Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
15 years ago

I don't blame Ted Thompson for taking Raji either.

My problem is that he's been here, what, 5 years?

And the OL is, clearly, and has been since his arrival, substantially and consistently worse than it was before his arrival.

It's not one decision that bothers me. It's not this one player who hasn't developed or that one who was not acquired or the other one who was let go. It's the fact that we are five years in (four if you're counting McCarthy years and not Thompson years) and WE STILL HAVE A FUCKING LINE THAT IS BARELY SERVICABLE ON ITS GOOD DAYS. And its that, IMO, we are STILL, assuming that Ted Thompson, Mike McCarthy, and company do everything right this offseason in the draft, looking to AT LEAST 2011 before we have a line that is more than serviceable.

AND THAT PISSES ME OFF.

"dfosterf" wrote:



You can't be two places at once, Wade...What the fuck is he gonna do?

Listen, FA sucked last year...

Whaddya want, a Hayensworth? A Peppers?

I wanted a Faneca-- Packer world was busy with a Moss.


I don't know who was right on that one.


Retirement sucks for a Packer zealot.

"Wade" wrote:



He's the effing GM. If he can't put together an OL in 5 years, he's failed IMO.

I've been crying for FA attention to OL since he left Rivera go (which I supported) and Wahle go (which I didn't). I've been crying for high round attention to OL in the draft for the same period. I've been, well, crying a lot. :)

When I complained about Wahle, people said "you can't mortgage the future". Whenever I said how about this free agent (e.g. Hutchinson, Faneca, Leonard Davis, etc etc etc), I got accused of being Dan Snyder.
Well, we're in the future and we're debt free and we're not Dan Snyder. Hoo-rah.

It's like educatiion here in Iowa. We keep bragging about how our schools are so great and how are test scores are so damn good, how we're better than .... all the goddam horrible schools in Mississippi or California or wherever. And we're no closer than we were 5 years ago to changing our own mediocrity.

And I'm supposed to have faith in the current "education experts"?

And I'm supposed to have faith in Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy to get done what they haven't been able to get done in 4-5 years?

I haven't called for Ted Thompson to be fired, and I haven't called for Mike McCarthy to be fired. But whatever else they have going for them, they are effing lousy at putting together the kind of OL a dominant team needs.

Because, unlike some, I'm not going to see a "wild card" appearance as a "good performance" in year 5 (for Thompson) or year four (for McCarthy). Before and in the early weeks of the 2007 season I said n that other board) that my criteria for success for Thompson was a playoff victory or I would start complaining more vociferously. Of course 2007 saw the team just a overtime INT away from the big dance, and so I had to say, "Wade, better shut up now."

But it's now midway through 2009, and that second half of 2007 (remember, the team had zero running game and lots of problems in the first half of the 2007 season) is looking more and more like the "outlier" in a story of continuing mediocrity.

And does so despite a quarterback I'm a lot more excited about than I was about another QB in *his* second year as a starter, despite the best team of WRs the packers have had since...well, since I can remember, and I remember the Dowler/Dale/Fleming years, despite a lot of good players on D, etc.

I just believe that without a top OL (not just a servicable OL, but an above average one), the likelihood that this team will go deep into the playoffs is slim. And despite 5 years of Ted Thompson and 4 years of TT, the best we can hope for in short run (i.e. 2010 as well as rest of this year) is servicable.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
dfosterf
15 years ago

I don't blame Ted Thompson for taking Raji either.

My problem is that he's been here, what, 5 years?

And the OL is, clearly, and has been since his arrival, substantially and consistently worse than it was before his arrival.

It's not one decision that bothers me. It's not this one player who hasn't developed or that one who was not acquired or the other one who was let go. It's the fact that we are five years in (four if you're counting McCarthy years and not Thompson years) and WE STILL HAVE A FUCKING LINE THAT IS BARELY SERVICABLE ON ITS GOOD DAYS. And its that, IMO, we are STILL, assuming that Ted Thompson, Mike McCarthy, and company do everything right this offseason in the draft, looking to AT LEAST 2011 before we have a line that is more than serviceable.

