Pack93z
14 years ago
Non... I am done with the topic.

I agree, that there was reasonable doubt built into the incident. I agree with the matter not being criminally pursued. I have stated that several times throughout the many topics.

I also believe that the accuser (I won't use "victim" and haven't because that can't be proved that she is a "victim") isn't without fault in this incident.

With that stated, I refuse to place the entire blame as some seem to be doing on the accuser either. The incident didn't occur without Ben being party.. that much is clear.. in was involved in some capacity.. whether he violated her or not.

So we sit here, with a he said.. she said incident in which all the factors point to the situation being tipped in Ben's favor. Bodyguards, police responding to the call, and club employees all seemed to favor Ben.. the only other accounts are of the accusers friends.

Add it all total.. at worst I put as much blame on Ben as the accuser.. and I refuse to throw out the incident because of the "drunk sorority girl" stereotype that is being thrown around in the case.

We will never know for sure if he violated her or not.. only he knows that.. and based on his condition (drunk) as well.

So in conclusion.. just as James Lofton years ago, I will always hold a shadow of doubt above his head. Not guilty.. but I will always hold a question about his character.

Now.. combine that with a particular pattern that seems to follow Ben.. it increases that shadow of doubt on his character.

Now to bring it all home.. I wouldn't trust him near my daughter.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Pack93z
14 years ago
Oh.. and the final conclusion is I think the NFL took the right course of action overall..

There is a pattern of behavior that is troubling Ben.. thus bringing issues to the NFL as a whole.

They have every right to try and change that behavior via the avenues available to them.. which is not allowing him to work for a period of time as a penalty for his actions.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
RaiderPride
14 years ago
Does anyone know exactly how much money in game day checks he will lose if it indeed goes 6 games?
""People Will Probably Never Remember What You Said, And May Never Remember What You Did. However, People Will Always Remember How You Made Them Feel."
Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago
Roughly $2.8 million.

The more I read about this situation, the less any of it makes sense. I read an article last night that said according to the girl (or more probably, her friends), Roethlisberger had unprotected sex with her. Yet insufficient DNA was found to produce a profile. Someone is lying, and I don't think it's the guy who admitted they "fooled around" a bit.

All I know is that given a situation in which there is an absence of forensic evidence and the alleged victim can't get her story straight, I will always trust the word of the accused over the accuser. If you're going to make life-changing accusations like this, you damn well better have your ducks in a row, and these girls didn't.
UserPostedImage
Pack93z
14 years ago
Ever think that maybe Ben pulled out and shot his wad elsewhere? You know on the bathroom stall that was cleaned? ;)

Sorry.. just had to respond to the lack of evidence statement.

BTW.. speaking of inconsistent stories.. Ben's version is suspect to.. you know.. "She hit her head".. yet no sign at the hospital. ;)

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5338512&ps=rs 

Laurie Levenson is a former federal prosecutor. She now teaches at Loyola Law School here in Los Angeles. Welcome to the program.

BRAND: And it is possible to successfully prosecute a rape case without DNA evidence?

Prof. LEVENSON: It's possible, in fact it was done all the time. But that was pre-DNA era. You know, it's possible to have a rape where no DNA is left. For example, if the suspect wears a condom, if the suspect uses an instrument. If it just happens that the DNA is not deposited there, could not be tested, or is contaminated, there are lots of explanations. On the other hand, don't forget the defense only has to raise a reasonable doubt, and in this era, where people and the jurors expect DNA, it's easier to do if the prosecutors don't have the DNA.


"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Cheesey
14 years ago
You'd think by now these high paid guys would realize that if they want to stay out of trouble, don't go to the places where this kind of stuff MIGHT happen.
If they did that, they wouldn't have to worry.
UserPostedImage
Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago
If only that were so. How many celebrities' spouses call the police on them after vastly overblown domestic incidents? Just this past week, some pro player's wife called the cops after "he lunged at her" and "stepped on her foot." He didn't lay a hand on her, yet he was charged with domestic assault.

