Dulak
  • Dulak
  • Veteran Member Topic Starter
14 years ago
So here is this article and then you have obama running around touting his stuff ... notice I pointed out the His.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_exclusive/20110511/pl_yblog_exclusive/polls-show-americans-support-immigration-reform-so-why-dont-politicians;_ylt=AnWIHEQbtX1RO5fKTqotf7qs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTVvYmdydnU2BGFzc2V0A3libG9nX2V4Y2x1c2l2ZS8yMDExMDUxMS9wb2xscy1zaG93LWFtZXJpY2Fucy1zdXBwb3J0LWltbWlncmF0aW9uLXJlZm9ybS1zby13aHktZG9udC1wb2xpdGljaWFucwRjY29kZQNtb3N0cG9wdWxhcgRjcG9zAzQEcG9zAzEEcHQDaG9tZV9jb2tlBHNlYwN5bl9oZWFkbGluZV9saXN0BHNsawNwb2xsc3Nob3dhbWU- 

Now maybe my ramble is based on personal bias or maybe not.

Right now I am living in britain and have had a real hard time in being able to stay here. As a matter of fact if I wasnt going to get married I would not be able to stay here at all. And as a matter of fact if I overstayed and the government knew they would soon deport me and then I would also face a ban from coming here for so long.

The only way I could stay here without getting married would be to acquire work through a sponsorship (which is a big process with lots of checks and paper work) or I have to prove I made a certain amount and paid a certain amount in taxes (a fairly large amount).

If not again I would be out.

Now I do not know all the ins and outs of immigration in the states even thou I am from there (I know alot more about the british system now). From what I understand thou is the states has a similar process as britian or maybe even a tougher stance.

Then I ask this - Why are there 20million~ illegals living in the states and they are mostly accepted and not deported and now the president says thats ok lets just make them citizens ...
Why?

In my time here in the UK I have met hundreds of brits that would of liked to go to the states to Work at a legitimate job and pay taxes and to live there. But they cannot ... because of all the hoop jumping ...

So even if a emotional argument does not work ... lets look at it logically.

Whom do we want living in our country?

- We want people that are not criminals ... right?
- We want people that pay taxes like everyone else right?
- We want to give jobs to those that are from our country first right?
- anything else? - oh we might want to invite people in that can fill in jobs that the US needs right?

These are all things that britain has in place atm ... (well they have messed up things in their system too but for people like me (non EU or old conquered country).

Anyone see any issues with the above?

No right ...

So why do peeps think that most americans want criminals that dont pay taxes, take away our jobs and abuse the system?

I know the old argument was from companies that liked to exploit people:
- cheap labor, true blooded americans wouldnt cut grass or clean ... so therefor we need to bring in illegals and hire them and pay them less and treat them like s%^&.

Or as the president likes to profess - our country was founded on immigration so therefor we should give them amnesty and citizenship? ... err really?

seriously?

Now lets ask why he defends this ...

- votes could it be?

how about this for example of 10 million people decided to what rob people whenever they felt like should we just allow it since well thats what 10 million people wanted to do? or how about smoke pot? I bet there are alot of pot smokers in the states ... shouldnt we legalize that now? ...

Let me tell you what I think should be done.

- ya our immigration system is a mess now - with all these millions of illegals atm ... and instead of giving amnesty to ALL of them. Make them go through a process just like EVERYONE that would choose to live there. EVERYONE ... a brit, a japenese person, a russian, hispanic whomever.

- ok ya give certain points for this or that as in are they helping society and paying taxes and did they commit crimes etc ... if not ya sure maybe.

- Deport those that are here illegally. Oh freaking well.

- And of course pay those that are here legally a decent wage and treat them with respect.

So my next question is this - whom here wants to give citizenship to those that came here illegally and why?

I mean I want to live in the UK right? ... and I just want to work and pay taxes and be a productive person ... yet I cant. Well unless I got married that is. Even then I still must jump through hoops and it must be proven that we can support ourselves etc ...

(ya its a ramble)
DakotaT
14 years ago
I have a question for all the history buffs, why was the Spanish American war fought, what were the spoils, and was the confiscation of the American west lands more about the railroads and obtaining the Port of San Francisco than repelling a Mexican army?

