all_about_da_packers
14 years ago

READ WHAT I SAID AGAIN.
I did NOT say "most Muslims are terrorists".
I SAID "MOST TERRORISTS ARE muslim".

"Cheesey" wrote:



You've been implying the former left, right, and center throughout this thread.

You've also been implying it is because their religion Islam condones and encourages these acts, that all Muslims are Terrorists.

Obviously you have never read the Qu'ran, instead choosing to regurgitate "facts" about their holy scripture which fit your argument. You even state that those denying these "facts" are doing so because of some conspiracy.

Honestly, I'm comforted by the fact that not many people are in positions of power in the government of your ilk. I agree with MPF totally, this is some of the clearest bigotry I've seen on the internet.
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Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago
I find myself shaking my head incredulously at some of the crap being spouted in this thread. Why don't we drag out the old standby that you don't offer a Muslim your left hand because that's the (bare) hand he wipes his ass with?

I have a lot to say, but I have to go mow the lawn, so I'll have to postpone it for now.

I'll leave you with this question: What does the word (jihad) actually mean? Not what does the American mass media say it means -- what does it mean to Muslims? That is to say, what does the Qur'an say jihad means?

I own a Qur'an and have read it, so don't try to bullshit your way through this.
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Tezzy
14 years ago

I find myself shaking my head incredulously at some of the crap being spouted in this thread. Why don't we drag out the old standby that you don't offer a Muslim your left hand because that's the (bare) hand he wipes his ass with?

I have a lot to say, but I have to go mow the lawn, so I'll have to postpone it for now.

I'll leave you with this question: What does the word (jihad) actually mean? Not what does the American mass media say it means -- what does it mean to Muslims? That is to say, what does the Qur'an say jihad means?

I own a Qur'an and have read it, so don't try to bullshit your way through this.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:




The word can actually mean many different types of struggles, one which happens to be holy war, and used by most to justify a certain position. Considering not all Muslim faiths even agree what the word should mean and how it should be part of the faith. Personally, I wish more people looked upon the word and lived by it like Ahmadiyya Islam.
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all_about_da_packers
14 years ago

I own a Qur'an and have read it, so don't try to bullshit your way through this.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



From what I have read of my father's work related to that issue, it means self-struggle. My father seemed to be of the opinion, from what I got out of his work, that it often symbolizes internal self-struggle.
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Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
14 years ago
actually, the problem appears to be young men.

:)

Or, perhaps, just perhaps, adolescence. (since the end of adolescence gets later and later these days)
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
doddpower
14 years ago

You don't see Christians or Jews going around the world blowing up innocent people. But the majority (not ALL, but the majority) of suicide and other bombings is done by WHAT group?
I think you all know the answer. But if i point it out i'll probably be called a racist.

"MassPackersFan" wrote:



Give me a break, Cheesey. You don't see Muslim countries militarily occupying Christian countries and destroying their infrastructure while murdering civilians and raping women either. Your point has more to do with power than anything else. Terrorism and guerrilla warfare are tactics of the desperate.

"Cheesey" wrote:



Agreed. Should I think that all Catholics are child molesters since a few perverts have done so?

Christians have NEVER done anything that bad . . . have they? (sarcasm).
digsthepack
14 years ago
Simply put, they have the RIGHT to build the mosque/outreach campus on the property they own. But, it is in very poor taste to do so....especially when the financiers are murky, and the main Imam is rather controversial, and an adherent of Sharia law. And, let us not overlook the fact that throughout history, Muslims HAVE built on/near the sites of their greatest victories. Whether you wish to admit it or not, there is vast symbolism for the Muslim people...particularly the terrorists amongst them....in the placement of this building.

My biggest gripe about the whole good Muslim/bad Muslim arguement...as simple as the analogy sounds....is the fact that they offer no significant input, or cooperation, in ridding the evil amongst themselves. To that end, I think they own some of the responsibility for problems that the darker elements of their faith practice.
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Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
14 years ago

That's a retarded argument cheesey.

Hundreds of people have been killed in The Troubles in Northern Ireland due to religion. And it's not like both of the sides are of completely different faith. They're both Christians, and they still kill each other, still perform terrorist attacks and still kill innocents.

Yet, not all christians are not terrorists, as you seem to imply in your latest post about muslims. Reality check time.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



Actually, the religion thing in Ireland is b.s. It's not about religion. It's about one group of people kicked off their own land and happen to be of a different religion.

Quick history lesson in Ireland. The Brits are the bad guys. They see land, they want it, they take it. English move into Ireland and guess what, they're Protestant. Irish tend to be Catholic.

