that kid, so why should I get screwed financially?

Now- if the government wants to post pictures and bios of the stay at home parents that I am supporting and wants to afford me the option of actually screwing some of the ladies, I'll revisit my curmudgeonly attitude...

😆


DakotaT
10 years ago

I don't place negative connotations on stay at home parents that have a husband, wife or significant other working. I don't place negative connotations on stay at home parents that suck off their parents or if they flat-back, or whatever...

Just don't come for my money if you had a kid or kids and you can't pay the freight. I didn't get to screw anybody in someone else's family to make that kid, so why should I get screwed financially?


Originally Posted by: dfosterf 



Typical response. Fright wing people have to make damn sure those babies are born, but when it comes time to pony up the tax money to help raise them, your assholes pucker up tighter than a snare drum.

But to answer Zero's question, yeah, it would have been awesome to have Julie at home to raise the kids. Unfortunately, there aren't enough high paying jobs to allow this. There are some advantages to the day care thing though, such as social skills and a survival tenacity. When have to fight for those toys - you get tougher.

Essentially, your children's greatest influence is their parents. Whether that's good or bad depends on the parent.
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Zero2Cool
10 years ago

But to answer Zero's question, yeah, it would have been awesome to have Julie at home to raise the kids. Unfortunately, there aren't enough high paying jobs to allow this. There are some advantages to the day care thing though, such as social skills and a survival tenacity. When have to fight for those toys - you get tougher.

Essentially, your children's greatest influence is their parents. Whether that's good or bad depends on the parent.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



Why can't stay at home parent bring the children to a park or play area or other things where children are present to get that social interaction? After all it seemed to work just fine for prior generations with stay at home parents. Stay at home parent does not mean they must stay at home.

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dfosterf
10 years ago

Why can't stay at home parent bring the children to a park or play area or other things where children are present to get that social interaction? After all it seemed to work just fine for prior generations with stay at home parents. Stay at home parent does not mean they must stay at home.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Dakota has a high paying job. He just told us he's making 3500 this week. Maybe he should take his 3500 and go to the park and hand it out to the stay at home moms.

...as to me as fright-winger- kindly recall I am raising two "grand-children" that are not even mine, coupled with a "daughter-in-law" that never married my step-son, and has never held a job in her life.

I (we-my wife and I) do it for these two kids. I get to bitch in here in exchange. We pay for everything, fwiw. My oldest grand-child is not in school today. She is not in school because my wife went to work at 6 am. I was off, she didn't want to bother me to walk my granddaughter to the bus-stop. Usually one of us do it. She's going to be pissed, at mom, who has ONE job, taking care of her kids.

The oldest one is my step-son's daughter. She's in kindergarten. My wife and I paid for her to go day-care previously, the last several years. Think about that- we paid for daycare while mom sat on her keester.

I asked Arianna (her name) why she wasn't in school on Columbus day. Of course, I knew why.

Me: Arianna, why aren't you in school?

Arianna: Because it's Columbus day.

Me: Who is Columbus?

Arianna: (After a major pause) He's the guy that got me out of school today.


I'll probably wind up paying for this young ladies' college education, along with her little brother... but to me, it's money well-spent-I have four children of my own -paid for- with appurtenant grandchildren] which I will NOT pay for, nor will any of you, thanks to my ex-wife and I raising our kids properly (mostly her, in fairness- I'd have done a better job as a husband if I were there.)
PackFanWithTwins
10 years ago
Is there a specific Problem you are referring to, I couldn't tell.

Personally I don't think there is any benefit to children to go to organized daycare. My mother was divorced and worked, so my brother and I spent time with sitters. Stay at home moms in the neighborhood who had kids close to our age, that were earning a couple extra bucks on the side so they didn't have to get a job also. It worked well.

With my kids, I was lucky. My mother provided our daycare. She was looking for an excuse to leave her job, and with twin infants, there was no way to afford regular organized daycare. So we helped her with a reason and way so she no longer needed to have a job, and she helped us save money. And there isn't a much more caring provider than a Grandma. The closer extended families can be, the better off we are.

What I see, is that we as a society have isolated ourselves. We don't know our neighbors as well, or as many of them as we did when I was young. Knowing as many of your neighbors, and knowing their kids makes neighborhoods as a whole safer. If you don't know your neighbors, how can you tell if the people that are in your neighborhood at any given time, belong there or not?

The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
texaspackerbacker
10 years ago

What is the problem with our country today?

It is us, we are the problem. Why is that?

What is the difference between this generation and the generations in the past?

Studies have shown that from infant to age five is when we are most influenced and is when our personalities are essentially decided.

The primary difference between generations is that the mothers were raising our children back then whereas now mothers are working to pay someone else to raise our children in a "kid is a number" type of setting known as Child Care.

