Zero2Cool
15 years ago

I really hate to do this but i will 😛, back in '07 the Packers line wasn't that great and probably would have given up alot of sacks but look at the play calls. Lord Favre alot of times had the ball out of his hands in less than 3 secs on the quick slants and curls. For some reason this year we have the wrs running 20 yard routes and i think that is partially from the preseason when those things worked and so they think it will always work. Rodgers is still learning and he will learn to check out of plays and go back to the quick slants and curls i believe. I think Lord Favre called alot of audibles back then to save his ass. Rodgers will get comfy going against Mike McCarthy's play calling and will improve (hopefully)

"dhazer" wrote:



We get it, a guy who's played in 250 more games is better at short passes than a guy who's played in a couple dozen, WE GET IT! lol :)

The line in '07 was better than it is today, easily. No one can dispute that. Even with that said, I'm not trying to discredit the Favre factor, he played a large role in those plays. He's the slant god, no question. He was also extremely intelligent in sniffing out a blitz an the hot read. It's called experience and we lack it at the QB position.

All in all, the quote post is true and I don't disagree with the comment on the pre season bit either. Although if true, my gosh, we're in a world of hurt if our coaching staff thinks because it worked in pre season when no one is game planning to stop us, that hey it worked there, it'll work in the season. We have BIG PROBLEMS.
UserPostedImage
mi_keys
15 years ago

I really hate to do this but i will 😛, back in '07 the Packers line wasn't that great and probably would have given up alot of sacks but look at the play calls. Lord Favre alot of times had the ball out of his hands in less than 3 secs on the quick slants and curls. For some reason this year we have the wrs running 20 yard routes and i think that is partially from the preseason when those things worked and so they think it will always work. Rodgers is still learning and he will learn to check out of plays and go back to the quick slants and curls i believe. I think Lord Favre called alot of audibles back then to save his ass. Rodgers will get comfy going against Mike McCarthy's play calling and will improve (hopefully)

"dhazer" wrote:



This, I think, has a lot of truth to it. Favre was a 17 year veteran at the time and was in his 16th season starting. At the same time though, we were also able to go deep quite a few times that year. Some of that might have had to do with a more balanced attack or maybe even the quick slants and throws keeping the defense on its heels a bit. The line played better though. The line played better last year with Rodgers. Rodgers has a lot to learn and hopefully he'll continue to learn all the intricacies of the QB position but right now he barely even has time to run a slant.


To porky, no I didn't time when the pocket collapsed on those plays, which in some cases was even quicker. Actually, that first sack with the fumble I timed the collapse at 1.9 seconds and that was 1.9 seconds for BOTH defensive ends to break through.
Born and bred a cheesehead
warhawk
15 years ago
I have a trivia question for you guys and I have no idea what the answer is so if someone can find it there's a beer on me.

Has ANY QB EVER thrown for 385 yards in a game when he was sacked EIGHT times?
"The train is leaving the station."
Nonstopdrivel
15 years ago
On November 20, 2005, Jake Delhomme was sacked 8 times and passed for 235 yards.

On December 14, 2008, Eli Manning was sacked 8 times and passed for 191 yards.

On September 11, 2006, Aaron Brooks was sacked 7 times and passed for 68 yards.
UserPostedImage
Zero2Cool
15 years ago

I have a trivia question for you guys and I have no idea what the answer is so if someone can find it there's a beer on me.

Has ANY QB EVER thrown for 385 yards in a game when he was sacked EIGHT times?

"warhawk" wrote:



I doubt it's ever happened. Now if you would have asked has a QB ever been sacked 8 eights and threw for 384 yards, I'd say I know one, Rodgers.

;)
UserPostedImage
Rockmolder
15 years ago

On December 14, 2008, Eli Manning was sacked 8 times and passed for 191 yards.



The man has had an amazing O-line for most of his career, especially recently, has a great running game to keep the defense honest and he still manages to get sacked 8 times.

Given, Dallas was really getting after him, but still.

I'm still no Eli fan. Although he has been impressive this year.
RedSoxExcel
15 years ago
I get it, the O-line sucks. But I my whole issue has to do more with Rodgers progression as an NFL player.

My problem is simply that he holds on to the ball too much just like he did in game #1 as opposed to game #20. The O-line is terrible, there is no debating that but IMO Rodgers is blame a lot more than 15%. I think a lot of sacks are 50/50. Even when Favre was giving them up left and right in the first 3 games, I said the same thing.