Dulak, I think a blind eye might be turned to illegal immigration due to guilt than anything else.
UserPostedImage
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
14 years ago
I have little problem with amnesty, since I think the laws that make it "illegal" ought to, most of them anyway, be themselves illegal.

Sure, there need to be some checks to prevent criminals, terrorists, fifth columns, and similar, but in my opinion these are a trivially small fraction of those seeking to emigrate to the USA.

To be honest, I just don't understand the argument that the accident of our place of birth privileges us to say "you aren't worthy of our freedoms." *We* did nothing to get our citizenship (most of us) except be lucky enough to be born to parents who lived here. The accident of our birth doesn't give us the moral high ground.

Especially since if you look back just a generation or three, most of our families weren't here to start with.

But, say many, what about all those damn illegals who are coming to get the free government handouts for welfare, medical care, social services, education, yadda yadda yadda.

First of all, that, too, is grossly overdone. Sure, if you live in Brownsville, Texas, or San Diego, California, you're going to see more Hispanic welfare mothers than if you are in rural Iowa. Just as you're going to see more black welfare mothers on the south side of Chicago than if you live in South Iowa. Are we going to argue that we shouldn't allow blacks in this country because some welfare cheats happen to be black.

And, second, the problem is not that too many Hispanics are joining the welfare roles. The problem is that we treat welfare as an entitlement. That we hold out this country as a place where we support everyone cradle to grave.

Well, I'm sorry. If we're going to think that, we can't have it both ways. Either we give it to everyone who's here, regardless of what we think of the color of their skin or the physical piece of dirt their mother happened to be lying in when they first fell out of the birth canal, or we should stop the notion of such entitlements.

If you think the damn illegals don't deserve all the stuff they're "getting" when they get here, then you ought to stop giving it to your neighbors, too. Because your neighbors deserve it no more than they do.

A few years ago I went on a silence-and-contemplation retreat deep in South Texas, no more than 20 miles or so north of Brownsville. I was there for personal spiritual reasons, but I couldn't help noticing how economically depressing the area was. (The only way for me to reach the House of Prayer was by bus, and this was not a fancy tour coach!)

When I left to come back, I had like a 9 hour bus ride to get to San Antonio (two separate transfers in towns I have since forgotten). But before I started that trip, I had to wait for a couple extra hours outside this dusty convenience store -- turns out that the bus had been stopped by border control just outside brownsville to roust out some apparent illegals.

The other end of my bus trip was San Antonio, where I stayed in a posh hotel literally across the street from the Alamo. Complete with jacuzzi tub and top-line "amenities" in the bathroom. When I went downstairs to the bar -- I have this weird thing, I like hotel bars -- I was the only one in the bar.

For like five minutes. And then the bar got invaded by a bunch of affluent suburban Texas women. Turns out there was some cheerleading competition that weekend, and the hotel was full of high school cheerleader moms. All of them I'm sure educated in the best schools and living in the nicest neighborhoods with hubbies that worked in nice glass office buildings in Houston and Dallas and Austin.

Sight unseen, I would take the busload of uneducated, dirty, poor, unskilled illegals that got taken back to Mexico, and a hundred more busloads of them, over the whole lot of Texas bimbos and their husbands.

Because unlike the bimbos, those uneducated, dirty, poor, and unskilled have both the capacity and willingness to produce value. It might take them a year, or ten, or a generation, before all that value is realized, but it will be. Just as my grandparents produced more value than my immigrant great-grandparents.

Too many people see immigrants as "mouths to feed". When what they are is hands to make, arms to lift, and brains to think.

The more hands we have, arms we have, brains we have, the more we get, and the more we are.

And the more we say, "No, not here," the more we deprive ourselves.

The more we show ourselves ignorant and unworthy of our wealth and our opportunities.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
DakotaT
14 years ago
A hotel full of MILF bimbos, oh what should a single man do? I think we should let our resident West Coast expert Zombieslayer take a shot.
UserPostedImage
zombieslayer
14 years ago
I'll pass. I know the type Wade speaks of. Doesn't matter how nice they look. If you want to take an example of white privilege and someone who completely WASTES it....

Good rant by Dulak. I don't want everyone coming here. This is something Wade and I disagree on, but the #1 environmental problem today is not global warming or recycling or some other politically correct cause. It's overpopulation. The absolute last thing America needs is more uneducated 3rd world peasants.

