beast
  • beast
  • Select Member Topic Starter
a year ago

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The Green Bay Packers were coming off two of the best run-game defending games in memory. On Sunday, the Pittsburgh Steelers ran roughshod.

Continue Reading @ Sports Illustrated 

Sports Illustrated wrote:



The run defense is the run defense, until they change something major, like the talent and/or the coaching
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go.pack.go.
a year ago
MLF was asked in a press conference why they line up with only 2 down linemen when they’re in nickel defense, while the offense is in a 3 TE set. MLF went off on the reporter, he was a total ass hole about it and very condescending. I believe it was his Monday presser if anybody wants to go watch.

I’m about tired of MLF defending Joe Barry and basically putting all the blame on the players. It’s making me wonder if MLF is as much of a problem as Barry is. We’ll see if they retain him at the end of the year, that will prove that MLF is an incapable head coach.
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buckeyepackfan
a year ago
FIRE EVERYBODY!!!

That solves all the problems!
I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!
umair_010
a year ago

It’s making me wonder if MLF is as much of a problem as Barry is. We’ll see if they retain him at the end of the year, that will prove that MLF is an incapable head coach.

Originally Posted by: go.pack.go. 



!!!!!DING DING DING DING!!!!
Zero2Cool
a year ago

MLF was asked in a press conference why they line up with only 2 down linemen when they’re in nickel defense, while the offense is in a 3 TE set. MLF went off on the reporter, he was a total ass hole about it and very condescending. I believe it was his Monday presser if anybody wants to go watch.

I’m about tired of MLF defending Joe Barry and basically putting all the blame on the players. It’s making me wonder if MLF is as much of a problem as Barry is. We’ll see if they retain him at the end of the year, that will prove that MLF is an incapable head coach.

Originally Posted by: go.pack.go. 


The way LaFleur defends the defense worries me because it's likely going to ignite his ego into keeping Barry to prove the "Fire Barry" crowd wrong. Or him right. And in doing so he's probably spending time with the defense consequently causing the offense to suffer.
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nerdmann
a year ago

The way LaFleur defends the defense worries me because it's likely going to ignite his ego into keeping Barry to prove the "Fire Barry" crowd wrong. Or him right. And in doing so he's probably spending time with the defense consequently causing the offense to suffer.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 


Barry will be out this year, but he stays for the season.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
beast
  • beast
  • Select Member Topic Starter
a year ago

The way LaFleur defends the defense worries me because it's likely going to ignite his ego into keeping Barry to prove the "Fire Barry" crowd wrong. Or him right. And in doing so he's probably spending time with the defense consequently causing the offense to suffer.


I feel like that's what QB Kurt Benkert was complaining about LaFleaur's personality.

LaFleaur gets an opinion... and refuses to even consider others opinions (such as Benkert's opposite opinion) and would just continue to shove his opinion down your throats.

Where Kyle Shanahan (running an extremely similar scheme) would listen and consider all opinion, make a decision after seeing everything.

Basically LaFleaur wants to prove his pervious selected answers were clearly right answers. While Shanahan wants to get the right answer going forward.
UserPostedImage
a year ago
Listening to the news conference, and the answer to the question regarding the two down linemen v 3 TE, I was truly dismayed, both by the attitude he had, but more important, how he was so wrong in his argument. it demonstrates an appalling lack of understanding of how to defend the run game, which leads me to wonder if he even understands how to run the ball.

Yes, technically, he is correct in that our outside linebackers are bigger people. However, they are not traditional 4-3 Defense ends… old timers, think Willie Davis, Lionel, Aldridge, et al. youngsters, think Nick Bosa, TJ Watt, what have you . Gary and Preston Smith are not defensive ends. They nearly equivalent against the run, but most of the time, they will at best get a draw against a decent offensive tackle. Against the pass, they rush like fast defensive ends, and should win their share of the battles

But make no mistake about it, in a run matchup they will not favorably match up to most tackles more often than not, but should favorably match up to tight ends. They are tweeners.