1) As a QB, its your job to read blitzes, if your giving up a lot of sacks where you have no time to react, then you probably failed to read the defence properly and get it out with a quick slant, etc. - That may have to do with coaching though and their instructions to him/latitude to call plays. That will come with time but you cannot expect the O-line/RB to pick up every single blitz, it doesn't happen.

2) You have to sometimes just plain get rid of the ball. For example, that safety. I do not understand how that is even remotely the O-line's fault. Your at the half yard line. You konw you have a couple of seconds MAX to get rid of it. That is on Rodgers. And I hate when he thinks hes faster than he is. Yes he's mobile but he is not Michael Vick. You think your going to outrun Jarden Allen out of the endzone, your not. Play within yourself. Even on last year's safety too, Jarden Allen just plain ran him down.

3) You have to take risks sometimes. I get it, he doesn't get a lot of INTs but I think sometimes you have to take risks. He seems to not want to pull the trigger if its close. But I think you can play like that if you have the Ravens defence of 2008 or whatever. Just like I said last year, our defence is not an elite defense, so take the risks.

Overall, I like Rodgers progression. But this part of his game gets me antsy. He's a statistical giant but a lot of times he gets these 70 yard, 1 minute drives down by two touchdowns. I hate when people just look at stats and scream "whatever look at his stats". Its not all about stats otherwise Warren Moon and Dan Marino would be the two greatest QBs in the history of the NFL. But their not, its about something else, winning. Either your a winner or your not.

Do I think the true "legends" just happen to have the best teams every year, i.e. Manning, Favre, Brady. No. For example, Jets. This was the Mangenius Jets, not the Rex Ryan Jets and they went from 4-12 to 9-7 (including 8-3 at one point) with Favre. And the Packers went from 13-3 to 6-10. Maybe its all just concidence that happens or that the Colts are good EVERY single year, who knows.

But IMO, the most important position in football is exactly that, the most important position. Tahts why I think Rodgers has a lot more control over sacks than just a passive bystander. The O-line sucks but at least show some kind of sign of progression is all I'm asking for. But this excuse that its all the O-line will only hurt his progression in the long run IMO.
blank
Nonstopdrivel
15 years ago
On December 30, 1992 rookie quarterback David Klingler was sacked 10 times, passed for 140 yards and (incredibly, in my opinion) no interceptions
UserPostedImage
Rockmolder
15 years ago
You know what the funny part is? They're not blitzing. They're bringing 4 people and Rodgers goes down in 1.5 seconds. Just look around some other threads. There have been some pretty accurate timings on how long it took Rodgers to get sacked. Allen got in there between 1 and 2.5 seconds on nearly all of his sacks.

We tried some max protection, but that resulted in coverage sacks. Our receivers are great, but even they can't find seams in their zone defense when it's 3 receivers against 7 guys in coverage.

You have a fair point on the safety, but if Allen gets behind you in 1 second and you try to wind up and throw it away, you're in much more trouble. There where 4 possibile scenarios in that one.

1. He throws it away and gets flagged with intentional grounding.
2. He throws it away and Jared Allen easily gets his hand on Rodgers arm. Either a safety or a TD.
3. He miracously gets it in the area of a receiver (in coverage), doesn't get picked and Allen misses his hand/arm.
4. He takes the safety.

I'm not saying that it was the best play to make and maybe he should've thrown it towards a RB after 1.2 seconds, but I really don't think you can blame him a whole lot on that safety.

I don't know how you can even come with that argument about the Colts, Favre and Rodgers.

The Colts defense hasn't been amazing apart from that year of their SB run, but they haven't been as bas as ours was last year either. Manning is a better QB at this point, no doubt about it, but do you truly believe that Favre would have us doing better at this point?
RedSoxExcel
15 years ago

You know what the funny part is? They're not blitzing. They're bringing 4 people and Rodgers goes down in 1.5 seconds. Just look around some other threads. There have been some pretty accurate timings on how long it took Rodgers to get sacked. Allen got in there between 1 and 2.5 seconds on nearly all of his sacks.

We tried some max protection, but that resulted in coverage sacks. Our receivers are great, but even they can't find seams in their zone defense when it's 3 receivers against 7 guys in coverage.