California used to be gorgeous. Every year, we get more traffic and more urban sprawl; often in areas I used to photograph/hunt/fish in.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
DakotaT
14 years ago
I wonder what the Native Americans thought as the sailboats kept bringing all the unwanted pale faces? Zombie, I think you have a rather selfish attitude on this one, but I can't judge you for your position cause the only people invading ND are roughneckers for the oil patches. I don't know what it means to be inundated by unwanted people.
UserPostedImage
Cheesey
14 years ago
I heard Obama making fun of the fact that republicans want tighter security on our borders.
Ask the people in Texas and surrounding states if they think it's funny.

Let's face the facts.....Obama is playing to the latino audience, so that he will get their votes next election. That's ALL he cares about. The President should take border security as one of the highest priorities. Yet he makes light of it.
He wants to be "politically correct" over being the "bad guy" and protecting the legal citizens of this country.
UserPostedImage
Cheesey
14 years ago

I wonder what the Native Americans thought as the sailboats kept bringing all the unwanted pale faces? Zombie, I think you have a rather selfish attitude on this one, but I can't judge you for your position cause the only people invading ND are roughneckers for the oil patches. I don't know what it means to be inundated by unwanted people.

"DakotaT" wrote:


I don't think it's selfish at all.
I think all Zombie wants is for the people that want to be here to do so LEGALLY.
And that is EXACTLY as i want it. If they do it legally, i have NO problem with people from other countries coming here. But anyone that breaks the law to be here should be deported.
Why have laws if you don't intend to enforce them? Might as well just let anyone come in, and who CARES if they are criminals? At least that's the attitude of the current inhabitants of the White House.
UserPostedImage
DakotaT
14 years ago

I don't think it's selfish at all.
I think all Zombie wants is for the people that want to be here to do so LEGALLY.
And that is EXACTLY as i want it. If they do it legally, i have NO problem with people from other countries coming here. But anyone that breaks the law to be here should be deported.
Why have laws if you don't intend to enforce them? Might as well just let anyone come in, and who CARES if they are criminals? At least that's the attitude of the current inhabitants of the White House.

"Cheesey" wrote:



OK, well how about we throw all the contractors in prison then for using the illegals? This issue has more to do with harvesting our crops and doing all the shit work American borns deem beneath them. I have no problem with them signing the guestbook on the way in, but we need to hold everybody accountable for this problem.
UserPostedImage
Porforis
14 years ago

I don't think it's selfish at all.
I think all Zombie wants is for the people that want to be here to do so LEGALLY.
And that is EXACTLY as i want it. If they do it legally, i have NO problem with people from other countries coming here. But anyone that breaks the law to be here should be deported.
Why have laws if you don't intend to enforce them? Might as well just let anyone come in, and who CARES if they are criminals? At least that's the attitude of the current inhabitants of the White House.

"DakotaT" wrote:



OK, well how about we throw all the contractors in prison then for using the illegals? This issue has more to do with harvesting our crops and doing all the shit work American borns deem beneath them. I have no problem with them signing the guestbook on the way in, but we need to hold everybody accountable for this problem.

"Cheesey" wrote:



I'm all for throwing people that knowingly hired illegals in jail for at the very least tax evasion if people are being paid under the table. If they knowingly hired people with stolen social security information they're an accomplice to identity fraud.

