zombieslayer
14 years ago



You know, I've been the biggest component of re-signing Kampman. But there are two fronts that need to be covered:

1) Mike McCarthy said this week that the biggest improvement from year 1 to year 2 of a 3-4 switch is the Pass Rush. I have not bothered to research that statement, but I think it is interesting because it implies if we bring the exact same team, results in terms of pass rush will improve. Kampy may well represent such a possible improvement by simply being more used to and comfortable in a 3-4.

2) In terms of blitzes, it is highly unlikely that Capers will blitz 75% of the time. That is to say, he will likely send 4 rushers, with blitzes thrown in occasionally. For a moment, let's assume Kampman is back. Him and Mathews are clearly the top two OLB. If you send Kampman in base package, then you have to drop Mathews. Vice versa is also true. We may end up having to decide between the two, and frankly based on production thus far I'd prefer to send Mathews more so than Kampman.

So then Kampman may not be utilized in doing what he does best: applying pressure on the QB.

Not to say we shouldn't sign Kampy. The fact is that we'll need to evaluate our talent real hard, and figure out what course of direction we want to take. We need the right personnel for this scheme just as much as solid game planning from Capers.

"all_about_da_packers" wrote:



AADP - OK, I'm going to show my ignorance here but I'll say it anyways. I know O. I don't know D. Why can't we send both CM3 & Kampy? Can't we make adjustments in 3rd and 5+ situations where CM3, Kampy, and Jenkins (+1 or 2 other people) are all rushing the opposing QB?
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Rockmolder
14 years ago



You know, I've been the biggest component of re-signing Kampman. But there are two fronts that need to be covered:

1) Mike McCarthy said this week that the biggest improvement from year 1 to year 2 of a 3-4 switch is the Pass Rush. I have not bothered to research that statement, but I think it is interesting because it implies if we bring the exact same team, results in terms of pass rush will improve. Kampy may well represent such a possible improvement by simply being more used to and comfortable in a 3-4.

2) In terms of blitzes, it is highly unlikely that Capers will blitz 75% of the time. That is to say, he will likely send 4 rushers, with blitzes thrown in occasionally. For a moment, let's assume Kampman is back. Him and Mathews are clearly the top two OLB. If you send Kampman in base package, then you have to drop Mathews. Vice versa is also true. We may end up having to decide between the two, and frankly based on production thus far I'd prefer to send Mathews more so than Kampman.

So then Kampman may not be utilized in doing what he does best: applying pressure on the QB.

Not to say we shouldn't sign Kampy. The fact is that we'll need to evaluate our talent real hard, and figure out what course of direction we want to take. We need the right personnel for this scheme just as much as solid game planning from Capers.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



AADP - OK, I'm going to show my ignorance here but I'll say it anyways. I know O. I don't know D. Why can't we send both CM3 & Kampy? Can't we make adjustments in 3rd and 5+ situations where CM3, Kampy, and Jenkins (+1 or 2 other people) are all rushing the opposing QB?

"all_about_da_packers" wrote:



We can. We usually rush both LBs in our 2-4-5 package. The problem comes with the base package.

Asuming that we will bring 4 people most of the time, that'll leave us with 1 OLB dropping back in coverage, while the 2 DEs, 1 NT and 1 OLB will be blitzing the QB.

You obviously have to make a choice who you want to rush more, asuming that you want your best guy rushing, and at this point, that'd be Matthews.

The biggest problem I have is that Matthews won't be a Merriman or Ware. He's a good rusher, but he fits the mold of a Spencer so much better. Someone who can apply pressure, but is also the first one to drop back in coverage.

Even a bigger problem is that Kampman won't become that Merriman or Ware type player, either.

If you ask me, we need to draft someone. Maybe not even in the first round, although Hughes would be nice, and just try to go with what we have right now. Maybe send some more 5 man blitzes, get a little creative with D-linemen dropping into coverage, have Kampman and Matthews split coverage duties. Anything to try to hide and overcome these weaknesses a bit.
PackFanWithTwins
14 years ago

4 big loses, and 4 identically lame defensive game plans. We didn't get to Favre, Ben or Warner. All of them games to me seemed like we dialed the blitzes way back and when we do that, we never get pressure.

I am a live by the sword die by the sword guy. I would rather get beat with aggressive play than being soft. I don't even recall a double A gap blitz against AZ. I know Warner and Favre are great at beating the blitz, well they are pretty good at throwing when they have all day to.

IMO Capers needs to get more creative.

"all_about_da_packers" wrote:




The more I look back at the Vikings game, the more I think it was a simple matter of growing pains. I understand where Capers was coming from: stopping AP first. I can live with that. The problem is, that once AP was stopped, Capers didn't trust his players to keep Peterson on a leash. Hence, he played run first all the way. Part of that is obviously AP's talent. But at some point, he should have gone after Favre.

