First off, dont get all hysterical, it's important to maintain a voice of reason. The goal is to find a way to get our MVP QB back, not replace him with Tolzein. And Aaron Rodgers watching severely less talented Tolzein marching up and down the field by staying in the offense would be just what the DR. ordered. If you think Aaron Rodgers is a guy having a bad game or to, then no amount of voicing of reason will help you because you simply are not paying attention TO THE GAME.

Second, applying your reasoning it necessarily follows that you believe: If Aaron Rodgers broke his collar bone; Starr, the greatest GB QB of all time, should have started v. Detroit over Tolzein. This reasoning fails because age has caused him not to be the guy he was in the 60's. TODAY, the guy who gives us the best chance is TOLZEIN not Starr. If one argued for Tolzein over Starr, would you be saying, "what a dumb shit...it's obvious Starr is better, look at the way he played in the 60's?" This is the position of reason you've taken! Your missing one very important variable in your Aaron Rodgers reasoning: it's effing 2015, week 13, it's not 1966, it's not 2014, it's not 2011. Understand?

Third, Lacy was pretty good too, our best RB in a long time; this must be the second dumbest shit you've ever heard: "benching" Lacy. This was not about missing 1 curfew. It was about a fundamental shift in Lacy's approach to his job from last year to this. They're trying to get him back. Do ya think Lacy has 2 100 yard games in a row, if he was not demoted a few weeks ago? Can you see the difference in the way he ran those 2 games and earlier in the year: night and day! So if we apply your Aaron Rodgers reasoning: Lacy is better than Starks, HArris and Crockett, dont bench him, right? Is Lacy better than Crockett, no freakin' way; BUT BUT BUT who was in the best position to play well against Detroit? And I give you my solemn guarantee that if Tolzein played the first 2.5 Quarters v. Detroit; he like Crockett over Lacy would have EASILY outperformed AR.

You got a QB that is REFUSING to operate w/in the game plan. Do ya think the coach that says, "Meh, he's the greatest of all time, he's entitled to do what ever he wants; is a dumb shit? I do." If a lesser QB had done this they'd be CUT not benched, same logic used on Lacy And Harris.

The Favre parallel is spot on; anyone who wants a repeat of those last 8 years is a total Dumbsh!t in my book. Wanting exhilarating QB play over wins and championships is just weird to me. It happened because Peabody and Sherman could not find a way to reign in Favre. One huge difference between Favre and Rodgers is that Favre didn't wear his superiority the way a Brazilian where's their flag to their teams wold cup match.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 

I don't think hysterical means what you think it does sir. I merely suggested that benching Rodgers is fucking stupid. We are 8-4. I obviously cant "win" this argument because your position is that Tolzien would outperform Rodgers while simultaneously fixing Rodgers attitude. However, since Rodgers has no realistic chance to actually be benched you will never technically be wrong.

I never mentioned Starr, so I have no idea what point you were trying to make.

Benching Big Ed Lacy and benching Aaron Rodgers are in different worlds. One of these worlds exists in reality, while the other exists only in the fevered dreams of true lunatics. In my opinion.

Originally Posted by: voiceofreason 

I don't think hysterical means what you think it does sir. I merely suggested that benching Rodgers is fucking stupid. We are 8-4. I obviously cant "win" this argument because your position is that Tolzien would outperform Rodgers while simultaneously fixing Rodgers attitude. However, since Rodgers has no realistic chance to actually be benched you will never technically be wrong.

I never mentioned Starr, so I have no idea what point you were trying to make.

Benching Big Ed Lacy and benching Aaron Rodgers are in different worlds. One of these worlds exists in reality, while the other exists only in the fevered dreams of true lunatics. In my opinion.

Originally Posted by: voiceofreason 

It's one thing to criticize Rodgers for his mistakes. There have been more than his fair share to point out these past six weeks. It's another entirely to state, as fact, with little to no basis to do so, that Tolzein would have committed none of those errors or to assume he would have matched Rodgers on every play that was executed correctly. It's also absurd to blame only Rodgers for these issues when one of the specific examples you gave involved a ball going through a receiver's hands, bad throw notwithstanding.

Originally Posted by: mi_keys 

Hysterical-being controlled by EMOTION; not reason, that's what it means and that is what I meant. A hysterical idea was put forth that Aaron Rodgers should remain the starter because: (a) He was great; and (b) he's only had a few "subpar" games.

The Starr simile wiped out (a), its an absurd idea that a guy keeps his job because of past performance to the exclusion of all else; and (b) is 100% irrational inaccurate emotion. His PR against blitz was over 120; this year its under 50. I pointed out a week ago that he was 24th in yards passing, behind some pretty bad QBs and combos of back-ups . His passer rating is skewed because of low INTs, high TD passes and garbage time yards. In the last 6 weeks, he has not been subar; he's SUCKED! There is a fundamental shift in AR's: accuracy; seeing wide open receivers; seeing check downs; locking in on his receivers WAAAAY more than usual; missing hot reads; not anticipating or seeing mismatches; he not preparing as well [been through 7 2014 games, he'd didn't screw up a single scripted play so far]; hell, he admitted he was afraid to throw to Cobb in endzone in Car. and on and on. One can look at his 10 point drop in PR from career average and dwell comfortably in ignorant bliss; some need that level of denial to function.

I can be persuaded with any argument supporting with real FACTS, not hysterical fantasies of Aaron Rodgers playing "subpar in a few games" and cogent reasoning. "subpar in a few game," WTF, did Starr run a 4.39 40 on T'giving too?

FYI: AR's benching is being considered. Did you see the film of Holmgren changing his mind a few seconds after telling the assistants to get the back-up ready for Favre. Or Mike McCarthy saying he screwed up by not pulling Favre in NFC champ game v Giants. It is being considered, we just don't know it yet!

Like I said, I've gone back and been grading his play last year: there is a night and day difference; hard to believe its the same guy wearing #12.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 

Now it'd be silly to say, EG, if Aaron Rodgers threw inaccurately on Adams TD, that Tolzein would have made that throw. But it is fair to say he would have hit JJ open on the cross for 1st or Cobb open in right endzone.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 

Again on the Jones no catch, JJ jumped late because that play is practiced to go low; it's like asking a baseball catcher who called for a curve inside to catch a fastball outside.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 

Nothing is different about the performance of the other 10 offensive players this year from years past. The only performance drop is the QB and it's serious.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 

You simply aren't being objective claiming the only player that has regressed this year is Rodgers.

Originally Posted by: mi_keys