AND THAT PISSES ME OFF.

"Wade" wrote:



You can't be two places at once, Wade...What the fuck is he gonna do?

Listen, FA sucked last year...

Whaddya want, a Hayensworth? A Peppers?

I wanted a Faneca-- Packer world was busy with a Moss.


I don't know who was right on that one.


Retirement sucks for a Packer zealot.

"dfosterf" wrote:



He's the effing GM. If he can't put together an OL in 5 years, he's failed IMO.

I've been crying for FA attention to OL since he left Rivera go (which I supported) and Wahle go (which I didn't). I've been crying for high round attention to OL in the draft for the same period. I've been, well, crying a lot. :)

When I complained about Wahle, people said "you can't mortgage the future". Whenever I said how about this free agent (e.g. Hutchinson, Faneca, Leonard Davis, etc etc etc), I got accused of being Dan Snyder.
Well, we're in the future and we're debt free and we're not Dan Snyder. Hoo-rah.

It's like educatiion here in Iowa. We keep bragging about how our schools are so great and how are test scores are so damn good, how we're better than .... all the goddam horrible schools in Mississippi or California or wherever. And we're no closer than we were 5 years ago to changing our own mediocrity.

And I'm supposed to have faith in the current "education experts"?

And I'm supposed to have faith in Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy to get done what they haven't been able to get done in 4-5 years?

I haven't called for Ted Thompson to be fired, and I haven't called for Mike McCarthy to be fired. But whatever else they have going for them, they are effing lousy at putting together the kind of OL a dominant team needs.

Because, unlike some, I'm not going to see a "wild card" appearance as a "good performance" in year 5 (for Thompson) or year four (for McCarthy). Before and in the early weeks of the 2007 season I said n that other board) that my criteria for success for Thompson was a playoff victory or I would start complaining more vociferously. Of course 2007 saw the team just a overtime INT away from the big dance, and so I had to say, "Wade, better shut up now."

But it's now midway through 2009, and that second half of 2007 (remember, the team had zero running game and lots of problems in the first half of the 2007 season) is looking more and more like the "outlier" in a story of continuing mediocrity.

And does so despite a quarterback I'm a lot more excited about than I was about another QB in *his* second year as a starter, despite the best team of WRs the packers have had since...well, since I can remember, and I remember the Dowler/Dale/Fleming years, despite a lot of good players on D, etc.

I just believe that without a top OL (not just a servicable OL, but an above average one), the likelihood that this team will go deep into the playoffs is slim. And despite 5 years of Ted Thompson and 4 years of Ted Thompson, the best we can hope for in short run (i.e. 2010 as well as rest of this year) is servicable.

"Wade" wrote:



Maybe this guy is smarter than us.

The possibility exists.

Good answers, btw :thumbleft:
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
15 years ago

I don't blame Ted Thompson for taking Raji either.

My problem is that he's been here, what, 5 years?

And the OL is, clearly, and has been since his arrival, substantially and consistently worse than it was before his arrival.

It's not one decision that bothers me. It's not this one player who hasn't developed or that one who was not acquired or the other one who was let go. It's the fact that we are five years in (four if you're counting McCarthy years and not Thompson years) and WE STILL HAVE A FUCKING LINE THAT IS BARELY SERVICABLE ON ITS GOOD DAYS. And its that, IMO, we are STILL, assuming that Ted Thompson, Mike McCarthy, and company do everything right this offseason in the draft, looking to AT LEAST 2011 before we have a line that is more than serviceable.

AND THAT PISSES ME OFF.

"dfosterf" wrote:



You can't be two places at once, Wade...What the fuck is he gonna do?

Listen, FA sucked last year...

Whaddya want, a Hayensworth? A Peppers?

I wanted a Faneca-- Packer world was busy with a Moss.


I don't know who was right on that one.


Retirement sucks for a Packer zealot.

"Wade" wrote:



He's the effing GM. If he can't put together an OL in 5 years, he's failed IMO.

