Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
13 years ago



And Wade...the underlying "social problem" we have is the insistence that children be so insulated from every little bump in life that, having never experienced a bad situation or down moment where someone was not there to soothe them or clean up the mess, they possess no coping skills whatsoever. Lifes first punch can floor you, if you have never experienced little bumps along the way....kinda like anti-venom for snake bites.

"digsthepack" wrote:



I don't dispute that this is part of it. Perhaps a really big part of it.

But I do think despair is more complicated a problem, too. Unless one is a complete sociopath, one has desires both to "be unique" and to "belong." These desires, and their potential to conflict, don't go away just because we find ways to cope with them when the conflicts are infrequent or small.

But the problem with a society that emphasizes conformities too much is that those conflicts happen all the time and both big and small. And the conformity pressures force choice more often.

Choices that demand giving up one or the other essential part of the self.

Take me. In many ways, I'm the classic "do my own thing loner." I need a lot of quality time alone. Give me a book, give me a writing or research project, let me play with ideas or work a logic problem, and I am happy as I get. And I can't stand schmoozing or babbling talk that comes at most "social hours" and "networking ops" and "cocktail parties." When I go to such things I end up either being the wallflower, or getting in one long conversation with two other people, or getting drunk. I like quiet. I like silence. I like being away from people.

But at the same time, I need social contact in a way loners do not. I need deep conversations. I need people who respect my ideas, who listen to me rather than just dumping their negative "black hat" criticisms. I need to know that what I value is valued by others who I regularly work and interact with. And that's true not just of what I do "for them", but with respect to what I do when I'm off alone.

Over the years, I've had lots of advice from people. Most of it has taken two forms: Either they tell me to be less of a loner, less anti-social, less self-centered, etc. Or they tell me to worry less about what other people think of me, to just do my own thing and fuck the world, etc.

Almost all of that advice has been well-meaning. But what it has often done is encourage me to move more out of balance. I listen to the "less loner" talk as justification to withdraw more than I should; I listen to the "be more social" talk as justification to worry more about what other people think.

Or, and this can be even worse, but happens more often the older I get, I just respond "they don't just get it" and fail to listen to the advice I should be listening. And not listening, I get more out of whack.

And the farther out of whack I get, the more attractive submission to the despair demon becomes. And the worse my ability to judge becomes.

That's why I call it a demon -- the essence of despair is an impaired ability to judge. And its why "pulling oneself up by one's own bootstraps" is so problematic a solution for those suffering despair: bootstrapping requires a higher-than-normal level of judgment, and the sufferer's level of judgment is lower-than-normal.

To put it another way, despair (or its various "depression" cousins) is more than a lack of coping skills. When social standards for "coping" require not just "balancing" of one's essential needs, but requires us to choose between them, that's encouraging the demon's development.

If we tell people: "Starve without food. Or freeze without a winter coat. Choose," we're essentially telling them to choose the manner of their death.

That's why too much emphasis on social conformity is so dangerous. It tells the individual, 'You can do your own thing and we'll beat you up, or you can conform and kill a part of yourself."
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
digsthepack
13 years ago
Nice post, Wade. I can somewhat empathize with you...I am 47, never married and no children, extremely particular about the people I invite into my life either as friends or romantic partners, and as a result, spend much time alone...which I generally do not mind, but it is not a preference. But, I am also a VERY social person...built in conflict.

For me, the greatest day in my life was the moment I realized I do not really give a shit about what people think of me...so I have eliminated that quandry from my life.

I have known despair, and borderline depression, from the loss of 9 of my closest and dearest friends during the time I was 16 - 30. Shut me down for a long time and inhibited my ability to make significant relationships.

I accept that for all the joy and beauty in life and this world, there will be equal parts pain. If one is only sold rainbows and sunbeams, and are not made aware of the reality of the world, they are being set up for something worse than despair and depression. I think most people accept the fact that pain and loss is a part of life, and not a crippling malady or death sentence. It is OK to hurt...it is part of life. I think for so many of these people...regardless of their source of pain/conflict....they were not prepared for it, and as a result, did not know what to do with the emotions or how to handle them. Unfortunate results of that frailty is what we see in the news now.
State Motto: "Wisconsin, our serial murderers eat their kill!"
4PackGirl
13 years ago
i don't know if having a child prepared is all there is to it. i have twins with very different personalities & ways of dealing with things. they have had the same upbringing but are vastly different little guys.

my mom is an identical twin - she & her sister could not be more different in the way they've approached life.

heck my brother & i - we're both adopted from different families, raised by the same parents, in the same way. he's 2 years older than me & when bullies picked on him, I'M the one who beat them up. i've always been the 'strong' one in our family.

apparently it's part of our personalities from the time we're born how we deal with or don't deal with life in general. or maybe it's the roles we take on as we're growing up that make us the people we are today.

yes being prepared for pain & loss is important but is that all there is to it?
DakotaT
13 years ago
Personally, I think about 7/8 of the population in this country are a bunch of candy asses. And the 1/8 in the country I respect are living in nursing homes with dimensia.

