DakotaT
12 years ago

How do Chad Clifton and Donald Driver get mentioned when I brought up core players such as Aaron Rodgers, Greg Jennings and Clay Matthews III? Clifton and Driver need their contracts reworked, especially Driver if he makes the final cut.

I understand Cameron Wake is more valuable to the Packers than a 2nd round pick, potentially, but what about the salary he's going to take? You can't spend your dollars twice, which means you sign Cameron Wake instead of ... ??? I think the only of those three mentioned the Packers could get by with out is Greg Jennings.

Again, you cannot spend the salary cap twice. Once you spend 100 million, you don't get to spend another 100 million. Last time I had to explain this was to my ex girlfriend after she wrote out the rent check, then went on a spending spree because "well honey the money was there... i dunno".

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Do you understand the concept of wasting valuable cap money on aging, declining veterans? We don't owe those guys shit. If we cut them, we could use their money to give Wake a contract and have young bookends for our 3-4. After one season nobody will give a fly f@(# about Clifton and Driver. Drives me absolutely up a wall the amount of people that allow themselves to be attached to players in this business.


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zombieslayer
12 years ago

I don't think I said an elite TE is more valuable than an elite pass rushing specialist. Not sure if you were implying that or not, either way, it's clear now.

As the comment above says, Aaron Rodgers can make lesser TE better. I wouldn't object to the proposed trade of a 2nd rounder for Cameron Wake. I'm saying it won't happen because of money. However, trading Finley for Wake is much more likely because you get some cap relief in trading Finley, right? I'm assuming he's on the books for about $7 million when I'm saying this, lol.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



No. You didn't say that and I wasn't implying you did. I was speaking in general. D > O and an elite pass rusher > an elite TE. And yes, we already agree on this so I'm preaching to the choir.

Play2Win - you bring up a great idea. I think your idea is wonderful. I just don't think anyone of the other 31 teams will get rid of a good pass rusher.
My man Donald Driver
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nerdmann
12 years ago
No way Ted deals for someone over the age of 29. Just don't see it happening.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Zero2Cool
12 years ago

Do you understand the concept of wasting valuable cap money on aging, declining veterans? We don't owe those guys shit. If we cut them, we could use their money to give Wake a contract and have young bookends for our 3-4. After one season nobody will give a fly f@(# about Clifton and Driver. Drives me absolutely up a wall the amount of people that allow themselves to be attached to players in this business.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



Again, YOU bring them up, not me and yet you again try to lecture me on their lack of usefulness? I said and will say it again for the slow ... Aaron Rodgers, Clay Matthews III, Greg Jennings are the core I'm referring to, plus B.J. Raji. All need to be extended and trading a 2nd round pick for a guy who's gonna want say, $5+ million per year I just don't see happening. You can't spend the salary cap money twice.

Aaron Rodgers - 2015
Clay Matthews III - 2014
B.J. Raji - 2014
Greg Jennings - 2013

Looks like the only pressing need is Greg Jennings.


To your comment on cutting Donald Driver and Chad Clifton to afford Cameron Wake, you are absolutely correct. I think Chad Clifton is gonna get something like $5.5 million this season... my only concern with cutting him is, do they have a equal or better replacement? I don't know the answer to that, and I don't think anyone does until training camp at the earliest.
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porky88
12 years ago
Talk of trading Jermichael Finley is ridiculous. It’s almost as ridiculous as the mythical figure that is Ted Thompson. 👅

As far as a potential trade. It’s possible. This might be against the grain, but I don’t see the Pack trading down in round one. The Packers already have 12 picks. Adding many more would prove difficult unless they acquire 2013 draft picks.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
12 years ago
I'm still with Kevin on the trade down idea. Porky does make a good point about having too many picks, though, which is why I also expect any trade out of round 1 to be combined with a later trade up in round 3 or 4.

I just think that after the first 20 or so, everyone left that might be picked at 28 is early 2nd round level, and I'm a big believer in value-for-the-spot (or whatever it is called).