I'm very much for equality regardless of age, sex, skin, sexual preference, and whatever other issue. And this is not saying a woman's place is the kitchen or house-maker, but think about it, who would you rather raising your children during the most critically important years of their life? An individual who most surely cares for your child, but can they possibly care for as much as your child's mother?

When people hear someone is a stay at home parent, immediately there is a negative connotation attached to them that they are freeloading or using Government assistance. Most of the time the harshest critics are women bashing women for being stay at home parents. "Oh, you don't work? I'm sorry to hear that".

When you put a child in child care, you're facing upwards to $200 a WEEK and those child care workers are not paid well either. If you're fortunate, maybe $10 an hour. So you're paying $750 to over $1,000 a month for someone to raise YOUR child during the most important years of their life.

If a tax break for MARRIED couples who have a child were doled out for families who have a stay at home parent, I would be all for it. I would gladly pay a little more in taxes so the parent is raising their child during those first five years than a child care teacher who has around four children at once to monitor.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Well, you have a fairly interesting topic here. I don't like your first line - what's wrong with the country? The answer to that ranges from nothing to factors way beyond this rather limited area.

I'm sure you could find extreme numbers of both examples and counter-examples both ways - people raised with stay-at-home mothers and people not raised that way. I tend to think there is a correlation, but a statistically weak correlation in favor of good people with stay-at-home mothers.

As for your solution to this situation, I tend to agree with Gunny, to the extent that there actually is a problem, "we" are not really part of it, so why the hell should "we" be forced to solve it/pay for solving it etc.? I have raised my children, three with the mother not working, one with, all to be solid citizens, arguably more solid than their father hahahaha. And no, my mother didn't work - I got bad all on my own (it kinda reminds me of that old Merle Haggard? song, "Mama Tried"


ooooh, I thought I was just posting a link, not the whole song - oh well .......

I've been a foster parent at times, as well as various Big Brother and mentor programs in past years, so I think I've done way more than just take care of my own. HOWEVER, it was all VOLUNTARY, and that's the way it should be. Raising taxes - you said you'd gladly pay more so the damned government could somehow subsidize stay-at-home mothers, that's just WRONG and bad policy anytime. Of course, if you really wanted to do that, you could do like I repeatedly advocate, have the government go farther into debt - Keynesianly inject that additional money into the economy WITHOUT raising taxes. That would be good economically whether it made any difference in the problem you perceive or not. Myself, I don't think it would help much.

I don't like organized daycare either, and I especially don't like all these stupid hoops a child care provider has to jump through these days thanks to damn government intrusion. Stay-at-home mothers or untrained but loving neighbors, friends, grandmas, etc. clearly are better than these sterile politically correct environments. However, I just don't see that as making much of a difference in the big picture - who and how many turn out all right, and who and how many don't.
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dfosterf
10 years ago
I know my neighbors very well. They introduced me to the state of Pennsylvania, their neighborhood, how things run here, etc.

I bring this up because they have also evolved into my close friends. Good friends. The kind you can count on, no matter what.

I've lived in schmantzy-smantzy subdivisions where no one knew one another. What fools. The value of having great neighbors far out-weighs 9 foot ceilings and cherry kitchens, imo. I am blessed.
Zero2Cool
10 years ago
The primary point of this discussion is that parents should be spending those first five years raising their children, not child care centers. The tax break thing was my concession that I am willing to make for those MARRIED couples who need a small break to get by. Notice the MARRIED couples and realize that implication.

The neighborhood you are talking about is what I am looking to move into next year at the earliest. Something I can set up shop for a decade or so until all my girls are moved out. Then I'm going to build myself a small shack with a full bathroom and garage on a tiny piece of land that has high speed internet and fall off the gird.
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dfosterf
10 years ago

The primary point of this discussion is that parents should be spending those first five years raising their children, not child care centers. The tax break thing was my concession that I am willing to make for those MARRIED couples who need a small break to get by. Notice the MARRIED couples and realize that implication.

The neighborhood you are talking about is what I am looking to move into next year at the earliest. Something I can set up shop for a decade or so until all my girls are moved out. Then I'm going to build myself a small shack with a full bathroom and garage on a tiny piece of land that has high speed internet and fall off the gird.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Hey man, I'm feeling you. I'm aware of your situation, as I read your posts. I go out and about with my posts for a myriad of reasons, mostly-admittedly- political, as in pull the chain of some of our fellow posters. You want some great advice from me? Move into an older neighborhood, make damn sure you don't piss off your (new) existing neighbors, then make damn sure they know their help is cordially invited.

Your quality of life goes up exponentially, as does your kids. That's old man talk, so take it for what it is worth. My NEIGHBORS' good will make me a happy man, on a day-to-day basis.

My wife waited 10 years to get the house we have. She was in the Real Estate business. She knows her stuff. These generic vinyl / brick houses with small trees are ass, no matter the inside crap our women-folk are so enamored with.
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