How to build a NFL winner· Page 2

Formo
Veteran Member

13 years ago

LMAO, just got home from work. Guess what I hear on the radio? Denver Broncos are shopping Brandon Lloyd and D.J. Williams, two of their best players.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

One Brandon Lloyd and one D.J. Williams does NOT equal one Adrian "All Day" Peterson and one Jared "DakotaT loves me" Allen.

This will help add some umph to Formo saying this method of trading your best players on a failing team is not 'smart'. The Denver Broncos traded Jay Cutler and Brandon Marshall, two of their best players. So, it still does happen, but when you have Josh McDaniels making the draft selections, it's not gonna turn out too well, lol.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

Exactly my point. It's a crapshoot. That's absolutely not worth it.

Herschel Walker, Steve Walsh, those guys ring a bell at all? HELLO COWBOYS! It has happened and if the fans weren't so fickle and demanding of WIN NOW, it would happen more.

Zero2Cool wrote:

Yeah, I guarantee that another Herschel Walker trade does not happen again.

You're correct, the risk does not outweigh the reward when you have a staff full of incompetent college scout evaluators like the Vikings possess.

Zero2Cool wrote:

Yup, so incompetent that the Vikings never drafted a Rookie of the Year, much less two of them.. [palm]

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

13 years ago

#12

Any three Broncos do not equal half of Adrian Peterson. Thanks for missing the point, big surprise, genius.

Yup, so incompetent that the Vikings never drafted a Rookie of the Year, much less two of them.. [palm]

Originally Posted by: Formo

[palm] You got me! Holy wow, you got me!! [palm] Randy Moss and Adrian Peterson [palm] ... who else do you got? Surely a few OL right? [palm] The majority of the Vikings talent comes from OTHER TEAMS. Prove me wrong. [palm]

Fact is, you are right, acquiring draft picks would be foolish because the Vikings do not know how to draft, nor do they know how to groom their draft picks into professional caliber players.[palm] That is why year after year they pillage free agency and trades. [palm]

Vikings are a poor mans New York Yankees. [palm]

Formo
Veteran Member

13 years ago

#13

Any three Broncos do not equal half of Adrian Peterson. Thanks for missing the point, big surprise, genius.

[palm] You got me! Holy wow, you got me!! [palm] Randy Moss and Adrian Peterson [palm] ... who else do you got? Surely a few OL right? [palm] The majority of the Vikings talent comes from OTHER TEAMS. Prove me wrong. [palm]

Fact is, you are right, acquiring draft picks would be foolish because the Vikings do not know how to draft, nor do they know how to groom their draft picks into professional caliber players.[palm] That is why year after year they pillage free agency and trades. [palm]

Vikings are a poor mans New York Yankees. [palm]

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

Percy Harvin wasn't a RotY? You might wanna check on that.

As far their other drafted talent: Chad Greenway, EJ and Erin Henderson, Kevin Williams, Loadholt, Ponder (will prove to be a decent pick), Sidney Rice (got the best out of him), Ray Edwards (got a draft pick out of him leaving), Jim Kliensasser, Kyle Rudolph, Brian Robison, Cedric Griffon are a few talented guys off the top of my head that have contributed for the Vikings in one way or another the past 2-3 seasons. And every one of those guys are starters.

But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of your rant.

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

13 years ago

#14

Now the Colts are being rumored to attempt to move a couple of their best players, Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis. I think it's more of a product of the trade deadline approaching.

Formo, you proved my point with your scarce list, thank ya sir.

If you are drafting the rookie of the year, that means it wasn't that tough of a decision to make that draft selection. But I don't mean to minimize the achievement, since that's the only thing you have going for your pathetic team.

Formo
Veteran Member

13 years ago

#15

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

My scarce list?! Seriously? The Vikings have 9 starters that have not been drafted by them, 3 of which weren't even drafted at all. The Packers have 6 starters that were not drafted by them, 3 of which weren't drafted.

Then looking at the rest of the team.. The Vikings have 28 non-starters that were not drafted by them, the Packers have 19 non-starters that were not drafted by them (keep in mind I'm not counting any players that were picked up as rookie free agents).

My point is, the Vikings don't get the majority of their players via trades/FA like you Puker fans like to think. You think they get their players by pillaging other teams' rosters because they seemingly only trade for the big namers which puts them in the spotlight.