I've been crying for FA attention to OL since he left Rivera go (which I supported) and Wahle go (which I didn't). I've been crying for high round attention to OL in the draft for the same period. I've been, well, crying a lot. :)

When I complained about Wahle, people said "you can't mortgage the future". Whenever I said how about this free agent (e.g. Hutchinson, Faneca, Leonard Davis, etc etc etc), I got accused of being Dan Snyder.
Well, we're in the future and we're debt free and we're not Dan Snyder. Hoo-rah.

It's like educatiion here in Iowa. We keep bragging about how our schools are so great and how are test scores are so damn good, how we're better than .... all the goddam horrible schools in Mississippi or California or wherever. And we're no closer than we were 5 years ago to changing our own mediocrity.

And I'm supposed to have faith in the current "education experts"?

And I'm supposed to have faith in Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy to get done what they haven't been able to get done in 4-5 years?

I haven't called for Ted Thompson to be fired, and I haven't called for Mike McCarthy to be fired. But whatever else they have going for them, they are effing lousy at putting together the kind of OL a dominant team needs.

Because, unlike some, I'm not going to see a "wild card" appearance as a "good performance" in year 5 (for Thompson) or year four (for McCarthy). Before and in the early weeks of the 2007 season I said n that other board) that my criteria for success for Thompson was a playoff victory or I would start complaining more vociferously. Of course 2007 saw the team just a overtime INT away from the big dance, and so I had to say, "Wade, better shut up now."

But it's now midway through 2009, and that second half of 2007 (remember, the team had zero running game and lots of problems in the first half of the 2007 season) is looking more and more like the "outlier" in a story of continuing mediocrity.

And does so despite a quarterback I'm a lot more excited about than I was about another QB in *his* second year as a starter, despite the best team of WRs the packers have had since...well, since I can remember, and I remember the Dowler/Dale/Fleming years, despite a lot of good players on D, etc.

I just believe that without a top OL (not just a servicable OL, but an above average one), the likelihood that this team will go deep into the playoffs is slim. And despite 5 years of Ted Thompson and 4 years of Ted Thompson, the best we can hope for in short run (i.e. 2010 as well as rest of this year) is servicable.

"dfosterf" wrote:



Maybe this guy is smarter than us.

The possibility exists.

Good answers, btw :thumbleft:

"Wade" wrote:



Smarter than me is easy. I'm not a dumb guy, but I know lots of disgustingly smart people (college faculties are full of them), people who make me look like, well, pocket lint.

I want someone who makes me eat my criticism. Not someone who keeps giving me ammo year after year. 🙂
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
packfan4
15 years ago
http://profootballfocus.com/by_position.php?tab=by_position&season=2009&pos=G&stype=r&runpass=&teamid=-1&numsnaps=75&numgames=1 

I don't think this Offensive Line is that far away at all, and I think we definately need to solve our LT situation this offseason. Campen is almost certainly the problem, not the talent of our guys. We have seen marginal progress(at best) of this unit and he has to be the fall guy this offseason. One reason I am REALLY in favor of bringing Jeff Fisher on board is because he would almost certainly bring the best Offensive Line coach in the NFL with him, Mike Munchak.
UserPostedImage
gijoe82
15 years ago
http://profootballfocus.com/by_position.php?tab=by_position&season=2009&pos=G&stype=r&runpass=&teamid=-1&numsnaps=75&numgames=1 

I don't think this Offensive Line is that far away at all, and I think we definately need to solve our LT situation this offseason. Campen is almost certainly the problem, not the talent of our guys. We have seen marginal progress(at best) of this unit and he has to be the fall guy this offseason. One reason I am REALLY in favor of bringing Jeff Fisher on board is because he would almost certainly bring the best Offensive Line coach in the NFL with him, Mike Munchak.



+1 Good thoughts, how about one more scenario, Colledge moves to RT and Lang moves to LG. We would only need a quality LT at that point.
I do like the looks of Lang too. His foot work seems to be sound and he is surely a better run blocker than clifton ever was allready.
blank
porky88
15 years ago
I have no problem with the Raji pick. He's the future at nose tackle.