(Assuming that there are willing trade partners, of course.)
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
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Zero2Cool
12 years ago
If the Packers trade out of round one, I'm expecting them to trade back into round two or three. Ted Thompson also believes that the more picks you have, the better chance you have at landing a solid player. So that theory about the Packers don't need as many picks doesn't hold, even though makes complete logical sense.

After all, Ted Thompson would never lie to us.
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porky88
12 years ago
To elaborate further, I believe the Packers could trade up. I don't think they're parting with any players, but I could see a package of picks to move up to Cleveland's other first-round pick. For example, Green Bay’s first, second, and fourth round picks for Cleveland’s No. 22 and one of their threes. From my perspective, that's just as likely as trading back into round two.

Of course, it depends on the player, but if Courtney Upshaw falls by San Diego, then I think the Packers may get aggressive. He's everything they like in their players. He’s smart, well coached, and has a tremendous work ethic. In other words, he’s a gym rat. It’s just something to ponder.
play2win
12 years ago

Talk of trading Jermichael Finley is ridiculous. It’s almost as ridiculous as the mythical figure that is Ted Thompson. 👅

Originally Posted by: porky88 



I disagree. He is a prime, prime, prime candidate to trade. He is a super talent, no question, but, one that would also garner a super return. Under contract, a reasonable contract at that, for two years. Please explain why we couldn't possibly trade him.

As for trading down, I'm not real big on doing that, but I can see where it might help depending on how they have the board slated...

Problem is, we already have 12 picks, and no pass rush from two very important positions, RDE and ROLB. A long as they can cure that ill by trading down, fine. Maybe they trade a R1 this year for an R1 next year. Somehow, with our needs as pressing as they are, and as close as we are to the prize, I think that may be the opposite direction we should trade, unless they have their prime targets to improve our team sitting at 50-100 ish. I kind of doubt that, but who knows?

I guess we can agree we will all be pissed if they whiff, regardless of trading up or down. This is such an important draft for us.
earthquake
12 years ago
No chance that Finley is traded, it isn't a matter of if he has trade value(he does) its a matter of keeping your talented players, Finley is a top 5 TE(even with the drops) and you don't trade away players that good that you've just resigned. Finley is a young guy and his career is still very much on the upswing, he has the potential to be the best TE in the league, you don't give up on guys with the potential to be the best at their position. The Packers were ready to franchise Finley, that says a LOT about what they think of him.

I think its reasonable to say that the Packer's likely see Finely's value as higher than what they would get in a trade for him. You really have to look at the history of trades to understand this, how often do teams trade away young players who are under contract with huge potential? Most trades happen because a player is under performing, a malcontent, has a huge contract, etc etc.

You also have to remember that trading players for picks is extremely risky, on one hand you know exactly what you have with a player, and on the other hand, the draft is a complete crap shoot. Sure I would trade Finley for a draft pick if it meant I would get another Clay Mathews, but any idiot can look smart making draft picks in hindsight, in reality it just doesn't work that way.

I will go out on a limb and say the packers will not trade *any* starter for draft picks. Any trades will be for picks(very likely) or backup/role players(less likely). I think the last player Ted Thompson traded on draft day was Javon Walker(again with the malcontent thing). I also don't see GB making a huge trade up in the first, you have to give up too many high picks to make that happen, moving up past 20 is likely out of the question.