The bottom line is, neither party wants to take the stance that they should take because neither party wants to give up their piece of the latino voting block. As with everything else in politics, it's not about doing what's best for the country, it's about self-serving politicians.
Fan Shout
dfosterf (24m) : That was your brother the GB press gazette referenced with the red cross draft props thing, yes?
Zero2Cool (2-Jul) : Packers gonna unveil new throwback helmet in few weeks.
Mucky Tundra (2-Jul) : I know it's Kleiman but this stuff writes itself
Mucky Tundra (2-Jul) : "Make sure she signs the NDA before asking for a Happy Ending!"
Mucky Tundra (2-Jul) : @NFL_DovKleiman Powerful: Deshaun Watson is taking Shedeur Sanders 'under his wing' as a mentor to the Browns QBs
Zero2Cool (30-Jun) : Dolphins get (back) Minkah Fitzpatrick in trade
Zero2Cool (30-Jun) : Steelers land Jalen Ramsey via Trade
dfosterf (26-Jun) : I think it would be great to have someone like Tom Grossi or Andy Herman on the Board of Directors so he/they could inform us
dfosterf (26-Jun) : Fair enough, WPR. Thing is, I have been a long time advocate to at least have some inkling of the dynamics within the board.
wpr (26-Jun) : 1st world owners/stockholders problems dfosterf.
Martha Careful (25-Jun) : I would have otherwise admirably served
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Also, no more provision for a write-in candidate, so Martha is off the table at least for this year
dfosterf (25-Jun) : You do have to interpret the boring fine print, but all stockholders all see he is on the ballot
dfosterf (25-Jun) : It also says he is subject to another ballot in 2028. I recall nothing of this nature with Murphy
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Ed Policy is on my ballot subject to me penciling him in as a no.
dfosterf (25-Jun) : I thought it used to be we voted for the whatever they called the 45, and then they voted for the seven, and then they voted for Mark Murphy
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Because I was too lazy to change my address, I haven't voted fot years until this year
dfosterf (25-Jun) : of the folks that run this team. I do not recall Mark Murphy being subject to our vote.
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Ed Policy yay or nay is on the pre-approved ballot that we always approve because we are uninformed and lazy, along with all the rest
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Weird question. Very esoteric. For stockholders. Also lengthy. Sorry. Offseason.
Zero2Cool (25-Jun) : Maybe wicked wind chill made it worse?
Mucky Tundra (25-Jun) : And then he signs with Cleveland in the offseason
Mucky Tundra (25-Jun) : @SharpFootball WR Diontae Johnson just admitted he refused to enter a game in 41° weather last year in Baltimore because he felt “ice cold”
Zero2Cool (24-Jun) : Yawn. Rodgers says he is "pretty sure" this be final season.
Zero2Cool (23-Jun) : PFT claims Packers are having extension talks with Zach Tom, Quay Walker.
Mucky Tundra (20-Jun) : GB-Minnesota 2004 Wild Card game popped up on my YouTube page....UGH
beast (20-Jun) : Hmm 🤔 re-signing Walker before Tom? Sounds highly questionable to me.
Mucky Tundra (19-Jun) : One person on Twitter=cannon law
Zero2Cool (19-Jun) : Well, to ONE person on Tweeter
Zero2Cool (19-Jun) : According to Tweeter
Zero2Cool (19-Jun) : Packers are working on extension for LT Walker they hope to have done before camp
dfosterf (18-Jun) : E4B landed at Andrews last night
dfosterf (18-Jun) : 101 in a 60
dfosterf (18-Jun) : FAFO
Zero2Cool (18-Jun) : one year $4m with incentives to make it up to $6m
dfosterf (18-Jun) : Or Lions
dfosterf (18-Jun) : Beats the hell out of a Vikings signing
Zero2Cool (18-Jun) : Baltimore Ravens now have signed former Packers CB Jaire Alexander.
dfosterf (14-Jun) : TWO magnificent strikes for touchdowns. Lose the pennstate semigeezer non nfl backup
dfosterf (14-Jun) : There was minicamp Thursday. My man Taylor Engersma threw
dfosterf (11-Jun) : There will be a mini camp practice Thursday.
Zero2Cool (11-Jun) : He's been sporting a ring for a while now. It's probably Madonna.
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : We only do the tea before whoopee, it relaxes me.
wpr (10-Jun) : That's awesome Martha.
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : How's the ayahuasca tea he makes, Martha?
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : Turns out he like older women
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : I wasn't supposed to say anything, but yes the word is out and we are happy 😂😂😂
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : I might be late on this but Aaron Rodgers is now married
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : Well he can always ask his brother for pointers
Zero2Cool (10-Jun) : Bo Melton taking some reps at CB as well as WR
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
2-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

2-Jul / Fantasy Sports Talk / dfosterf

1-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

29-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

25-Jun / Around The NFL / Martha Careful

23-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

20-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

20-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

20-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

18-Jun / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

16-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

15-Jun / Random Babble / Martha Careful

14-Jun / Around The NFL / beast

14-Jun / Community Welcome! / dfosterf

13-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.