As far as Lang. I too think he's a right tackle and it has more to do with his physical attributes rather than his technique. I think he does everything you want in a left tackle, but his short arms limit him and he can't handle a bull rush quite as you would like. I also believe that your left tackle should be or have the potential to be one of the five best players on your football team when building a team. I think Lang has a chance to be solid, but not that good.

I think he has a future at RT, but for this season, Mark Tauscher and Chad Clifton should be the starting tackles when healthy.
musccy
15 years ago
PFWT made a good point about M.M. seemingly switching schemes mid voyage which puts T.T. in a tough spot. I'm not defending T.T. entirely, it's his responsibility to make sure the team is covered on all fronts

HOWEVER

We were all crying a lot about the DL/run D 12 months ago, and there is no doubt that has dramatically improved and appears likely only to continue to improve given the youth/potential of that group. Point being, Ted Thompson did address it in the offseason.

I'm not ecstatic that T.T. et al pitifully miscalculated our depth/talent at the tackles, what clift could do, etc. however, (call me nuts) I'm fairly confident that it will be adequatenly addressed this upcoming draft.
Zero2Cool
15 years ago

Drew Rosenhaus seemed to be warming up to what he sees as the biggest issue in Buffalo.

"The offensive line, I believe, is potentially the worst in the NFL. Especially at the tackle position, they got rid of almost every starter from last year, banked on revamping it . . . It's absolutely shocking how that offensive line play has prohibited them from being an effective offense."



lol Jamon on on one of the worst lines in the league, especially at Tackle?
UserPostedImage
Rockmolder
15 years ago

Drew Rosenhaus seemed to be warming up to what he sees as the biggest issue in Buffalo.

"The offensive line, I believe, is potentially the worst in the NFL. Especially at the tackle position, they got rid of almost every starter from last year, banked on revamping it . . . It's absolutely shocking how that offensive line play has prohibited them from being an effective offense."

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



lol Jamon on on one of the worst lines in the league, especially at Tackle?



He's raw. We knew that. You just don't try to put someone with so much potential on the PS, if you ask me. Let him cruise along for a while. We really didn't need Swain on the roster when we made those cuts. Or Hall/Kuhn.

We'll see where he'll go in the future. I don't know if throwing him in there is the right approach, but we'll see.
nerdmann
15 years ago

I have been fairly impressed with Lang in his limited time, but he is not a LT. Keep him there for the rest of the season, with Tauscher taking over on the Right, and Spitz back at Center. Leave that for the 2nd half. Then this offseason make the move.

LT and LG need to be replaced. I am not really down on Colledge, but we can upgrade him. So we have a new Left side next year, with Spitz,Sitton,Lang on the right. Put them three together, and we can have some pass protection and I really see them opening up some nice holes on the right.

"PackFanWithTwins" wrote:




I think they really blew it putting Meredith on the PS but keeping Giacomini. Giacomini hasn't done squat, but Meredith's starting and looking good, apparently.
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    bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes its possible but unlikely. If we do get the 5th, we face the NFCS winner
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ahh, ok.
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes due to tie breaker
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I mean, unlikely, yes, but mathematically, 5th is possible by what I'm reading.
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : If Vikings lose out, Packers win out, Packers get 5th, right?
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : Minny isnt going to lose out so 5th seed is out of the equation. We are playing for the 6th or 7th seed which makes no difference
    Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, the ad revenue goes to the broadcast company but they gotta pay to air the game on their channel/network
    beast (23-Dec) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th
    beast (23-Dec) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed
    Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno
    beast (23-Dec) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?
    packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I see what you did there Mucky
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : dammit. 3:25pm
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm
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    beast (23-Dec) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue
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    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.
    packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : ok I stand corrected
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ok, yes, you are right. I see that now how they get 7th
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : 5th - Packers win out, Vikings lose out. Maybe?
    beast (23-Dec) : Saying no to the 6th lock.
    beast (23-Dec) : No, with the Commanders beating the Eagles, Packers could have a good chance of 6th or 7th unless the win out
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think if Packers win, they are locked 6th with chance for 5th.
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    beast (23-Dec) : This is not complex, just someone doesn't want to believe reality
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