Regardless, a tight end tackle combination block should dominate either of these guys.

Now go back to the question….do the math. If you have three tight ends, you will have two double teams with a tight end and a tackle on one side, (or perhaps both sides) or on the other side two tight ends, on our two tweeners. That is undoubtedly, two likely losses. on the balance of the blocking scheme, you have four interior offensive lineman or with motion, three interior offensive lineman and one tight end blocking two of our traditional defensive tackles. This is a recipe for disaster!! 80% of the time both of these will be losses by our defensive lineman. As a result, you likely have four very bad losses along a light defensive line against the three tight end look.

In all cases. (unless our offensive line is blocking) there should be considerable movement off the line of scrimmage, and into where Linebackers and safeties would flow into their run fits/gaps.

The sheer physics of the people blocking versus the people being blocked, should be incredibly obvious to anybody with half a brain that you’re setting your defense up for failure, if you consistently expect wins or draws on run plays in this deployment.

Most shocking, is the fact that an 82-year-old woman knows this and an NFL head coach does not, and takes great offense when a reporter tries to point it out by asking a perfectly intelligent question.
Go Packers!!!!
beast
  • beast
  • Select Member Topic Starter
a year ago

MLF was asked in a press conference why they line up with only 2 down linemen when they’re in nickel defense, while the offense is in a 3 TE set. MLF went off on the reporter, he was a total ass hole about it and very condescending. I believe it was his Monday presser if anybody wants to go watch.

Originally Posted by: go.pack.go. 


https://www.packers.com/video/matt-lafleur-emphasizes-needing-all-11-on-the-same-page 

I just went to watch it, and I'm completely on LaFleaur side there, the reporter was wrong to word it that way, and LaFleaur is educating him for the future.

The Reporter in that series had multiple
attempts and kept screwing up...
starting at 14:10 mark.

1) The first seems like a total screw up by the reporter... basically attempting to ask the questions, but all he does is ramble on.... and I had to listen to it multiple times to figure out what he was asked, but what he actually asked was, "do you guys have conversations"... ramble ramble ramble ... "facing didn't teams with a younger QB that maybe wants to run the ball more" ... made no sense.... then he stopped and waited for an answer.

LaFleaur asked, what was the question? (and I'm still counting this as number one question) the reporter then said "is that maybe something you

2) Then stops, waiting for an answer and LaFleaur is like "what's the question?", and the reporter followed with, "Maybe that's something you guys didn't do a good enough job of contemplating going into the game ..."

My reaction, was wooo .. he's really going after the coach there ... suggesting that the coaches are smart enough to consider the Steelers are going to run the ball more, when that's clearly what the struggling passing attack Steelers do, and LaFleaur quite literally had said that exact thing multiple times since the game. And you're asking it as you're out smarting what the coaches already told you? I would of went off on him right there.

But LaFleaur gave a nice, long, clam answer! After the Reporter basically couldn't form a question, and then basically insulted the coaches.

3) Then the reporter at 15:08 (maybe or maybe not interpreting LaFleaur, let's say not interrupting) state that he should of asked this question better...

That's when he screws up for the 3rd time... saying "Nickel Defense with the two down linemen"

And yes, LaFleaur went off on him and was condescending towards him, suggesting someone that saying there is only two down linemen in nickel doesn't know what they're talking about... (and it's the truth).

LaFleaur then explained nickel is 4 down linemen as the edge rushers are down linemen, and how they consider if someone is a down linemen or not.

============

Then at 16:32 the reporter asks another simple question and LaFleaur calmly and nicely gave a long answer.
==============

Was LaFleaur an ass for a short while? yeah... but what do you expect when someone comes into their job, suggest they're stupid, and then doesn't seem to know what they themselves are talking about?

And LaFleaur was nice enough to try to educate him going forward....