Again nobody is saying Finley doesn't have trade value, or that DE and OLB aren't huge needs, but thinking you can pull off these magical trades and everything will just fall into place isn't realistic at all.
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Zero2Cool (1h) : NFL thought it would get more attention week preceding Super Bowl.
Zero2Cool (1h) : Yes, the Pro Bowl. It was played Sunday before Super Bowl from 2010-2022
packerfanoutwest (1h) : pro bowl
Zero2Cool (1h) : From 2010 to 2022, it was played on the Sunday before the Super Bowl
Zero2Cool (1h) : They moved it to the BYE week before Super Bowl several years ago.
packerfanoutwest (2h) : it was always after the SB.....
beast (11h) : Though I stop following pro bowl years ago
beast (11h) : I thought the pro game was before the Super Bowl?
packerfanoutwest (12h) : ok now for the Pro Bowl Game in Hawaii
TheKanataThrilla (13h) : If I was Philly I would try to end it instead of punting it
Mucky Tundra (13h) : VICTORY! We have (moral) victory!
TheKanataThrilla (13h) : Hey they mentioned that we 3-peted
Mucky Tundra (13h) : seems to me the 49ers should have traded Aiyuk when they had the chance
Mucky Tundra (13h) : if the Eagles get it down to the 1, do they Tush Push or give it to Barkley?
TheKanataThrilla (13h) : 49ers have a money problem if they want to sign their QB
Mucky Tundra (13h) : Wait for real? Didn't he just get an extension two years ago?
Zero2Cool (13h) : 49ers gonna trade Deebo. Interesting
TheKanataThrilla (13h) : Replays always never seem to show the holdings
TheKanataThrilla (14h) : Great throw by Hurts
Mucky Tundra (14h) : Where Carter falls prey to bad off the field influences (to be clear, not saying he'd clip someone though)
Mucky Tundra (14h) : Had Carter not gone to Philly were they already had a lot of old college friends, he ends up in a similar spot to Aaron Hernandez
Mucky Tundra (14h) : I think some of his coaches told scouts to stay away
Mucky Tundra (14h) : the street racing incident+conditioning and motivation problems
beast (14h) : Then Carter was street racing, where the other car crashed and people died... and other teams were scared to pick Carter for some reason
beast (14h) : I think the Saints traded up, giving their next year 1st to the Eagles, and then they sucked and Eagles got the 10th overall pick
packerfanoutwest (14h) : wtf Barkley?
TheKanataThrilla (14h) : Getting Carter and Nolan Smith in the first round in 2023 was pretty darn good
Mucky Tundra (14h) : for some reason i'm thinking of a draft where the Eagles where in the mid 20s and a top player fell all the way to them
TheKanataThrilla (14h) : I think so. I would need to look it up. Think it may have been Carolina's pick.
Mucky Tundra (14h) : i'm not sure who i'm thinking of now
Mucky Tundra (14h) : oh fuck me i messed that up
Zero2Cool (14h) : Jordan Davis was 13th overall
Zero2Cool (14h) : Carter was 9th overall
Zero2Cool (14h) : Eagles had 15th and 10th selections, moved to 13 and 9 to get Davis and Carter back to back
Zero2Cool (14h) : Eagles traded up for Carter, didn't they?
Mucky Tundra (14h) : Obviously he was a huge risk but getting a top 5 talent on the dline in the mid 20s is fortuitous
Mucky Tundra (14h) : Jalen Carter falling into their lap certainly helps
TheKanataThrilla (14h) : And we could only wish to have this type of D
TheKanataThrilla (14h) : It's not like Philly has had low draft picks, but has managed to get themselves a top notch pass rush. We spend so much draft capital of D
packerfanoutwest (14h) : another crap halftime show
TheKanataThrilla (14h) : I think it is over, but then I think of Atlanta and want Philly to go in with the same intensity in the second half
Mucky Tundra (14h) : And with a Pass Rush that might as well be on a milk cartoon and no Jaire
Martha Careful (15h) : I cant help but feel good about how well the Packers D played in Philly during the playoffs
Mucky Tundra (15h) : this game is over
Mucky Tundra (15h) : This might be the kill shot here
Mucky Tundra (15h) : oh that's such a bad penalty for KC after getting the 3rd down stop
TheKanataThrilla (15h) : Philly DL has come to play
TheKanataThrilla (15h) : Ceoper DeJean with the INT scored...bad memories of draft night
Mucky Tundra (15h) : ok scratch that
Mucky Tundra (15h) : Game feels like last years Super Bowl: 49ers started off in control, moved the ball well but didn't have much of a lead to show for it
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