Packers decline leftovers· Page 4

beast
Select Member

14 years ago

Here are the possible candidates for the final 4 actives.. Lets mark at least one more corner, another TE and lets say a Spitz or another corner.. that leaves one spot.

You don't think we could somehow squeeze in a returner in one of their places without much issue.. I guess I don't see that as a huge issue.. letting one of the 45 be a primary returner and maybe lets say an emergency RB.


72	Spitz, Jason 	C/G 	
24	Bush, Jarrett 	CB 	
22	Lee, Pat 	CB 	
33	Underwood, B. 	CB 	
98	Wilson, C.J. 	DE 	
45	Johnson, Quinn 	FB 	
67	McDonald, Nick 	G 	
74	Newhouse, M. 	G/T 	
58	Zombo, Frank 	LB 	
83	Crabtree, Tom 	TE 	
81	Quarless, Andrew 	TE 	
16	Swain, Brett 	WR

"pack93z" wrote:

You got to have a back-up Center active so I think Spitz is a lock. I would probably have at least 4 CB active... is Underwood healthy again? If not Bush was practiced higher string than Lee was last time I heard. Crabtree is on the STs return units...

And the last spot for me would come down to 3rd FB / 5 WR or 4th OLB...

Pack93z
Select Member

14 years ago

#32

"beast" wrote:

One could flip out a Peprah for a corner.. or a Martin..

Point being that we could slide in a KR/PR/HB(WR)(CB) without much of an issue..

"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"

Zero2Cool
Elite Member

14 years ago

#33

Ahh.. and here I thought I could suit up 70... really there are gameday inactives.. ::roll:

You make it sound like it isn't possible to carry a specialist as a returner.. many teams do. Oh.. and we can carry a LS but my god, forget about carrying a returner first, special teamer second, and some emergency positional help.. lol.

"pack93z" wrote:

I put that out there as something to consider, not as education for you.

I never once said it was impossible to carry a return specialist, never, not a single once did I even remotely suggest that.

This is unlikely due to the differences between the two positions, but I'd like us to have a fourth spot used for special teams.

K
P
LS
KR/PR

Field position is always spoken about, but yet the men returning the ball to advance said position are usually utility players.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

Step out of the smartass suit and please follow me here as the suit looks better on me.

I think the reward for using Greg and/or Tramon is greater than the risk this year because of the high expectations and realism of said expectations of our season. It almost feels like Super Bowl or bust to me.

We have an offensive juggernaut and a defense that when its on, is very on. Our special teams (field position) is easily our weakest aspect. To help shore that up, you put in players who are not just utility guys who will fair catch the ball. You plug players in whom you feel have good open field awareness and can make people miss.

How many teams are legit Super Bowl contenders and are just throwing Antonio Chatman type returners back there if they have what could be a more talented returner to obtain better field position?

This line of thinking is why I did not like Charles Woodson returning punts in '07. I didn't feel we had it in us to go the distance. I felt we got a lucky bounce on several games and it wasn't worth Charles getting an ACL or worse.

If you're saying the majority of returners are NOT starters, I agree (see self quoted comment).
If you're saying the majority of the GOOD returners do not have a key role on the team's success outside of special teams, I disagree.

Hopefully I've made my stance a little more clear this time around.

zombieslayer, read the last sentence in what you quoted me on.

Pack93z
Select Member

14 years ago

#34

Step out of the smartass suit and please follow me here as the suit looks better on me.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

LOL..

I think the reward for using Greg and/or Tramon is greater than the risk this year because of the high expectations and realism of said expectations of our season. It almost feels like Super Bowl or bust to me.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

But that is a large part of my point.. if one of the two of those guys go down, maybe I value them more than you, it seriously puts a damper on the Superbowl part of our run.

Think this way.. what is easier to replace.. a dynamic receiver, and very solid cover corner or a returner? Returner hands down.

We have an offensive juggernaut and a defense that when its on, is very on. Our special teams (field position) is easily our weakest aspect. To help shore that up, you put in players who are not just utility guys who will fair catch the ball. You plug players in whom you feel have good open field awareness and can make people miss.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

If our offense is as good as advertised, a couple of yards, the average is probably someplace around 6 to 8.. verses losing a vital player on our core teams is not even a contest. That would sway if either were a dynamic elite returner, maybe it is closer..

How many teams are legit Super Bowl contenders and are just throwing Antonio Chatman type returners back there if they have what could be a more talented returner to obtain better field position?

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

I will try and go back through that list of returners last season and quantify that.. but first blush.. the majority are specialists..