The real problem here is that the NFL has over simplified the 4-3 and 3-4 defenses to the point that it's wrong... and when someone takes that wrong information to the guys on the inside like coaches, they don't like it, especially when you're trying to criticize them with that wrong information.

The wrong part of the over simplification is 3-4 OLB vs 4-3 OLB and 3-4 DE vs 4-3 DE which the public and media screw up too often.

Which is why I like Edge Rusher labels so much better for 3-4 OLB and 4-3 DE because they play very similar roles.

Then just call all the big men inside DTs.

But nickel packages are basically 4-2 defenses, so there are 4 down linemen, not 2. And after that reporter sorta (maybe accidentally) suggested the coaches are stupid... to say a 3rd wrong thing, someone needed to correct him.

Maybe LaFleaur didn't need to do it with so much attitude, but that was fairly short lived. I would of given attitude much sooner and would of carried it much longer.
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beast
  • beast
  • Select Member Topic Starter
a year ago

Listening to the news conference, and the answer to the question regarding the two down linemen v 3 TE, I was truly dismayed, both by the attitude he had, but more important, how he was so wrong in his argument. it demonstrates an appalling lack of understanding of how to defend the run game, which leads me to wonder if he even understands how to run the ball.

Yes, technically, he is correct in that our outside linebackers are bigger people. However, they are not traditional 4-3 Defense ends… old timers, think Willie Davis, Lionel, Aldridge, et al. youngsters, think Nick Bosa, TJ Watt, what have you . Gary and Preston Smith are not defensive ends. They nearly equivalent against the run, but most of the time, they will at best get a draw against a decent offensive tackle. Against the pass, they rush like fast defensive ends, and should win their share of the battles

But make no mistake about it, in a run matchup they will not favorably match up to most tackles more often than that, but should favorably match up to tight ends. They are tweeners.

So a tight end tackle combination block should dominate either of these guys.

Now go back to the question….do the math. If you have three tight ends, you will have two double teams with a tight end and a tackle on one side, (or perhaps both sides) or on the other side two tight ends, on our two tweeners. That is undoubtedly, two likely losses. on the balance of the blocking scheme,, you have four interior offensive lineman or with motion, three interior offensive lineman and one tight end blocking two of our traditional defensive tackles. this is a recipe for disaster. 80% of the time both of these will be losses by our defensive lineman. As a result, you have four likely very bad losses along a light defensive line against the three tight end look.

In all cases. (unless our offensive line is blocking) there should be considerable movement off the line of scrimmage, and into where Linebackers and safeties would flow into their run fits/gaps.

The sheer physics of the people blocking versus the people being blocked, should be incredibly obvious to anybody with half a brain that you’re setting your defense up for failure, if you consistently expect wins or draws on run plays in this deployment.

Most shocking, is the fact that an 82-year-old woman knows this and an NFL head coach does not, and takes great offense when a reporter tries to point it out by asking a perfectly intelligent question.

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful 


Where in the video was 3 TEs ever mentioned? I saw it said here, but I it wasn't ever said the video... in fact only place I hear offensive personnel mentioned, LaFleaur says Steelers are a big 11 personal which is only 1 TE, not 3 TEs.

82 year old women still lives in pre-2010 football, before those CBA rule changes, that changed the game.

LaFleaur knows exactly what he was talking about in modern football.

Nickel Defense are 4-2 defense with 4 down linemen, on all 32 teams across the league.

3-4 OLBers and 4-3 DE in the modern game are the almost the same exact roles, 3-4 OLBers MIGHT drop into coverage a bit more, depending on which version of the 3-4 it is.

The 3-4 Defense with the lighter OLBers and the totally two gapping up front got phased out with the 2010 CBA practice rule changes.

In the 3-4 DE one gap, which is still around, the OLBers needed to be heavier and the Packers OLBers are.

Those massive LDEs that were mainly to defend the run... they're not even a quarter as popular as they used to be and if they're good enough they're still around, but usually only as backups.

LaFleaur knows exactly what he's talking about modern NFL


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