You're not safe anywhere.
UserPostedImage
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beast (13h) : So far the college playoffs have sucked... One team absolutely dominates the other
beast (16h) : Well even if you weren't positive towards a guy, you wouldn't nessarily want to tell the media that (if they don't know about it)
Martha Careful (16h) : I think MLF want Love to look past the end half issues, and feel good about his play. Our coaches generally keep a very positive tone.
beast (16h) : I think a great running game will do that for most QBs
packerfanoutwest (17h) : Coach Matt LaFleur has said quarterback Jordan Love is playing the best football of his career.
beast (21-Dec) : Oh, that's how you keep beating buckeye, with cheating
Zero2Cool (20-Dec) : There is a rule that if your name starts with 'b' you lose 15 points. Hey, I don't make the rules, I just enforce them!
wpr (20-Dec) : and then there is Beast. Running away with it all.
beast (20-Dec) : As of tonight, 3 way tie for 2nd in Pick'em, that battle is interesting!
beast (20-Dec) : Lions vs Vikings could be the main last game as it could determine division winners or #1 vs #2 seed
Mucky Tundra (20-Dec) : Or if KC needs to win for the #1 seed
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Mucky Tundra (20-Dec) : The entirety of week 18 being listed as flex is weird
Zero2Cool (19-Dec) : Matt LaFleur today says unequivocally "Ted Thompson had nothing to do with the drafting of Jordan Love."
Zero2Cool (19-Dec) : Apparently, the editing is what pieces comments together. That Ted thing ... fake news.
Zero2Cool (19-Dec) : LaFleur "opportunity that Ted Thompson thought was too good to pass up"
Zero2Cool (19-Dec) : Jordan Love pick was Ted Thompson's idea.
Mucky Tundra (19-Dec) : Kyle Shanahan on signing De'Vondre Campbell as a FA last offseason: “We obviously made a mistake.”
packerfanoutwest (19-Dec) : Alexander’s last season with GB
Martha Careful (18-Dec) : if I were a professional athlete, I would probably look to see who the agent is for Kirk Cousins and then use him
beast (18-Dec) : $100 million fully guaranteed Kirk Cousins gets benched for rookie
Mucky Tundra (18-Dec) : a lower case b
Mucky Tundra (18-Dec) : The real lie is how beast capitalized his name in his message while it's normally spelled with
packerfanoutwest (18-Dec) : haha that's a lie
beast (17-Dec) : Despite what lies other might tell, Beast didn't hate the Winter Warnings, it felt refreshing to Beast for some reason.
Zero2Cool (17-Dec) : whiteout uniforms in general are pretty lame and weak. NFL greed at it's worst
Martha Careful (17-Dec) : The Viking uniforms, the whiteout uniforms specifically absolutely suck
beast (17-Dec) : Thanks Zero2Cool, looks a lot better now
beast (17-Dec) : Seems like someone has a crush on me, can't stop talking about me
Zero2Cool (17-Dec) : Should be gooder now. The forum default theme went to goofy land.
Zero2Cool (17-Dec) : What the hell
packerfanoutwest (17-Dec) : yeah beast hates the Winter Warning Unies
Mucky Tundra (16-Dec) : Okay I'm glad to know it's not just something happening to me lol
Mucky Tundra (16-Dec) : Zero, did you copy the Packers uniforms from last night and white out the board?
beast (16-Dec) : Oh crap, is the board going to the Winter Warning Uniforms too?!? It's all white on white right now!
Zero2Cool (16-Dec) : WR Odell Beckham Jr is officially a free agent after clearing waivers.
Zero2Cool (16-Dec) : Packers are 6th in sacks.
Zero2Cool (16-Dec) : RB David Montgomery will undergo season-ending knee surgery.
Mucky Tundra (16-Dec) : Dan Campbell on onside kick with 12 minutes left: In hindsight, wish I didn’t do that
Zero2Cool (16-Dec) : They have that whole 12th man thing so ...
Zero2Cool (16-Dec) : Of the times we've played there, I just can't recall hearing our fans.
wpr (16-Dec) : Well done jdlax. Well done.
wpr (16-Dec) : I think more likely to be Pack fans that live in the area.
wpr (16-Dec) : Pack fans represent. I pointed it out early in the game to my wife. Announcers said Packers travel well.
Zero2Cool (16-Dec) : That was crazy to hear go pack go in Seattle of all plays. That 12 man thing an all
Mucky Tundra (16-Dec) : jdlax, good man!
jdlax (16-Dec) : Mucky, there were too many of us there to credit any single one but for sure i was 60% responsible.
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