Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago

Palin Exposes the Tea Partiers' True Colors
 

Why trading liberty for security is not consistent with a limited government philosophy.

Steve Chapman | February 11, 2010

The tea party movement started as a welcome protest against the alarming growth of federal spending and federal control. It had a strong anti-statist flavor, or seemed to. But judging from the applause for Sarah Palin at its convention, the movement's suspicion of government power is exceeded only by its worship of government power.

Her keynote address at last week's gathering in Nashville may have been the curtain raiser on a 2012 presidential campaign. "I think that it would be absurd to not consider what it is that I can potentially do to help our country," she told Fox News when asked about that option.

I'm glad it was she and not I who first used the word "absurd" in relation to a possible Palin bid for the White House. Because if her speech made anything clear, it's that the shallow, ill-informed, truth-twisting demagogue seen in the 2008 presidential campaign is all she is and all she wants to be.

When it comes to economic affairs, the tea partiers agree thatas Palin put it"the government that governs least, governs best." When it comes to war and national security, however, her audience apparently thinks there is no such thing as too much government.

The conventioneers applauded when Palin denounced Obama for his approach to the war on terrorists. Why? Because he lets himself be too confined by the annoying limits imposed by the Constitution. "To win that war, we need a commander in chief, not a professor of law," she declares.

Is her point that Obama is allergic to the use of military power or can't bear to fulfill his responsibility as head of the armed forces? That would come as a surprise to Iraqis, who have seen Obama stick to President Bush's timetable for withdrawal.

It would come as a surprise to Afghans, who have seen him embark on a massive buildup of U.S. troops in their country. It would come as a surprise to Pakistanis, who have seen an increase in U.S. drone missile attacks on their soil.

Palin accuses Obama of "reaching out to hostile regimes" and "apologizing for America," with pitiful results: nuclear tests in North Korea, repression in Iran. What she doesn't mentionthough, to be entirely fair, she may not know itis that the first North Korean nuclear test came in 2006 and that before Obama arrived, the mullahs in Tehran did not rule with a gentle, loving hand.

Her chief gripe, though, is that federal agents read the alleged Christmas bomber, Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, his Miranda rights shortly after his arrest, at which point, she claims, he "lawyered up and invoked our U.S. constitutional right to remain silent."

Not for long, he didn't. The FBI says Abdulmutallab provided a wealth of useful information under questioning after he got a lawyer. For that matter, as FBI Director Robert Mueller and National Intelligence Director Dennis Blair said last week, he is still being interrogated.

But facts have never been Palin's strong suit. Nor do they matter, because what infuriates her is the mere idea that constitutional protections would apply to "a terrorist who hates our Constitution and tries to destroy our Constitution."

This is not some bizarre paradox. Lots of people who despise our ConstitutionNazis, communists, Klansmen, Alaska secessionistsenjoy its protections. Does she think the Bill of Rights should apply only to people who share her views?

That would not leave much of the document she and the tea partiers claim to revere.

Besides, Obama didn't invent the heretical notion of accepting limits on the government's latitude with jihadists. The Bush administration turned hundreds of terrorism cases over to the federal courts, without audible complaint from the right. The Supreme Court has ruled that the Constitution extends even to accused foreign terrorists held at Guantanamo.

The advantage of having a former law professor in the Oval Office is that he doesn't have to be tutored in such elementary realities. But Palin evinces a bitter resentment of any information that contradicts her blind faith in a benevolent, all-powerful security regime. She's more than willing to trade liberty for safety.

That went over conspicuously well in Nashville, where tea partiers cheered a leader who places excessive trust in government, disdains constitutional freedoms, and promotes a cult of personality. So remind me: What is it they don't like about Barack Obama?

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zombieslayer
14 years ago
They cheered for Palin? Dang. I was just beginning to like that movement.

Well, scratch that thought.

And yes, facts aren't Palin's strong suit.
My man Donald Driver
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Cheesey
14 years ago
So....what have we learned? That Non gets all his info from "REASON". Anything written elsewhere is ignored. Man....these guys must have you in their pocket.
So......lets see.....Obama wants to take over our healthcare. Making us 100% dependant on the government. Is that the "freedom" you seek?
Yet you blast Palin for wanting to take away our freedom?
Democrats tax EVERYTHING, and never say "NO!" to a new tax. Is that "freedom?"
We live in a different age. The security of our borders is terrible. Anyone that wants to get in here to attack from inside can do it. The left wants to allow anyone access to the country. Their "political correctness" won't allow otherwise.
It's hard to figure out just how much protection we need today, and still allow us our freedom. The left is always screaming to take away our guns. Yet, if we HAVE our guns, we can defend ourselves.
Seems to me the slant of "REASON" leans so far to the left, it should fall over. They ignore any of the "freedoms" the left is grabbing from us, and goes on the attack about national security with Palin.

We can't torture terrorists cause it takes away their "rights". Does that make any sense to you?
The very people that wouldn't blink an eye if your family and friends were blown up by one of their people deserves protection from us?
Does that make ANY sense? It doesn't to me.

Yeah....I'm a terrible "righty" for thinking that way. Even though, if they capture any of our people, they don't think twice about cutting their head's off ON CAMERA so they can "brag" to the world.
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Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago

We can't torture terrorists cause it takes away their "rights". Does that make any sense to you?

