nerdmann
6 years ago

Im with Barharn here,

we paid too much for him, and we let nelson go for him.
https://overthecap.com/position/tight-end/ 
we just paid him like he is the best TE in the league - and #1 the stats dont show it, and #2 if nelson was old at 32 how is this guy young at 31?

Originally Posted by: Dulak 



That’s my primary issue, how much we paid for him. But the cap hit isn’t that bad for year 1, iirc. We essentially get Graham and Wilkerson for the price of Jordy. To me, that’s an upgrade. How much of an upgrade? We shall see.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Zero2Cool
6 years ago

That’s my primary issue, how much we paid for him. But the cap hit isn’t that bad for year 1, iirc. We essentially get Graham and Wilkerson for the price of Jordy. To me, that’s an upgrade. How much of an upgrade? We shall see.

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



Why is the amount someone is paid a primary issue for you? What has it stopped us from doing? Would the team be better off without a vertical threat TE and instead with that money going to an aging over the hill WR?

This gripe makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to me, no matter how many different angles I try to view it. We improved our defense and offense with releasing Jordy Nelson and adding Jimmy Graham and the cost basically negated itself. You get a TE that is going to help make the WR even more effective and a defensive end that will at least help with rotation. It's a win-win.
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earthquake
6 years ago
I was disappointed to see Jordy gone. I expect he's probably good for at least 800 yards/8tds for the new few years, even though he is past his prime. I wouldn't have been upset with say, a 2-3 year deal around 4-5m per year. But I don't know a whole lot about the cap situation.

That said, historically GB has had a lot more luck finding good WRs than it has had finding good TEs, which they haven't really had since Finley. So I think Graham potentially means a net gain despite the loss of Jordy, and that's not even considering the Wilkerson signing which they were able to afford.

I do find it a little confusing that some seem to suggest Jordy is old and Graham is young, when they are 32 and 31 respectively. Jordy has played for 2 more seasons, but in his first 3 seasons he had limited playing time, while Graham was a focal point of the Saint's offense in year 2. Graham has actually started more games (89 vs 88) than Jordy.

I agree with the sentiment that Graham was a poor fit in Seattle, that trade really confused me. I'm excited to see what he can do in a pass-heavy offense.
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nerdmann
6 years ago

Why is the amount someone is paid a primary issue for you? What has it stopped us from doing? Would the team be better off without a vertical threat TE and instead with that money going to an aging over the hill WR?

This gripe makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to me, no matter how many different angles I try to view it. We improved our defense and offense with releasing Jordy Nelson and adding Jimmy Graham and the cost basically negated itself. You get a TE that is going to help make the WR even more effective and a defensive end that will at least help with rotation. It's a win-win.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



LIke I said, it’s not that bad of a hit in year one, as a percentage of our cap.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Zero2Cool
6 years ago

I do find it a little confusing that some seem to suggest Jordy is old and Graham is young, when they are 32 and 31 respectively. Jordy has played for 2 more seasons, but in his first 3 seasons he had limited playing time, while Graham was a focal point of the Saint's offense in year 2. Graham has actually started more games (89 vs 88) than Jordy.

Originally Posted by: earthquake 



Who is saying/suggesting Graham is young? I haven't heard that or seen that yet. I've read a few people state what you're saying though. Maybe if true, maybe people think Jordy turning 33 in May and his on-field production drop this past season translate to him being older? Maybe they are implying age is affecting Jordy more than age is affecting Graham?

I suppose I'm just in the camp that Aaron Rodgers makes WR's better with better success than he makes TE's better, so upgrading the TE position is more important since we haven't been able to trade a good TE in several drafts.
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Dulak
6 years ago

I was disappointed to see Jordy gone. I expect he's probably good for at least 800 yards/8tds for the new few years, even though he is past his prime. I wouldn't have been upset with say, a 2-3 year deal around 4-5m per year. But I don't know a whole lot about the cap situation.

That said, historically GB has had a lot more luck finding good WRs than it has had finding good TEs, which they haven't really had since Finley. So I think Graham potentially means a net gain despite the loss of Jordy, and that's not even considering the Wilkerson signing which they were able to afford.

I do find it a little confusing that some seem to suggest Jordy is old and Graham is young, when they are 32 and 31 respectively. Jordy has played for 2 more seasons, but in his first 3 seasons he had limited playing time, while Graham was a focal point of the Saint's offense in year 2. Graham has actually started more games (89 vs 88) than Jordy.

I agree with the sentiment that Graham was a poor fit in Seattle, that trade really confused me. I'm excited to see what he can do in a pass-heavy offense.

Originally Posted by: earthquake 



For some reason GB seemed to draft or hire smaller TEs and IMO that dont make good TEs - need 6'4+ 6'5 etc ... look at all the good TEs right now 6'5 6'6 ... I seem to remember seeing alot of 6'2-6'4 for our guys that we draft or hire. Not counting finley - cook was 6'5 (good) bennett (6'6 - not so good).

anyways ... I think jordy could of been had for less then 10 per year; he took what 7 from the raiders and we offered him ~2 ...
Cheesey
6 years ago
I hated to see Jordy go. But I understand why they did it. He wasn’t getting the seperation that he was getting in the past.
Tying up money in him that could go for needs in other areas didn’t make sense anymore.
I think too many fans are thinking with their emotions more then honestly looking at the fact that Nelson was not anywhere as good as he was just a couple years ago.
JMO of course.
Fans did the same thing when Favre was replaced by Rodgers.
We tend to get emotionally involved with players we like.
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nerdmann
6 years ago

I hated to see Jordy go. But I understand why they did it. He wasn’t getting the seperation that he was getting in the past.
Tying up money in him that could go for needs in other areas didn’t make sense anymore.
I think too many fans are thinking with their emotions more then honestly looking at the fact that Nelson was not anywhere as good as he was just a couple years ago.
JMO of course.
Fans did the same thing when Favre was replaced by Rodgers.
We tend to get emotionally involved with players we like.

Originally Posted by: Cheesey 



Everyone bitched when Kampman got hosed too.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Cheesey
6 years ago
True...we as fans have a kind of “love affair” with certain players. Organizations can’t allow themselves to think that way. They have to think of what they believe is best for the TEAM.
For me it was that way with Donald Driver. I knew he was done, but hated seeing him retire.
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Dulak
6 years ago

Everyone bitched when Kampman got hosed too.

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



I didnt :)

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