zombieslayer
14 years ago
Well, so much for Jefferson being Christian.

Anyone know about the other Founding Fathers? I'll readily admit the only one I thoroughly researched was Jefferson. I just heard from other people (who happen to be professional historians) that the majority were Deists too, and NOT Judeo-Christians contrary to popular belief.
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Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago
John Witherspoon, a signatory of the Declaration of Independence, was a devout Presbyterian minister.

The Committees of Correspondence, headed by Samuel Adams, were famous for the rallying cry: "No King but King Jesus." (Reportedly, at the battle of Lexington, when Major Pitcairn famously enjoined the rebels "in the Name of King George the Sovereign of England" to "Disperse, ye villains, ye villains, disperse! Why don't ye lay down your arms?" John Hancock and John Adams responded, "We recognize no Sovereign but God and no King but Jesus!"

Jonathan Trumbull, a crown-appointed governor, wrote: "If you ask an American, who is his master? He will tell you he has none, nor any governor but Jesus Christ."

The men of Marlborough, Massachusetts unanimously declared in 1773: "Death is more eligible than slavery, a free-born people are not required by the religion of Jesus Christ to submit to tyranny, but may make use of such power as God has given them to recover and support their laws and liberties . . ."

Samuel Adams wrote: "We have this day restored the Sovereign to whom all men ought to be obedient. He reigns in heaven and from the rising to the setting of the sun, let His kingdom come." Definitely not a Deist thing to say.

Benjamin Rush, signer of the Declaration and Surgeon General of the Continental Army, wrote: "I have alternately been called an Aristocrat and a Democrat. I am neither. I am a Christocrat." He also said: "The only foundation for . . . a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments." In that era, "Religion" almost always meant "Christianity."

Patrick Henry wrote: "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians: not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ."

Yes, there were very many Christians among the Founding Fathers. They weren't all Deists like Jefferson and Franklin nor all atheists like Thomas Paine.
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14 years ago

Yes, there were very many Christians among the Founding Fathers. They weren't all Deists like Jefferson and Franklin nor all atheists like Thomas Paine.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



Considering where the people were coming from and the era, it would be phenomenally bizarre for them NOT to be Christians.
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Nonstopdrivel
14 years ago
I don't understand your point. The fact that they were Christians is for me beside the point. Whether or not they were Christians, they had the wisdom to give us a secular state, not a religious republic.
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zombieslayer
14 years ago

I don't understand your point. The fact that they were Christians is for me beside the point. Whether or not they were Christians, they had the wisdom to give us a secular state, not a religious republic.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



And thank God for that. From a historical perspective, theocracies have ALWAYS sucked.

As for the era, it wasn't as religious as people think. There was a lot of hatred of organized religion as a lot of it was about as corrupt as today's mafia, or worse.

Thanks for the info, Non. I guess it was more a mix. Not that it matters. I don't care what religion anyone is as long as they abide by the Bill of Rights.
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Formo
14 years ago

I don't understand your point. The fact that they were Christians is for me beside the point. Whether or not they were Christians, they had the wisdom to give us a secular state, not a religious republic.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



And thank God for that. From a historical perspective, theocracies have ALWAYS sucked.

As for the era, it wasn't as religious as people think. There was a lot of hatred of organized religion as a lot of it was about as corrupt as today's mafia, or worse.

"Nonstopdrivel" wrote:



Yeah. That was the reason the Union succeeded from Britain in the first place.

Thanks for the info, Non. I guess it was more a mix. Not that it matters. I don't care what religion anyone is as long as they abide by the Bill of Rights.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



I tried telling you that in another thread!!! lol There was a big mix, but the majority of the Founding Fathers were considered Christians.
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MontanaBob
14 years ago
Regardless what everyone has to say, Tebow's prayer didn't seem to help his Wonderlic score. 3rd or 4th round pick here.
Anyone for a Weenie Roast?
zombieslayer
14 years ago
What was his wonderlic score?