I looked at 5 other teams' rosters and they are pretty interesting. Lets have a looksie:

Stillers:
5 starters not drafted by the Steelers
21 non-starters not drafted by the Steelers

Patriots:
9 starters not drafted by the Pats
32 non-starters not drafted by the Pats

Cowboys:
7 starters not drafted by the Cows
25 non-starters not drafted by the Cows

Redskins:
A whopping 15 starters not drafted by the Skins
29 non-starters not drafted by the Skins

Just because the Packers won a Super Bowl with a majority of their roster all drafted within their system doesn't mean that is the only way to build a successful NFL team. The Stiller and Pats have solid franchises and they hardly built their teams the way Ted has done with the Packers.

I agree with you in that it doesn't make sense to draft players if you can't scout college players. My point was the Vikings are far from the worst team in the NFL when it comes to drafting. The number of starters currently on the squad says as such.

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

13 years ago

#16

I agree with you in that it doesn't make sense to draft players if you can't scout college players. My point was the Vikings are far from the worst team in the NFL when it comes to drafting. The number of starters currently on the squad says as such.

Originally Posted by: Formo

My point is you absolutely need to stop implying what I am saying. The Vikings are not the worst at anything in my opinion.

I wasn't saying you build by the draft. I am saying you do NOT make big ass trades UNLESS you are the brink of being a legit contender.

Who have the Steelers or Patriots made big trades to ACQUIRE? I think Corey Dillon was a 1st rounder? They just don't do it.

They both have staffs that can COACH PLAYERS UP. They get budget free agents, undrafted rookies and draft well. THAT IS HOW YOU BUILD A WINNER. I never said you must ONLY draft like your research indicates.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think there is a pseudo blueprint to build teams. Actually I'll throw this in a new thread. I don't want to run this topic down anymore than I have.

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

13 years ago

#17

Okay, wow moving posts is a biotch. This is my thinking of how to build a successful NFL team.

Owner - priority one should be winning and putting a winning product on the field

General Manager - cares not about fans opinions only about acquiring the best talent. must not be afraid to make a big move to put team over the top.

Head Coach - teacher first, coach second.
Offensive Coordinator - teacher first, coach second.
Defensive Coordinator - teacher first, coach second.
Special Teams - not named Shawn Slocum

Solid scouting staff for college talent, keep logs on files until the player hits 32'ish.
Only overspend in free agency/trade if it is for a player whom will put your team "over the top"
Get rid of players a year EARLY rather than a year LATE

If you remove economics from decisions such as hiring a coach because he has a big name, or a player cuz of their name, etc ... I think this is the foundation most teams TRY to emulate, but fail.

Of course this is just my own BRIEF opinion.

Formo
Veteran Member

13 years ago

#18

My point is you absolutely need to stop implying what I am saying. The Vikings are not the worst at anything in my opinion.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

I'm only replying in a way because of the implications of your posts. And yes, that's exactly what I'm perceiving your posts to imply. I'll take ownership of that.. but only because of your history of implying the Vikings are the debul.

I wasn't saying you build by the draft. I am saying you do NOT make big ass trades UNLESS you are the brink of being a legit contender.

Who have the Steelers or Patriots made big trades to ACQUIRE? I think Corey Dillon was a 1st rounder? They just don't do it.

They both have staffs that can COACH PLAYERS UP. They get budget free agents, undrafted rookies and draft well. THAT IS HOW YOU BUILD A WINNER. I never said you must ONLY draft like your research indicates.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think there is a pseudo blueprint to build teams. Actually I'll throw this in a new thread. I don't want to run this topic down anymore than I have.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

My research doesn't indicate much. You were ribbing me about how the Vikings can't draft outside of the obvious 2 recent RotYs they have. All I was showing you was that, yes, in fact that Vikings CAN draft, and have as many own-drafted players on their roster as the average NFL team.

And as far as building a successful NFL team, there's going to be a blueprint on how to build the skeleton of the team, but as far as the rest goes, is very fluid.

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!

DakotaT
Select Member

13 years ago

#19

How to build an NFL winner and we're using the Vikings as a model? I know some of you miss Nick the dumbass, but bringing VR back is not worth using the worst case scenario oxymoron possible.

Building a winner starts with the GM putting in place the right guy at Quarterback. That is step 1 and the Vikings have never learned that. It is incredible the amount of wasted talent that has gone through that franchise because they didn't have the great player at the number 1 position.

Packer fans should consider themselves the luckiest fvckers on the planet.

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

13 years ago

#20

How to build an NFL winner and we're using the Vikings as a model?

Originally Posted by: DakotaT

Who the fuck is using the Vikings as an example on HOW TO build a winner? In my post briefly explaining a top level core structure I did not mention the Vikings.