You have a fair point on the safety, but if Allen gets behind you in 1 second and you try to wind up and throw it away, you're in much more trouble. There where 4 possibile scenarios in that one.

1. He throws it away and gets flagged with intentional grounding.
2. He throws it away and Jared Allen easily gets his hand on Rodgers arm. Either a safety or a TD.
3. He miracously gets it in the area of a receiver (in coverage), doesn't get picked and Allen misses his hand/arm.
4. He takes the safety.

I'm not saying that it was the best play to make and maybe he should've thrown it towards a RB after 1.2 seconds, but I really don't think you can blame him a whole lot on that safety.

I don't know how you can even come with that argument about the Colts, Favre and Rodgers.

The Colts defense hasn't been amazing apart from that year of their SB run, but they haven't been as bas as ours was last year either. Manning is a better QB at this point, no doubt about it, but do you truly believe that Favre would have us doing better at this point?

"Rockmolder" wrote:



Nope not saying that all. Favre is 40 years old. I would hope and assume that a QB in their 20's that is the franchise gives us a better chance to win at this point. All I'm saying is that the QB is a very important position. And I don't think its a concidence that Brady, Manning and Favre win every year (one losing season, 13-7 since he left the Packers). Stats are not all that matters or else Warren Moon is the greatest of all time. I just am not that impressed with stats when you do not win, but thats just me. Because maybe hte reason you got 150 yards in the last 5 minutes is because the other team was in prevent because the game was pretty much out of hand based on your other 3 quarters of play.

On the safety, I don't agree with your assessment, I guess I saw the play different. He was in shotgun first, had no initial rush directly at him, then he moved forward, pump faked and then got sacked? There is NO way you have the luxury of a pump fake in the end zone like that.

I just watched again as I have it PVR'd. We actually double teamed Allen. Ryan Grant and the OL blocked him. I wish I knew how to take a picture of the still screen. But there is one point at 7:23 frame that Rodgers has no one near him. He steps up, then pump fakes, then Allen gets free and hits him. The funny thing is if he didn't pump fake and just ran right away, he probably could have just the first down. Or if he stayed where he was, no one was going to get near him, it wasn't until he moved up that Allen had any shot at him.

You can actually see at around the pump fake that he has #86 at the 3-4 yard line with his hands up in the air.