"Cheesey" wrote:



So am I to understand from this statement that you do condone torture of terrorism suspects?

I pray you never fall victim to a terrorism investigation then.
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Cheesey
14 years ago
Before the "information age" they did whatever they had to to get information. But then there wasn't the different P.C. groups looking over your shoulder. You think other countries are that nice when they capture OUR people?
It's a nice way to think, but not realistic.
The people they go after arn't genearlly American citizens. It's foreigners that they have info on that would show them to be involved in that kind of activity.
You think i should be more afraid of MY government coming after ME as a terrorist, or some guy from another country that wants to blow me and my family to bits?
Nice that you TRY to make it sound like i should fear my own country more then the REAL terrorists.
Of course, with the democrats running the show, you may be right.
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Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago

You think i should be more afraid of MY government coming after ME as a terrorist, or some guy from another country that wants to blow me and my family to bits?

"Cheesey" wrote:



Do you find it such a preposterous possibility? Have you forgotten the internment of Japanese during World War II? Have you forgotten Ruby Ridge, Waco, and other such instances on our own soil? I know I haven't forgotten the insinuations by officials in the Clinton administration that homeshoolers are "domestic terrorists." I was raised in the homeschooling movement and I well remember how, as a child, those words struck terror in my heart, particularly after Ruby Ridge.

Have you forgotten the story told by Trippster about his friend who received a phone call from the Department of Homeland Security after he sent her a text jokingly warning her not to hijack the plane?

People make mistakes, Cheesey. Virtually all electronic communications in our country are monitored. It is not outside the realm of possibility that a statement you make online or on the phone could be misconstrued and yes, you could find yourself the target of a terrorism investigation.
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Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago

Before the "information age" they did whatever they had to to get information.

"Cheesey" wrote:



This is true. Watch the movie Public Enemies for an example of how police officers used to give suspects (yes, American citizens, too) "the third degree" in routine interrogations. I sincerely hope you are not advocating a return to such tactics.

By the way, George Washington used to punish men he suspected of desertion by tying a cannonball to each foot, binding their hands, and straddling them on beams suspended 20 feet in the air. He would leave them there for hours until they were literally screaming in agony. But guess what? He put a stop to the practice when he came to the conclusion that it was too brutal a form of punishment. He believed in properly punishing misbehavior, but he also had a conscience.
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Cheesey
14 years ago
Did Trippster say his friend was tortured?
Yes....i KNOW that our government isn't perfect. WOW! Like i didn't know that.
The way you talk down to me sometimes is insulting.

Yes, the way American people of Japanese descent were treated was 100% WRONG. Hopefully, we have learned from that. So, should i fear my own government more then terrorist groups? Please, answer that question.
The few instances where our government went nuts (Waco, Ruby Ridge)
stand out. But they don't happen as often. There's alot better chance of me getting killed in a car accident then by my government torturing me.

So....i guess by what you say, we should never use torture. Am i correct?

Yes, it's a horrible thing to have to do, or to even face. But tell me......if doing so would save your loved one's lives, and if the torture isn't done, they die, what would you choose?
And i would like an actual ANSWER to that question.

I bet the families of all the people that lost loved ones on 9/11 would agree that there IS a need for that kind of horrible thing. Maybe it would prevent another attack on us.
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Cheesey
14 years ago

Before the "information age" they did whatever they had to to get information.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



This is true. Watch the movie Public Enemies for an example of how police officers used to give suspects (yes, American citizens, too) "the third degree" in routine interrogations. I sincerely hope you are not advocating a return to such tactics.

By the way, George Washington used to punish men he suspected of desertion by tying a cannonball to each foot, binding their hands, and straddling them on beams suspended 20 feet in the air. He would leave them there for hours until they were literally screaming in agony. But guess what? He put a stop to the practice when he came to the conclusion that it was too brutal a form of punishment. He believed in properly punishing misbehavior, but he also had a conscience.

"Cheesey" wrote:


We are talking about TERRORISTS.
Geez....how you try to turn things.
You know how i feel? Criminals get alot more "rights" then they deserve. When you rob, rape, kill, to me you have given up your "rights". You took away the "rights" of your victims. But the bad guys get better treatment then thier victims. Makes alot of sense, hey?
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zombieslayer
14 years ago
Actually, I'd fear my own government more than terrorist groups.

Disarming people on planes is the reason 9/11 was successful. If Americans haven't been told to be so God damn submissive and that government will rescue them from everything, at the absolute worst, every flight would have ended up like Flight 93 and the Twin Towers would still be standing.

I blame the pussification of America for that. Americans used to be tough mother fuckers that nobody would fuck with. We've become soft.

9/11 should have NEVER happened, and it's just as much the fault of the people weakening our citizens (who used to be the toughest mother fuckers on the planet) as it is the terrorists. When someone is in your house that doesn't belong, you kill him. When someone tries to rob you, you kill him. When someone tries to hijack the plane you're on, you kill him.

That's the attitude we should have had. Had we followed that, 9/11 would have never happened.

Instead, we have an attitude that there are scary terrorists that are out to get us and we need the government to protect us from those scary terrorists. That attitude frankly pisses me off.

Never forget this - a government strong enough to protect you is also strong enough to enslave you. I don't trust a strong government because historically, it has been a very bad thing for outspoken "weirdos" like me.
My man Donald Driver
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