doddpower
14 years ago

Failing to meet expectations... what else would you call it?

Okay.. don't like bust.. then how about underachieving. ;)

"pack93z" wrote:



Failing to meet expectations is not what I call a bust. It's not living up to the hype, which is not desirable, but still could be much worse. The guy is a reliable player, fights through injuries, switches positions when necessary, etc. He might not be the best, but the coaches can depend on him.

I have heard your arguments many many times over the past few years. I agree with a lot of what you say, but obviously our definitions of "bust" are different. Hype is just what it is: hype. At this point, I would consider Justin Harrell a bust.
zombieslayer
14 years ago

Failing to meet expectations... what else would you call it?

Okay.. don't like bust.. then how about underachieving. ;)

"pack93z" wrote:



OK, I'm fine with underachieving.

Thanks for defining what you say bust but keep in mind that most people would argue with your definition (and for once, I'd take the majority opinion on something). By your definition of bust, half the first round picks drafted would be busts.
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Pack93z
14 years ago

By your definition of bust, half the first round picks drafted would be busts.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



And I would happen to agree. Go through the last couple of seasons.. there are players a heck of a lot worse that Hawk and greater busts, but all of them to some degree or another failed to due what they were drafted to do.

If you are drafted in the first round, the expectations are higher thus the compensation is higher.. and the plain truth of it is most first rounders don't meet their expectations.. I have no doubt about that.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Packers_Finland
14 years ago
No matter how high he was drafted, a 5-year starter who doens't completely suck is not a bust in my book.
This is a placeholder
Zero2Cool
14 years ago
lol Hawk isn't a bust, no he's not an elite LB, but no one predicted him to be one coming out of college. Correction, I didn't hear anyone say he would be elite. I heard Hawk was a above average talent that had a low ceiling and was a safe pick. That whomever drafted him, knew what they were getting.

We knew not to expect Lawrence Taylor so when he doesn't live up to that, you can't call him a bust ... in MY book... which has lots of pictures cuz words confuse me.
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Pack93z
14 years ago
Whom expected Hawk to be a Taylor type?

Yes we was labeled a safe pick.. because you would get production from him and we have.. no one is saying he hasn't.

That was a piss poor draft overall.. and we are lucky we don't have a major bust on our hands.. agreed.

But Hawk has not played up to his talent.. and that isn't because the talent itself is there.. personally it is on the mental side of the game and I have to believe, when we see others there as well, the positional coaching.

Go watch some footage of Hawk in college vs the pro.. he doesn't look like the same player.. in college he attacked.. here he reacts.

And that is where the disappointment in his game comes in.. and where he hasn't lived up to expectations.

Call it what you want.. maybe it is fear of the word bust.. but even the coaches tell you he has to turn it loose and play more aggressively..
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Zero2Cool
14 years ago
I'm no expert, but I do agree that Hawk hesitates before attacking, which often leaves him out of place.
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doddpower
14 years ago

Whom expected Hawk to be a Taylor type?

Yes we was labeled a safe pick.. because you would get production from him and we have.. no one is saying he hasn't.

That was a piss poor draft overall.. and we are lucky we don't have a major bust on our hands.. agreed.

But Hawk has not played up to his talent.. and that isn't because the talent itself is there.. personally it is on the mental side of the game and I have to believe, when we see others there as well, the positional coaching.

Go watch some footage of Hawk in college vs the pro.. he doesn't look like the same player.. in college he attacked.. here he reacts.

And that is where the disappointment in his game comes in.. and where he hasn't lived up to expectations.

Call it what you want.. maybe it is fear of the word bust.. but even the coaches tell you he has to turn it loose and play more aggressively..

"pack93z" wrote:



I agree he may look like a different player, but one must remember that the NFL is essentially a different game. Everyone's faster, stronger, and smarter. I don't think there is anyway to quantify these aspects of the NFL vs. Hawks college performance.
Wade
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14 years ago
"Bust" -- an area where doubleD is overrated and A is accurate.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Lynn_Dickey
14 years ago

Do I feel sorry for Harrell? No not really for reasons already stated.

However, there is a difference between Tony Mandarich and Justin Harrell. Harrell has been hurt. He hasn't seen the field, but when he's on the field, I've seen more out of him than C.J. Wilson or Jarius Wynn.

Mandarich was a complete bust. He couldn't cut it as a LT. He ended up in Indy as a guard and was alright for awhile, but there is a difference between the two players. One is a bust because of skill and the other is a bust because of injury.

I pretty much agree with what CaliforniaCheez said.

I think they'll keep six or seven DL. Seven with Toribio, who I've been impressed enough with to keep on the team. Right now, you can only justify Wilson or Wynn above Harrell because of injuries/confidence.

"Lynn_Dickey" wrote:


THe point wasn't that they were the same type of player, the point was that I am sick of excuses when the truth is obvous. Harrell gets hurt a lot!!! FACT. McCarthy says you need to be available and accountable. Harrell has not been available and there are tons of excuses why not. (I will forgive the wife/baby thing). I am willing to bet that Harrell either won't make the 53 man roster, or will get hurt so that he is not available for 8 games or more. If I am wrong, I will leave this forum. If I am right, you will all have to post that Lynn Dickey was the best deep throwing QB the pack has ever had!!!!!! Ahhhh '82 was a fun year!!!