If you're saying the majority of returners are NOT starters, I agree (see self quoted comment).
If you're saying the majority of the GOOD returners do not have a key role on the team's success outside of special teams, I disagree.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

See above..

Now to make my point clear.. I think punt returns put a player at more risk than kick returns.. and I am okay with Jackson and Nelson handling those.. throw either into the punt return role and I have less of a complaint.. I still don't see the value of say Swain verses another young receiver that has return skills..

"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"

Zero2Cool
Elite Member

14 years ago

#35

PR I think too is far more at an injury risk than KR. Which, I don't know how valid that is, because as PR you're pretty much standing still or just starting, but KR you're going full speed into others at full speed.

I think Jennings would be easier to replace than Tramon, ONLY because of Jordy and James Jones and Finley.

I think we have a larger drop off at CB than WR, easily.

I'd rather Swain be back there. I think he could do some good for us.

You are right, what's the difference on average, 6 to 8 yards? Then I think, Desmond Howard and his importance and that point means nothing to me. I'm back to square one thinking field position is key.

Greg C.
Registered

14 years ago

#36

I just don't get the "Ted Thompson's not Dan Snyder, hurrah" argument. Those are not the only two options, folks.

MOST teams in the NFL do not follow Snyder's approach. Most teams in the NFL do not follow Thompson's approach either.

When it comes to building a football team, Snyder has proven himself a moron. But there are 30 other owners/GMs in the league. Are they all idiots because they don't take Thompson's approach?

If you want to argue that Thompson's approach is the best one, that's fine. But, please, don't use the Snyder comparison as your evidence. Explain why his approach is better than Belichek's or Newsome's or whoever.

"Wade" wrote:

If the teams that were the opposite of the Redskins were all lousy, then I would agree with you. But it seems like the Packers are in good company, which makes me feel better about Thompson's approach.

As you say, there are lots of ways to build a team. That's the exact argument I use in defending Thompson. You don't have to sign ANY high-priced free agents if you don't want to. All that matters are the results, and Thompson's results have mostly been good. If the team falls flat on its face this season, I will adjust my opinion accordingly.

blank

warhawk
Senior Member

14 years ago

#37

First of all it's Thompson that's built a very strong roster so to start in on him about a kick returner is like urinating next to an elephant that's been in the water all day. I mean c'mon.

Secondly the guy that wrote at least the first issue of this at the top of the thread is wrong. When the team NEEDED to use FA, or a trade, or a no-name pickup, he did that unless Woodson, Pickett, Grant, or, Atari for some reason don't count.

As some one else put it if you bring somebody in you have to take somebody off so it better work or the team just got weaker. My guess is Thompson opted no on this because a guy that only returns kicks means a player out that probably helped on both coverage and return teams and added depth somewhere. Going the other way means the return guy better be a DIFFERENCE maker to get what you pay for and there's only a few guys out there worthy in my book.

"The train is leaving the station."

Pack93z
Select Member

14 years ago

#38

First of all it's Thompson that's built a very strong roster so to start in on him about a kick returner is like urinating next to an elephant that's been in the water all day. I mean c'mon.

"warhawk" wrote:

But doesn't it speak volumes alone that this is the biggest issue on the team?

No one is calling Ted a failure.. more so that we have a hole that the current fix is placing a starter in that role.. if the spade is shaped like a spade and it is a spade.. then call it a spade. Nothing more.

I don't like Tramon or Jennings back there.. and if they don't have confidence enough in anyone else on the roster to do that job, then IMO, we have a problem.

After all this time of praising his moves more than criticizing.. I personally fail to see the reason why it is an issue to point out and discussion our shortcomings.

I have always thought it best to know our weakness, admit it and try to fix it..

"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"

Zero2Cool
Elite Member

14 years ago

#39

It's a shame we didn't do anything to find a returner or try any players at the position other than starters. I'm just bummed we didn't find another Desmond Howard.

Stevetarded
Registered

14 years ago

#40

I'd prefer Tramon returning punts than Greg, because if Greg bursts open for 40 yards, he might be winded on the next play which would render him a decoy and removes himself as an option. Not the biggest concern, but a thought nonetheless.

"zombieslayer" wrote:

Are you implying that Wes Welker has better lungs than His Holiness Gregorious Jennings? :physassult: :xcensoredx: :wickedfart:

Welker returned over 200 punts in his career including being the punt returner for the Pats, and leading the NFL in receptions last year. Returning punts doesn't seem to wind Welker much.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:

Welker doesn't ever have to stretch the field like Jennings, he just has to run 4 or 5 yards and catch the ball then fall down.

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