I thought I had been through enough BS in my life with depression, alcohlosm, an abusive father, growing up in poverty, and putting up with 6 months of winter every year. But all that faded into nothing when in July my daughter came back into her ICU room with a 10 inch incision in the back of her skull. This situation really brought some focus back to my family's life. And in some ways, it has been a blessing no matter how unfair it is to Mia.

I find myself openly laughing at the fuss made over these pithy little political issues. What I really want to do is beat the shit out some of these blowhards in the media that think they have answers to offer.

I don't care if gay people want to get married, and I sure as hell don't support ostracising these people. Doesn't the world have enough ugliness in it, that we have to waste time, energy, and money on these trivial matters?
UserPostedImage
4PackGirl
13 years ago
wow...perspective brought to you by dakota!!
DakotaT
13 years ago

wow...perspective brought to you by dakota!!

"4PackGirl" wrote:



It was not my intention to make anybody feel bad or sorry for me. Sympathy belongs between shit and syphilis in the dictionary, and there only.

My intention was to mock this thread as frivilous BS that isn't worth some people's time who have real problems.

I am not impervious to empathy for any situation, but you better come with more substance than being in an unfair tax bracket or complaining about someone from another country doing a job you wouldn't be willing to do yourself.
UserPostedImage
Zero2Cool
13 years ago

I find myself openly laughing at the fuss made over these pithy little political issues. What I really want to do is beat the shit out some of these blowhards in the media that think they have answers to offer.

I don't care if gay people want to get married, and I sure as hell don't support ostracising these people. Doesn't the world have enough ugliness in it, that we have to waste time, energy, and money on these trivial matters?

"DakotaT" wrote:



I often wonder if these "support" groups cause more problems than good. My personal thinking, most of them have too much time on their hands and need to find a real hobby.
UserPostedImage
DakotaT
13 years ago

I often wonder if these "support" groups cause more problems than good. My personal thinking, most of them have too much time on their hands and need to find a real hobby.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



So they are basically hypocrites with nothing to do. Pretty good observation.

Volunteers are good, but my problem with most of them is that they need to find themselves on the front page of the paper too much. Ruins everything they are trying to accomplish.
UserPostedImage
Formo
  • Formo
  • Veteran Member Topic Starter
13 years ago


I find myself openly laughing at the fuss made over these pithy little political issues. What I really want to do is beat the shit out some of these blowhards in the media that think they have answers to offer.

I don't care if gay people want to get married, and I sure as hell don't support ostracising these people. Doesn't the world have enough ugliness in it, that we have to waste time, energy, and money on these trivial matters?

"DakotaT" wrote:



You never made a fuss over these issues prior to Mia (at least, not that I've experienced). So this is kinda a moot point.

Whether you like it or not, these 'pithy' little political issues, if not challenged, can morph this nation into something you wouldn't want Mia to grow up in. Hence the 'fuss' made over them.

How about this.. You worry about taking care of your baby girl and the rest of the ladies in your life (wifey, daughters), and let those of us with the passion for it worry about the pithy little political issues, mmk? 🙂
UserPostedImage
Thanks to TheViking88 for the sig!!
DakotaT
13 years ago

Whether you like it or not, these 'pithy' little political issues, if not challenged, can morph this nation into something you wouldn't want Mia to grow up in. Hence the 'fuss' made over them.

How about this.. You worry about taking care of your baby girl and the rest of the ladies in your life (wifey, daughters), and let those of us with the passion for it worry about the pithy little political issues, mmk? =)

"Formo" wrote:



That's fine Formo, keep letting them wag the dog, with whatever they come up with. You're the one enlightened. :thumbright:
UserPostedImage
Fan Shout
Martha Careful (10-May) : 1. this is true of all our linemen. 2. His run block is fine. 3. If all OL played like he has, we would win SB.
beast (10-May) : Meyers pass blocking is really good, his run blocking is really not.
Zero2Cool (9-May) : Packers have claimed DE Spencer Waege off of waivers from the 49ers and waived DT Rodney Mathews.
Zero2Cool (9-May) : And the OL protections seem to be good.
Zero2Cool (9-May) : I really don't know lol. I don't see him getting blown up.
Zero2Cool (9-May) : -3 buwahhhahaaha
Mucky Tundra (9-May) : 4th
Zero2Cool (9-May) : because he's 1st
Mucky Tundra (9-May) : Myers isn't even the 3rd best C on the roster atm
Martha Careful (9-May) : I am not sure I understand the Myers hate. He was consistently our third best lineman. RG and LT were worse.
beast (9-May) : Just saying I don't think moving Myers would help Myers.
beast (9-May) : Center is usually considered the easiest position physically if you can handle the snap stuff.
Mucky Tundra (8-May) : Bust it is then
Zero2Cool (8-May) : Context. Sounds like Myers won't be cross-trained. C or bust.
Mucky Tundra (8-May) : @BookOfEli_NFL Packers pass game coordinator, Jason Vrable said that Jayden Reed and Dontayvion Wicks shared a placed in Florida while train
Mucky Tundra (8-May) : For now...
Zero2Cool (8-May) : Packers go about evaluating their "best five," OL coach Luke Butkus makes on thing clear: "Josh Myers is our center."
beast (8-May) : Though I'm a bit surprised letting go of CBs, I thought we needed more not less
beast (8-May) : It was confusing with two DB Anthony Johnson anyways
Zero2Cool (8-May) : Packers actually had Ray Lewis on the phone.
Zero2Cool (8-May) : Packers wanted to draft Ray Lewis. Ravens stole him.
Martha Careful (6-May) : Happy 93rd Birthday to the Greatest Baseball Player of All-Time...Willie Mays
Zero2Cool (6-May) : Walter Stanely's son
buckeyepackfan (6-May) : and released CB Anthony Johnson and DL Deandre Johnson and waived/injured WR Thyrick Pitts (thigh-rick).
buckeyepackfan (6-May) : The Green Bay Packers have signed WR Julian Hicks, OL Lecitus Smith (luh-SEET-us) and WR Dimitri Stanley
Zero2Cool (6-May) : Petty, but it's annoying me how the NFL is making the schedule release an event.
Mucky Tundra (4-May) : @mattschneidman Matt LaFleur on how he tore his pec: “Got in a fight with the bench press. I lost.”
Zero2Cool (3-May) : Jordan Love CAN sign an extension as of today. Might tak weeks/months though
TheKanataThrilla (3-May) : Packers decline 5th year option for Stokes
Mucky Tundra (3-May) : @ProFootballTalk Jaylen Warren: Steelers' special teams coach has discussed Justin Fields returning kicks.
Zero2Cool (2-May) : Season officially ending tonight for Bucks ... sad face
Zero2Cool (2-May) : Giannis Antetokounmpo is listed as out for tonight's game.
dfosterf (2-May) : Surprisingly low initially is my guess cap wise, but gonna pay the piper after that
dfosterf (2-May) : The number on Love is going to be brutal.
Zero2Cool (2-May) : May 3rd. Extension day for Jordan Love. (soonest)
Zero2Cool (1-May) : USFL MVP QB Alex McGough moved to WR. So that's why no WR drafted!
earthquake (1-May) : Packers draft starters at safety ever few years. Collins, Clinton-Dix, Savage
beast (1-May) : Why can't the rookies be a day 1 starter? Especially when we grabbed 3 of them at the position
dfosterf (1-May) : Not going to be shocked if Gilmore goes to the Lions.
dfosterf (1-May) : I hear you dhazer, but my guess would be Gilmore Colts and Howard Vikings from what little has been reported.
Mucky Tundra (30-Apr) : S learn from McKinney who learns from Hafley who learns from the fans. Guaranteed Super Bowl
Zero2Cool (30-Apr) : could*
Zero2Cool (29-Apr) : Safeties should learn from Xavier.
dhazer (29-Apr) : And what about grabbing a Gilmore or Howard at CB ? Those are all Free Agents left
dhazer (29-Apr) : out of curiosity do they try and sign Simmons or Hyde to let these young safeties learn from, they can't be day 1 starters.
Zero2Cool (29-Apr) : I miss having Sam Shields.
Zero2Cool (29-Apr) : Not that he's making excuses, just pointing it out
Zero2Cool (29-Apr) : That's for dang sure. Make our erratic kicker have no excuse!
packerfanoutwest (28-Apr) : having a great long snapper is gold
Zero2Cool (28-Apr) : LaFleur looking like he had some weight. Coachin will do that lol
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2023 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 10 @ 3:25 PM
Bears
Sunday, Sep 17 @ 12:00 PM
Falcons
Sunday, Sep 24 @ 12:00 PM
SAINTS
Thursday, Sep 28 @ 7:15 PM
LIONS
Monday, Oct 9 @ 7:15 PM
Raiders
Sunday, Oct 22 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Sunday, Oct 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Nov 5 @ 12:00 PM
RAMS
Sunday, Nov 12 @ 12:00 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 19 @ 12:00 PM
CHARGERS
Thursday, Nov 23 @ 11:30 AM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 3 @ 7:20 PM
CHIEFS
Monday, Dec 11 @ 7:15 PM
Giants
Sunday, Dec 17 @ 12:00 PM
BUCCANEERS
Sunday, Dec 24 @ 12:00 PM
Panthers
Sunday, Dec 31 @ 7:20 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 7 @ 3:25 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Jan 14 @ 3:30 PM
Cowboys
Saturday, Jan 20 @ 7:15 PM
49ers
Recent Topics
11h / Green Bay Packers Talk / greengold

13h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

18h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

10-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

10-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

9-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

7-May / Packers Draft Threads / Mucky Tundra

7-May / Packers Draft Threads / Mucky Tundra

5-May / Green Bay Packers Talk / greengold

5-May / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

5-May / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

5-May / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

5-May / Packers Draft Threads / beast

5-May / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

5-May / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2024 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.