Versus the Cards and Steelers, I have to wonder if it was the talent at fault. Specifically, I wonder if the execution was just (really) poor.Perhaps that speaks to a lack of talent suited to Cover 2 (Safety, CB lower on the depth chart like Bush). This may speak to a lack of trust by Capers in his talent... simply because he didn't feel like he had capable talent.

But in terms of telling Capers to get more creative... I have to think he starts utilizing more of his extensive playbook we heard about next year.....

"PackFanWithTwins" wrote:



I can agree with that. Things like the psycho were great the first time, but offenses quickly adjusted to it. And it seems like it was never used differently. Always overloaded a side, and blitzing that side. Never an overload and then drop and blitz the opposite after the Oline adjusted blocking.

I do expect him to unleash more, I was just really disappointed that I didn't see him try things when the defense was getting destroyed. Give him a better LOLB and along with development of Raji and hopefully a S/LB that can cover shallow center.
The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
gopackgo212
14 years ago
I look at it like this -

We were the #1 penalized team in the league for most of the year
We had no offensive line for the first half of the year
We had a kicker who feel apart as the season went on

And...

We beat 2 playoff teams who are playing in the divisional round this week?
And finished 11-5?

We also finished with the best turnover ratio by a MILE in all of football.

So clearly, we have an above average defense that's doing something right. I think losing Harris and Kampy were a big reason why our D played so bad vs. Pittsburgh and Arizona. I mean, it may not seem like much, but maybe if Kampy was able to pressure Warner just a little bit more, he would have struggled just a little bit more, or maybe even better it could have forced a fluke turnover. Same can be said if Harris was in coverage. And perhaps the Packers beat the Cards 38-28 instead of losing 51-45. And Mike and Mike don't bother to rant about the Packers D.

Not to worry guys, with Caper's first year in Green Bay under his belt, I feel like our already above average defense is only going to improve from here. And with Ted in charge and Aaron at the helm, the Packers are going to be a very competitive team for a long time 😃
zombieslayer
14 years ago
Oh, it's clear we're above average on D. We're just not elite. Our D can't stop the big boys but it beats the crap out of average and lesser teams.

I do believe it will improve. I think a lot of our mistakes were newbie mistakes. Next year, we'll have less of them.

And I do think we'll be a perennial Playoff team.

Thanks AADP for that explanation.
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Cheesey
14 years ago
If our D didn't get all those turnovers, we would have lost several more games. Teams were moving the ball on us, and we would get the turnover. You can't depend on that happening all the time. Yes, they are great when they happen, but if they don't happen, you end up like we did in the playoff game, torn apart.
Our schedule will be harder next year too.
So we NEED some upgrades on D and on the O-line.
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ILikeThePackers39
14 years ago

So the question becomes, what changes do we do in the offseason to generate more of a pass rush?

These are my ideas:
1) We keep Kampy, but we play a more hybrid 3-4/4-3 where on pass situations, Kampy lines up on the line as a DE
2) If we lose Kampy, then we'll need another solid pass rusher to get sacks. Right now, we got CM3 and that's it. Jenkins was #2 on the team with 4.5. That's not enough. We need more sacks as a team.

So if #2 happens, we need to add some pass rushers via draft or FA. Too much time is killing us.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



I'd love to see Kampy come back. He WAS rushing the passer well this year - he was second in QB hits, even with the time he missed. He wasn't getting home as much as we're used to, but he was effective.

That said, if he doesn't want to stick with the 3-4, then I'd like to see them give him an opportunity to go somewhere else. Tag him, find a team that will work for him and the Packers, and trade him. NOTE: This what I would like to see them do - I'm not saying anyone owes it to him to do so, I'm not making some moral statement. Just my preference.

If he stays, I say you continue the transition - I see the logic in your hybrid idea, but I'd rather not stray from the strength of the 3-4 (confusion, unpredictable) to attempt to cater to his earlier strength. I truly believe he can be effective in the scheme, and Jones allows for some mixing at that position if you need a little more athleticism.

If he goes, I agree that they need to acquire a good rush LB to replace him - Sergio Kindle or Jerry Hughes are the main draft prospects I can think of (though I'm sure there's potential in later rounds). Free Agency doesn't seem to hold anything that's sure-fire, though I'll admit I haven't done a lot of research on that position.

Bottom line, if he wants to stay I hope they sign him up. If he doesn't, they need to get the best deal (for them and him) possible and move him.
blank
PackerTraxx
14 years ago
So we beat one good team. To me that indicates we need improvement on defense with execution and personnell. It's like the team that finishes very high in pass defense because everybody rushes for 200 yds against them. Statistics can be very misleading. Bad teams made mistakes against us, good teams didn't. I believe, besides improving, we still need another lineman(DE), a strong safety and cornerback to breakout on D to be elite.
Why is Jerry Kramer not in the Hall of Fame?
zombieslayer
14 years ago
Heh. Just realized I thanked the wrong person. Thanks Rockmolder.

ILike - Agreed.
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