Formo
15 years ago

You know what guys, since you have no idea what socialism and communism mean, how about you stop calling Obama and his government that k?

Or maybe you do know what the word means, but just have to call Obama that because your loverboy McCain lost.

What Obama is doing/has done is not what a communist/socialist would do.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



I happen to know what it means, because I read the Communist Manifesto.

Funny, Obama's stances are pretty damn close to communism. So, uhh.. Yes, I do know what it means, and it's insulting to throw out generalizations that I'm just saying it because of a certain conservative mindset happens to say it too. Besides, I don't call it communism, but Obamunism. Same principle, though.

"10 point program of Communism

1. Abolition of property in land and of all rents of land to public purposes.
2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
3. Abolition of all right of inheritance.
4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the State, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly.
6. Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State.
7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
8. Equal liability of all to labour. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of the distinction between town and country, by a more equitable distribution of the population over the country.
10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production."

The three bolded points are already in motion. The government bailing out the banks and GM gives them power over both. The tax thing is already a given.

I'm sure there's more that I'm unaware of or forgot.

Anyway, I digress. I pretty much ignore the thoughts and ideas of people not living in this country, not because you are bad people.. but your thoughts and ideas are slanted towards what you think is best for America. Which is a bit out of wack, considering you don't have to live here to experience said changes. If we become like every other country in Europe.. WTF was the point of becoming our own nation 300+ years ago?!

"Formo" wrote:



Good post, but I never tried to say what's best for your country. I only pointed out Obama is not a communist. 3 out of 10 doesn't mean you are a communist, it's not like the US is the only country where those points stand. Things get fucked up when, say points 1, 3 and 8 start to get used. The amount your american liberties have been taken away from you are very limited in comparison to what it would be if you had a communist government.

"Packers_Finland" wrote:



3 out of 10 isn't bad.. But 2 of which have been started in recent years. I actually consider Obama and his likes socialists.. But calling him a communist stirs the pot more, and gets the uninformed thinking (well, the smart ones).

Either way, it's a new direction for this country, and I don't like it. And neither should every other red blooded American, IMHO. Again, I beg the question.. What was the point of claiming our independence from Europe if we become like every other European nation?

"Formo" wrote:



I know. The 1776 healthcare system was way too socialistic for Washington's taste. Every man for himself, because it's the land of the fucking free.

"Packers_Finland" wrote:



lol Health care was and continues to be a luxary. Government shouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

I don't know the exact number, but I do know that more than 50% of civilized, 1st world countries use a progressive tax system.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



And they all suck. Same goes with the US's tax system.

I know that a lot take care of the public transportation, did that untill shortly, or have plans for getting it back.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



I don't mind 'public' transportation.. just charge the people that use it. Stop taxing me on it, then when I choose to use it, charge me for it.. I paid more than enough on my taxes on it. My complaint with the Government owning part of that sector is GM. You think they are going to give that ownership up?

Anyway, like Finland said, you're in trouble if number 1, 3 and 8 will become reality in the states.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



It's the quiet slow progress towards those 10 points I posted. I'm concerned the Government won't stop at those 3.

Aristocracy wasn't all bad. It had some positives. Just like communism had some things that enriched civilization. I don't know why everyone gets so crazy about freedom whenever one law gets taken into effect which has socialistic roots. If you want total freedom, total anarchy, go live on an island with indigenous tribes. That's about how far civilizations come without any kind of leadership, laws and government of whatever type.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



People go crazy because it's one law now.. Then two months later it's another socialist law. Then another month down the road, it's another socialist law. Now it's not just one law... It's a trend.

BTW, Detlev my friend.. You'll just LOVE the shirt I just bought:

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!
Formo
15 years ago

I actually consider Obama and his likes socialists.. But calling him a communist stirs the pot more, and gets the uninformed thinking (well, the smart ones).

"vikesrule" wrote:



Interestingly ironic comment from someone that worships at the Rush Limbaugh alter of inane rhetoric and blowhard philosophy.

I'm guessing you lust after Ann Coulter as well.

"Formo" wrote:



Rush is the man.

Although I haven't listened to him in years mainly because it's a waste of time. It's not like I agree with every topic he rants about. Same with O'Reily(sp).

I don't know much of Coulter, but if my memory serves me right, she looks pretty good. Which is A-OK in my book.

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!
Rockmolder
15 years ago

The 1776 healthcare system was way too socialistic for Washington's taste.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



This statement makes no logical sense whatsoever. There was no healthcare system back in 1776. Healthcare was provided by mothers and fathers, herbalists and midwives, a few crudely trained doctors who made house calls, if you were lucky enough to be within walking or riding distance. Hospitals, if they existed at all, were places you went to die, not to get well. Healthcare wasn't considered a "right." You did what you could to get people back on their feet and you hoped for the best.

Which is pretty much what we do to this day. Every time you walk into a doctor's office, you are a guinea pig, a training aid, an experiment. And that is a fact.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



You didn't get the sarcasm in the context of that paragraph?

Again, I beg the question.. What was the point of claiming our independence from Europe if we become like every other European nation?

"Formo" wrote:



I know. The 1776 healthcare system was way too socialistic for Washington's taste. Every man for himself, because it's the land of the fucking free.