Of course all this is just Monday Morning QB in me. As he obviously cannot see all that. But I want someone else to watch the play and talk about what else the O-line could have done there. I just think something is wrong with the timer in his head. Your in the endzone, you have three-four seconds if you stay still, you have less than if your going to run around. The area to work with is 10 yards, its just logic that its harder for the O-line to help you if you rund around in that short of an area.
blank
Fan Shout
Zero2Cool (38m) : McCarthy let go or not extended??
Mucky Tundra (53m) : Chicago Bears have asked the Dallas Cowboys permission to interview Mike McCarthy for head coaching vacancy
Zero2Cool (6h) : The winners page that is
Zero2Cool (6h) : I was not hoping for that. It messes up the page lol
beast (7h) : Thank you, and I was really opening we were going to get 4 or more tied for the top 3.
beast (7h) : Thank you, and I was really opening we were going to get 4 or more tied for the top 3.
beast (7h) : Thank you, and I was really opening we were going to get 4 or more tied for the top 3
Zero2Cool (7h) : congrats beast on 2024 !
Zero2Cool (7h) : congrats porky on winning 2023 pick'em! (oops sorry)
Zero2Cool (8h) : Packers have $60M+ of 2025 cap space on paper TODAY.
Mucky Tundra (18h) : Missed FG into a Lions TD; that'll do pig, that'll do
Mucky Tundra (18h) : That might be it for the Vikings
Mucky Tundra (18h) : Oh so the refs do know what intentional grounding is
Mucky Tundra (19h) : what the hell was that Goff?! Not much pressure and he just air mails it to Harrison
Mucky Tundra (19h) : They really need to to get rid of the auto first down for illegal contact
Martha Careful (19h) : watching the Vikings and Lions it's understandable why they swept the Packers. So much better product
Mucky Tundra (19h) : Even when GB got pressure he was throwing darts; vs no pressure on that last pass he just air mails an open guy
Zero2Cool (19h) : didn't have guys in his face ... pressure makes difference
Mucky Tundra (19h) : Where was this Darnold vs GB?
Mucky Tundra (19h) : BALL DON'T LIE
Mucky Tundra (19h) : how was that not a safety? Goff throws it at an offensive lineman
Mucky Tundra (20h) : Zero, I thought that was a given! ;)
Mucky Tundra (20h) : Zero I looked through earlier and noticed the same thing. Bonkers year. I just wonder if beast put any money on games
Zero2Cool (20h) : I'm hoping for BLOODBATH. Pummel one another.
Zero2Cool (20h) : 8 people in pick'em would have won any year with their total lol
Mucky Tundra (20h) : I'm rooting for the Lions to lose.
Mucky Tundra (20h) : God help me but I'm rooting for the Vikings to...Vikings to...Christ I can't say it
Zero2Cool (21h) : 4 td for Rodgers
Zero2Cool (22h) : Chiefs got shutout
Zero2Cool (22h) : Rodgers passes for 3rd TD. might be last game of an amazing career
Mucky Tundra (22h) : "The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry."
Zero2Cool (23h) : Owner ... love it
Zero2Cool (23h) : Mayo was the guy they groomed for HC and one of the reasons they let Bill go.
Mucky Tundra (23h) : Pats have the #4 pick, lots of cap space and Maye at QB; should fetch some attention
Mucky Tundra (23h) : Well that didn't take long; Jerod Mayo out as Patriots HC
Zero2Cool (5-Jan) : I would expect it to be higher in favor of Eagles
Mucky Tundra (5-Jan) : Thst line seems...generous
Zero2Cool (5-Jan) : Eagles -3.5 over Packers in Wildcard Round
Mucky Tundra (5-Jan) : Did it though? Pokes beat the Commanders on the road with Cooper Rush previously
Zero2Cool (5-Jan) : That gives them their best chance
Mucky Tundra (5-Jan) : Cowboys starting Trey Lance at QB vs Commanders; GB vs Philly in the Wild Card incoming!
Mucky Tundra (4-Jan) : Stinks for Lloyd. Hoping he comes back strong for next year
Zero2Cool (3-Jan) : Packers placed Marshawn Lloyd on reserve non-football illness list
Zero2Cool (3-Jan) : Luke Getsy been helping Packers defense. He's former OC Bears/Raiders and our old QB coach
beast (2-Jan) : Thanks dfosterf, I'm still kicking myself for last week, as I forgot to change to pick Vikings and Lions... after putting in a holding spot.
Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : First alternate: Elgton Jenkins Other alternates: Jordan Love, Kenny Clark, Keisean Nixon, Tucker Kraft, Josh Myers, Jaire Alexander
Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : Pro Bowl still a thing? Guess Packers have three. Jacobs, Gary, McKinney.
dfosterf (2-Jan) : It's a mine field with all the players sitting, etc
dfosterf (2-Jan) : There was quite a bit of "chalk" matchups this year it seemed, but not this week coming up
Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : Or we got better and by we I mean everyone except me
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2024 Packers Schedule
Friday, Sep 6 @ 7:15 PM
Eagles
Sunday, Sep 15 @ 12:00 PM
COLTS
Sunday, Sep 22 @ 12:00 PM
Titans
Sunday, Sep 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Oct 6 @ 3:25 PM
Rams
Sunday, Oct 13 @ 12:00 PM
CARDINALS
Sunday, Oct 20 @ 12:00 PM
TEXANS
Sunday, Oct 27 @ 12:00 PM
Jaguars
Sunday, Nov 3 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 17 @ 12:00 PM
Bears
Sunday, Nov 24 @ 3:25 PM
49ERS
Thursday, Nov 28 @ 7:20 PM
DOLPHINS
Thursday, Dec 5 @ 7:15 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 15 @ 7:20 PM
Seahawks
Monday, Dec 23 @ 7:15 PM
SAINTS
Sunday, Dec 29 @ 3:25 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 5 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Recent Topics
38m / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

2h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

2h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

7h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

7h / Fantasy Sports Talk / Zero2Cool

7h / Fantasy Sports Talk / Zero2Cool

9h / Featured Content / Zero2Cool

22h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

23h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

5-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / buckeyepackfan

3-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

3-Jan / Around The NFL / Zero2Cool

2-Jan / GameDay Threads / Zero2Cool

2-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.