So yes, from an outsider, it looks like a battle of religion. Historically though, it's the English moved in and took land from the Irish and the Irish simply want their land back.

It would be like if we said the Native Americans in the 1800s were fighting with the Americans because we were a different religion.

Cheesey has a point. Not all terrorists are Muslims. But most of them are. That's just a cold hard not politically correct fact.

In Thailand right now, the terrorists are in the South. Are they:
a) Buddhist,
b) Hindu,
c) Muslim

In the Philippines right now, there are a group of people who kidnap and chop off people's heads. They got a tourist boat recently and chopped off heads except for the 2 Americans who saw what's up and jumped overboard and swam to the shore (and survived). The others got their heads chopped off. In fact, the USA State Department advises Americans to stay away from Mindanao, where they have the terrorist problems.

Are the terrorists in that case:
a) Catholics,
b) Muslims,
c) Chinese nationalists

Well, I'll be damned.

That said, the vast majority of Muslims just want to get a job, raise their kids, and get the most out of life just like you and me. It's a small, but vocal minority that ruins it for everyone else. AND I'll even go as far to say that the main problem comes down to overpopulation anyways, which pisses off the Right wing when I say that because they got their heads so far up their asses that they'll completely deny that there are any environmental problems whatsoever.

But too many people and too few resources causes both war and terrorism. I don't see how any intelligent person can't understand that.

For the record, I have yet to meet a Muslim person, a Mormon, or a Quaker I didn't like. I've disliked plenty of people but never anyone in those 3 religions.

Let's cut out the political correctness everyone is equal bullshit because it's bullshit. Islam has terrorist problems. Islam has problems with how they treat women. Denying that is not being tolerant. It's being stupid.

That said, they have every Right to practice their religion that anyone else does in this country and in America, well over 99% of Muslims are NOT terrorists. I'll even go as far as saying I'd rather party with Muslims than Christians or especially Hindus as from experience, Muslims know how to have a good time. Other religions are too pent up to let loose. This is from personal experience.

The oil wars have begun. Water wars are next. Religion will be an excuse as good as any to kill over oil and water. That's what happens when you got too many people in the world.

"Packers_Finland" wrote:



Well said. +1
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago
Actually, one could make a solid argument -- both from observation and from historical events -- that it is in fact women in the Western world who have historically been treated poorly, while women in the Islamic world have been and continue to be treated like queens. The fact that women in the Islamic world are not treated as we happen to treat women does not mean they are mistreated; it merely means they are treated differently.

A feminist scholar once said -- and I agree with her -- that she would believe in the ancient oppression of women when she found evidence of a female revolution. None exists. If women were truly treated as poorly as we, in our arrogant contempt of our ancestors, chauvinistically like to tell ourselves, they would have revolted, just as women in the West did indeed eventually revolt. The fact is, they never did. In fact, the mere idea was so ludicrous to thinkers of the time that it was a subject of comedy. The play Lysistrata ("Army-Disbander") by Aristophanes, for example, centers around the efforts of Lysistrata to lead a sex strike. Basically, the women tell their men that they will refuse to sleep with them until they stop fighting their foolish wars. Of course, the punchline of the play is that the movement fails spectacularly, because the women find their men so sexy that they can't resist them -- and to a woman, they all rush back into their husbands' arms.

Likewise, there has never been a women's revolt in any Islamic country, not even the ones we point to as being the most oppressive (Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc.). The fact is that a lot of the practices we regard as "oppressive" are in fact promoted and enforced by the women themselves: veils, female circumcision (which the king of Saudi Arabia outlawed over the vociferous protests of his wives), etc. Indeed, in many Islamic countries, women are quite powerful: a recent vice-president of Iran was a woman, many women serve on the parliaments of both Iraq and Iran, and the list goes on. As one Saudi woman said to me, anyone who thinks Saudi women are oppressed has no clue how they live on a day-to-day basis. They get up when they want to, they go to the spa almost everyday, they get manicures and pedicures, they drive nice cars, they have maidservants, they don't have to work unless they want to, they have almost endless leisure.

In the early days of the Iraq war, it was not at all uncommon to see a woman walking unaccompanied down the streets of Baghdad in blue jeans. As the situation has deteriorated, however, they have been forced, for their own safety, to walk around in full niqab, accompanied at all times by men.

So I ask you, who has done the real oppression of women in that country?
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Packers_Finland
14 years ago
I like that nonstopdrivel dude as he has a fresh point of view on everything and constantly educates me on international affairs.
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