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Mucky Tundra (8h) : Missed FG into a Lions TD; that'll do pig, that'll do

Mucky Tundra (8h) : That might be it for the Vikings

Mucky Tundra (8h) : Oh so the refs do know what intentional grounding is

Mucky Tundra (8h) : what the hell was that Goff?! Not much pressure and he just air mails it to Harrison

Mucky Tundra (9h) : They really need to to get rid of the auto first down for illegal contact

Martha Careful (9h) : watching the Vikings and Lions it's understandable why they swept the Packers. So much better product

Mucky Tundra (9h) : Even when GB got pressure he was throwing darts; vs no pressure on that last pass he just air mails an open guy

Zero2Cool (9h) : didn't have guys in his face ... pressure makes difference

Mucky Tundra (9h) : Where was this Darnold vs GB?

Mucky Tundra (9h) : BALL DON'T LIE

Mucky Tundra (9h) : how was that not a safety? Goff throws it at an offensive lineman

Mucky Tundra (10h) : Zero, I thought that was a given! ;)

Mucky Tundra (10h) : Zero I looked through earlier and noticed the same thing. Bonkers year. I just wonder if beast put any money on games

Zero2Cool (10h) : I'm hoping for BLOODBATH. Pummel one another.

Zero2Cool (10h) : 8 people in pick'em would have won any year with their total lol

Mucky Tundra (10h) : I'm rooting for the Lions to lose.

Mucky Tundra (10h) : God help me but I'm rooting for the Vikings to...Vikings to...Christ I can't say it

Zero2Cool (11h) : 4 td for Rodgers

Zero2Cool (11h) : Chiefs got shutout

Zero2Cool (12h) : Rodgers passes for 3rd TD. might be last game of an amazing career

Mucky Tundra (12h) : "The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry."

Zero2Cool (13h) : Owner ... love it

Zero2Cool (13h) : Mayo was the guy they groomed for HC and one of the reasons they let Bill go.

Mucky Tundra (13h) : Pats have the #4 pick, lots of cap space and Maye at QB; should fetch some attention

Mucky Tundra (13h) : Well that didn't take long; Jerod Mayo out as Patriots HC

Zero2Cool (14h) : I would expect it to be higher in favor of Eagles

Mucky Tundra (14h) : Thst line seems...generous

Zero2Cool (14h) : Eagles -3.5 over Packers in Wildcard Round

Mucky Tundra (14h) : Did it though? Pokes beat the Commanders on the road with Cooper Rush previously

Zero2Cool (21h) : That gives them their best chance

Mucky Tundra (5-Jan) : Cowboys starting Trey Lance at QB vs Commanders; GB vs Philly in the Wild Card incoming!

Mucky Tundra (4-Jan) : Stinks for Lloyd. Hoping he comes back strong for next year

Zero2Cool (3-Jan) : Packers placed Marshawn Lloyd on reserve non-football illness list

Zero2Cool (3-Jan) : Luke Getsy been helping Packers defense. He's former OC Bears/Raiders and our old QB coach

beast (2-Jan) : Thanks dfosterf, I'm still kicking myself for last week, as I forgot to change to pick Vikings and Lions... after putting in a holding spot.

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : First alternate: Elgton Jenkins Other alternates: Jordan Love, Kenny Clark, Keisean Nixon, Tucker Kraft, Josh Myers, Jaire Alexander

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : Pro Bowl still a thing? Guess Packers have three. Jacobs, Gary, McKinney.

dfosterf (2-Jan) : It's a mine field with all the players sitting, etc

dfosterf (2-Jan) : There was quite a bit of "chalk" matchups this year it seemed, but not this week coming up

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : Or we got better and by we I mean everyone except me

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : We have about six that by percent would have won nearly any season. I guess 2024 was predictable 🤷

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : You can check previous seasons. I quick did it and don't think anyone hit 70% before

dfosterf (2-Jan) : Hats off to the Beast

dfosterf (2-Jan) : I'm at 71.76% in pick 'em. 2nd place. Beast is at a flat 75% 9 games ahead. That 75% has got to be unprecedented this late in the season

beast (2-Jan) : I don't care deeply, just want some good entertaining games

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : BTW, not serious.

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : You don't care about it either!!!!

Zero2Cool (2-Jan) : NIL and Portal killed college, no one cares about it.

Mucky Tundra (2-Jan) : outside of Texas-Arizona St, it's been a snoozefest

beast (2-Jan) : I expect Georgia will change that tomorrow, but we'll have to wait and see. If they do, then only Big 10 and SEC are left.

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