"Rockmolder" wrote:

Formo
15 years ago

I fail to see how this is a new direction for our country. Ever since the American public kicked Hoover out of office, they have believed it was the federal government's job to fix their problems. President Roosevelt gave us the New Deal, Social Security, and unemployment insurance (which originated in Wisconsin in 1932). President Eisenhower gave us the Small Business Association in 1953. President Johnson gave us the Great Society, including Medicare and Medicaid, in 1965, with former President Harry Truman enrolled as the first beneficiary. He also gave us federal student loans. President Richard Nixon passed sweeping economic restrictions, including price controls. President Clinton tried to pass a healthcare reform bill.

This is nothing new. Americans have been bellying up to the federal teat for decades.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



New direction as in it has been getting worse. And a LOT more prominent.

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!
Formo
15 years ago

The 1776 healthcare system was way too socialistic for Washington's taste.

"Rockmolder" wrote:



This statement makes no logical sense whatsoever. There was no healthcare system back in 1776. Healthcare was provided by mothers and fathers, herbalists and midwives, a few crudely trained doctors who made house calls, if you were lucky enough to be within walking or riding distance. Hospitals, if they existed at all, were places you went to die, not to get well. Healthcare wasn't considered a "right." You did what you could to get people back on their feet and you hoped for the best.

Which is pretty much what we do to this day. Every time you walk into a doctor's office, you are a guinea pig, a training aid, an experiment. And that is a fact.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



You didn't get the sarcasm in the context of that paragraph?

Again, I beg the question.. What was the point of claiming our independence from Europe if we become like every other European nation?

"Rockmolder" wrote:



I know. The 1776 healthcare system was way too socialistic for Washington's taste. Every man for himself, because it's the land of the fucking free.

"Formo" wrote:

"Rockmolder" wrote:



I missed the sarcasm too. But my response still applies. 🙂

Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!
Nonstopdrivel
15 years ago
A statement can be sarcastic and still make logical sense. I think your paragraph was more ironic than sarcastic.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
15 years ago
Wade dies, goes to heaven.

His late father (d. 1977) meets him at the pearly gates. Dad says, "You know, son, you almost didn't get in because you spent so much of your lifetime worrying about why people didn't listen to you. The big guy stood up for you, but all those others like Matthew, Mark, Paul, not to mention heaven's token pharisees, they kept pointing out that you weren't listening to the Great Commandment."

Wade replies, "I know, Dad, but those other people. Those people who trust government and worry about fairness all the time are such pinheads. They never listen to a word I say. And those others, those others who disagree with me, they're pinheads too. It's so hard -- I know I'm right. You wouldn't believe how fucked up the USA has become since you died."

LOUD VOICE: WADE, YOU ARE A PINHEAD.

Wade wakes up, wondering where the clouds went and why it is suddenly 500 degrees Fahrenheit and he's chained to a hundred CNN and NYT reporters all yammering about health care in hell.

And hears the fading voice of his dad sighing and saying, sadly, "Damn. Sorry, God, my kid just stayed a fuckup to the end, didn't he?"
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Nonstopdrivel
15 years ago
vikesrule
15 years ago

Wade dies, goes to heaven.

His late father (d. 1977) meets him at the pearly gates. Dad says, "You know, son, you almost didn't get in because you spent so much of your lifetime worrying about why people didn't listen to you. The big guy stood up for you, but all those others like Matthew, Mark, Paul, not to mention heaven's token pharisees, they kept pointing out that you weren't listening to the Great Commandment."

Wade replies, "I know, Dad, but those other people. Those people who trust government and worry about fairness all the time are such pinheads. They never listen to a word I say. And those others, those others who disagree with me, they're pinheads too. It's so hard -- I know I'm right. You wouldn't believe how fucked up the USA has become since you died."

LOUD VOICE: WADE, YOU ARE A PINHEAD.

Wade wakes up, wondering where the clouds went and why it is suddenly 500 degrees Fahrenheit and he's chained to a hundred CNN and NYT reporters all yammering about health care in hell.

And hears the fading voice of his dad sighing and saying, sadly, "Damn. Sorry, God, my kid just stayed a fuckup to the end, didn't he?"

"Wade" wrote:



+1 Wade

You are truly a unique individual, and it would be a great pleasure to meet and converse with you someday!
Porforis
15 years ago

I actually consider Obama and his likes socialists.. But calling him a communist stirs the pot more, and gets the uninformed thinking (well, the smart ones).

"Formo" wrote:



Interestingly ironic comment from someone that worships at the Rush Limbaugh alter of inane rhetoric and blowhard philosophy.

I'm guessing you lust after Ann Coulter as well.

"vikesrule" wrote:



Rush is the man.

Although I haven't listened to him in years mainly because it's a waste of time. It's not like I agree with every topic he rants about. Same with O'Reily(sp).

I don't know much of Coulter, but if my memory serves me right, she looks pretty good. Which is A-OK in my book.

"Formo" wrote:



I don't like Rush, mainly because he's full of himself and because he takes everything to the extremes. I greatly prefer Hannity, while he's dramatic from time to time and is a bit heavy on the Reagan worship, I agree with him more often than not and generally comes off as a full-blooded patriot. Rush just rubs me wrong.

Coulter's face reminds me of a horse.

And before someone goes accusing me of anything, I would remind them that I spend equal time between Fox News and CNN when it comes to news when I'm not in the car. Besides, Rush/Hannity isn't news, it's one long opinion piece.
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