Formo - Yeah, but Non had more specific examples. ;)
Sorry, I'm an amateur historian so I like examples.
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Rockmolder
14 years ago

What was his wonderlic score?

Formo - Yeah, but Non had more specific examples. ;)
Sorry, I'm an amateur historian so I like examples.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Tim+Tebow+Wonderlic 

22. But that's no biggie. A smart QB is great, but Marino scored a 15. Kelly scored 15. Fitzpatrick scored 49 or something.
Zero2Cool
14 years ago
I care more about football smarts than book smarts.
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Fan Shout
wpr (20m) : Watching bares fans melt down over how putrid their team is, so enjoyable. It's the gift that keeps on giving.
Mucky Tundra (7h) : The Seattle Seahawks defeat the Chicago Bears 6-3. Jason Myers had 6 RBIs for Seattle while Cairo Santos had 3 RBI for Chicago
beast (8h) : Not nessarily, he might of been injured either way. He's playing about 50% of the games the last 4 years
Zero2Cool (14h) : If they'd been more patient with him, he'd be back already. Putting him out there vs Bears caused him to tweak it and here we are.
packerfanoutwest (15h) : well this is his last season with the PAck, book it
beast (16h) : Sounds like no Alexander (again), I'm wondering if his time with the Packers is done
Zero2Cool (23h) : Could ban beast and I still don't think anyone catches him.
Mucky Tundra (26-Dec) : Houston getting dog walked by Baltimore
packerfanoutwest (25-Dec) : Feliz Navidad!
Zero2Cool (25-Dec) : Merry Christmas!
beast (25-Dec) : Merry Christmas 🎄🎁
beast (24-Dec) : Sounds like no serious injuries from the Saints game and Jacobs and Watson should play in the Vikings game
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : both games Watson missed, Packers won
Martha Careful (24-Dec) : I hope all of you have a Merry Christmas!
Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Oh I know about Jacobs, I just couldn't pass up an opportunity to mimic Zero lol
buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : Jacobs was just sat down, Watson re-injured that knee that kept him out 1 game earlier
buckeyepackfan (24-Dec) : I needed .14 that's. .14 points for the whole 4th quarter to win and go to the SB. Lol
Mucky Tundra (24-Dec) : Jacobs gonna be OK???
Zero2Cool (24-Dec) : Watson gonna be OK???
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : Inactives tonight for the Pack: Alexander- knee Bullard - ankle Williams - quad Walker -ankle Monk Heath
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : No Jaire, but hopefully the front 7 destroys the line of scrimmage & forces Rattler into a few passes to McKinney.
packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : minny could be #1 seed and the Lions #5 seed
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : We'd have same Division and Conference records. Strength of schedule we edge them
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I just checked. What tie breaker?
bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes its possible but unlikely. If we do get the 5th, we face the NFCS winner
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ahh, ok.
bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes due to tie breaker
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I mean, unlikely, yes, but mathematically, 5th is possible by what I'm reading.
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : If Vikings lose out, Packers win out, Packers get 5th, right?
bboystyle (23-Dec) : Minny isnt going to lose out so 5th seed is out of the equation. We are playing for the 6th or 7th seed which makes no difference
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, the ad revenue goes to the broadcast company but they gotta pay to air the game on their channel/network
beast (23-Dec) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th
beast (23-Dec) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.
bboystyle (23-Dec) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno
beast (23-Dec) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?
packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I see what you did there Mucky
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : dammit. 3:25pm
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Upon receiving the news about Luke Musgrave, I immediately fell to the ground
Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Yeah baby!
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : LUKE MUSGRAVE PLAYING TONIGHT~!~~~~WOWHOAAOHAOAA yah
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I wanna kill new QB's ... blitz the crap out of them.
beast (23-Dec) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : However, we seem to struggle vs new QB's
Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.
packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : ok I stand corrected
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