"porky88" wrote:


Well I guess I can come back now. Please look at Harrell without emotion, when you do, you will see that it was wrong to believe he would make it through a season. Now look at Bush without emotion. He is not very good. Sorry
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beast (1h) : Yeah, but also some of the wording suggestions Jax only pranked called the QB, not the others... and if he had an open spreadsheet & 3 calls
beast (2h) : Thank goodness he's not leaving the Turtle in the Red Tide
Mucky Tundra (2h) : Cowboys 1st round pick Tyler Booker will indeed be bringing his pet turtle to Dallas with him
Mucky Tundra (2h) : that contained all prospects info and contact
Mucky Tundra (2h) : beast, according the Falcons statement Jax came across it on an ipad. If I had to guess, probably an open spread sheet or something
Zero2Cool (2h) : Simmons put up an emoji with cheese.
beast (3h) : Not sure anyone is interested in Isaiah Simmons... Collin Oliver might of taken his potential slot
beast (3h) : I'm going with Jax Ulbrich is not telling the whole truth... he accidentally came across it? Why would a defensive coordinator have a QB #?
Zero2Cool (4h) : He's not that great, but final piece of the script.\
Zero2Cool (4h) : If we add Isaiah Simmons, book your Super Bowl tickets
Mucky Tundra (4h) : Colts 1st round TE Tyler Warren also got prank called, was that Jax Ulbrich as well?
Zero2Cool (4h) : Jax Ulbrich, Jeff Ulbrich’s son, released an apology for his role in the Shedeur Sanders prank call.
Martha Careful (4h) : apparently he did not participate in practice or play on the east west shrine game nor the NFL combine. The kid was a mediocre spoiled brat
Mucky Tundra (4h) : Yeah that one that was a super wounded duck that Sanders supporters are highlighting to prove a point
Zero2Cool (5h) : Shough is the guy who missed guys at combine isn't he?
beast (5h) : It's not official until I'm dead! I have a chance still! (Not really)
Mucky Tundra (14h) : I could feel my body decomposing in real time when I read that
Mucky Tundra (14h) : @MIKEYSAINRISTIL Tyler Shough will officially be the last person drafted to the NFL born in the 1900’s
Mucky Tundra (26-Apr) : saw the tweet, he meant the city
Mucky Tundra (26-Apr) : Was that for the team or the city?
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter · 3m Draft grade is in: Green Bay gets an A. The people, the city, the venue were all superb. NFL Draft’s next
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : Matt LaFleur says Jaire Alexander is participating in #Packers offseason program, which has been conducted virtually during this first week
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : ✅ ...
buckeyepackfan (26-Apr) : Check
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : Matthew Golden cahanged 81 to 22??
TheKanataThrilla (26-Apr) : Sam Howell to Vikings...guess no Aaron
Martha Careful (26-Apr) : 1 round 7 min, with one extra minute if there is a trade. 2nd round 4 minutes, 3rd -3, 2 thereafter IMO
Martha Careful (26-Apr) : Agree
dfosterf (26-Apr) : Great idea imo
dfosterf (26-Apr) : 1st round to 7 minutes with one extension
dfosterf (26-Apr) : NFL comissioner wants to shorten the 2st
Mucky Tundra (26-Apr) : @jalenreagors They’re discussing if Sheduer can go back to college on NFL Network LMFAOOOOO
beast (26-Apr) : Great point Martha
beast (26-Apr) : Buddy Ryan used to say if a candy bar goes missing, there are two to blame, Rex and Rob 🤪 jk 😁
Martha Careful (26-Apr) : Bum Phillips used to say there are two ways to get better. Get better players or get players to play better. We have a new DL coach
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : Yes. Look at the losses last year. They can win.
beast (26-Apr) : Can Packers win with their current DL?
bboystyle (26-Apr) : waiting for a pass rusher.
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 5 minutes between picks in the 3rd
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 3rd. Hate this phone
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 4rd
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 5 minutes in the 4
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 7 minutes between picks in the 2nd round
Martha Careful (25-Apr) : Sorry to bitch, but the headline writers in that section absolutely mislead, or don't know how to read. It is maddening
Martha Careful (25-Apr) : No thanks. Not a dependable guy to be in the right place and run the right route. Dumb as a box of rocks.
Zero2Cool (25-Apr) : Losing 2nd round pick for a one year rental, not ideal. Especially a headcase.
TheKanataThrilla (25-Apr) : Pickens for Jaire may be interesting. Definitely not sure we want Pickens long term.
dfosterf (25-Apr) : No.Absolutely not
Zero2Cool (25-Apr) : NO NO NO NO NO NO!!1 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬
dhazer (25-Apr) : scenario: Our main prospects are off the board when our pick comes around, do we just throw a 2nd round pick at Pittsburgh for Pickens
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