Zero2Cool
4 years ago
Some good points here. You want to disagree, I know you do. SO, go ahead.

The most difficult decisions for NFL general managers and coaches have to be whether to cut or let established players walk. This offseason, Green Bay Packers General Manager Brian Gutekunst made what must have been the gut-wrenching call to wave good bye to starting players Brian Bulaga, Blake Martinez and Jimmy Graham.  All three immediately signed lucrative contracts with other teams.

As frustrating as this may be for us Packer fans, we can take consolation in the fact that the Packers track record in this area has been pretty good in recent years. The old adage is "better a year too early than a year too late".  Here is a cross section of decisions that proved to be wise, followed by a few which did not:

 

THE GOOD DECISIONS

 

Josh Sitton:  After eight stellar years with the Packers, Sitton was judged to be a complainer and bad locker room influence and was a surprise cut in 2016.  The three-time Pro Bowl offensive lineman immediately signed with the Bears and went on to a fourth Pro Bowl season.  But plagued by injuries, his play went rapidly downhill in 2017.  After suffering a season ending torn rotator cuff in September of 2018, Sitton was let go by Chicago in March of 2019.  He retired as a Packer this past December.

 

T. J. Lang:  Similar to Sitton, Lang was allowed to leave in 2016 after seven seasons and a Pro Bowl in Green Bay.  The veteran guard signed with Detroit and made another Pro Bowl in 2017.  But his 2018 season was limited to 6 games with a bevy of injuries and the Lions released him.  Lang retired in March of 2019.

 

Jordy Nelson:  One of the best receivers in team history, Jordy was allowed to walk after the 2018 campaign.  He signed with Oakland but despite a fair year of 739 receiving yards and 3 touchdowns, the Raiders judged him over the hill and let him go.  He retired as a Packer in August of 2019.

 

Eddie Lacy:  After four years in green and gold which included Rookie of the Year and Pro Bowl honors, the bruising running back was shown the door after the 2016 season.  He joined the Seattle Seahawks but got lost in a crowded backfield and rushed for just 179 yards in 2017.  The Seahawks did not resign him.

 

Randall Cobb:  One of the most popular and productive receivers in recent years, Cobb was allowed to walk after 2018 when it was decided his production and availability was not worth his considerable salary.  Some may argue with my decision to put Cobb in the Good Decision category after a decent season with the Dallas Cowboys where he amassed 828 receiving yards and three touchdowns.  But Dallas did not think enough of him to keep him around despite the possibility of a reunion with Coach Mike McCarthy.  Cobb signed with Houston for good money but it remains to be seen if there is gas left in the tank.

 

Clay Matthews:  The legendary linebacker with the long blonde hair reached the end of the line in Green Bay after eleven seasons in 2018.  He signed with the Rams and went on to register eight sacks.  But the salary cap strapped Rams let him go this off season, judging his play did not justify his pay.

 

Nick Perry:  The Packers gave up on the first round linebacker in March of 2019 after seven inconsistent and injury plagued seasons.  He has not been resigned by any other team.

 

THE BAD DECISIONS

 

Micah Hyde:  After four solid years as a safety and kick returner with the Pack, Hyde became a free agent in 2017.  He signed with the Buffalo Bills and went on to a Pro Bowl year, setting career highs in all defensive categories.  He has been a steady, quality player for the Bills ever since and could have been a stable influence in Green Bay's defensive backfield.

 

Casey Hayward:  The Packers thought the oft injured Hayward was expendable after drafting two defensive backs at the top of the 2015 draft.  Hayward signed with the (at that time) San Diego Chargers and went on to lead the league in interceptions on the way to being named second team all pro.  He has played so well that in 2018 the Chargers resigned him to a deal averaging 11 million dollars per year.  Meanwhile the Packers had to redraft defensive backs at the top of the 2018 draft.

 

Jared Cook:  After coming back from injury during the 2016 season, it was obvious Cook was becoming one of  Aaron Rodgers' favorite receivers in clutch situations.  But Ted Thompson felt his asking price was too high and Cook went to Oakland.  He caught six touchdown passes for the Raiders in 2018, and 9 TD's for the New Orleans Saints in 2019.  Meanwhile the Packers have failed to find an answer at the tight end position ever since.

 

There are many other examples of course.  As you see, the personnel game is one of hits and misses.  But if you add them all up, the Packers have been right more often than wrong in recent years.  It should give Packer fans hope that Brian Gutekunst will push the right buttons this year and beyond.

 


Continue Reading @ CheeseheadTV 

CheeseheadTV wrote:


UserPostedImage
KRK
  • KRK
  • Veteran Member
4 years ago
It is hard to root for guys, then say they should be cut....but that is the business.

Nice column with great perspective. Thanks for posting.
In Luce tua Videmus Lucem KRK
beast
4 years ago
Very good article, though Hyde was a CB while with the Packers... and didn't mention Haywards first Chargers contract which is what I argued, if he was under a certain price (and he was), resign him.

Though I'm sure most will disagree, but I would consider Cobb in the bad decision pile, not because we didn't resign him, but because we did resign him to that second contract... IMO he didn't live up to it. He should have been gone before Nelson.
UserPostedImage
Nonstopdrivel
4 years ago
I would be greatly surprised if the decision to let Graham go was in any way gut wrenching. He never came anywhere close to living up to his top-of-the-line contract, and he made a number of bad plays that arguably hurt the team's prospects. (Admittedly, Rodgers didn't always do him any favors, but there were other times he laid it right in Graham's breadbasket, and Graham still couldn't make the connection.) Whether Graham is over the hill or he simply wasn't a good fit on Rodgers' offense, it's well past time to move on. I would have preferred for Gutekunst to not have even brought him back for the 2019 season.
UserPostedImage
Zero2Cool
4 years ago
I think letting Micah Hyde and Casey Hayward leave was the right choice. This is assuming they drafted best avail player and thus they had young secondary players coming in. I also think both needed a different scheme to reach the success they have had. Which bothers me that it seems we used to find guys to fit scheme rather than best football players and adapt scheme to their talents.
UserPostedImage
beast
4 years ago

I think letting Micah Hyde and Casey Hayward leave was the right choice. This is assuming they drafted best avail player and thus they had young secondary players coming in. I also think both needed a different scheme to reach the success they have had.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 


I agree that they probably needed a heavy zone scheme to be at their absolute best, though I still wonder how Hyde (and Randall for that matter), would have done at Safety for the Packers.

Which bothers me that it seems we used to find guys to fit scheme rather than best football players and adapt scheme to their talents.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 


I'm not sure about that... because if they were finding guys to fit a scheme, then they did it wrong, because clearly they were finding guys that fit THE WRONG scheme. Which would suggest to me that either they were finding the best players no matter the scheme.

Also with that, we saw one problem with always trying to adapt your scheme to your talent... as our best two CBs were Shields and Hayward.

Shields basically being a man coverage specialist and Hayward being a zone coverage specialist...

They couldn't adapt the scheme to fit both as they had to pick one scheme or the other. So when grabbing the BPA and adjusting to the strengths of the players, Sometimes leads to the trouble of different talented players not working in the same type of scheme.

PS: Back then when searching for a solution, I finally found a scheme that did both.... for years VA Tech ran a scheme where half of the field (with their best CB) was in man coverage, and the other half was in zone. But that's the only place I've ever seen if successful done often, and I'm not sure if that would work in the pros.


UserPostedImage
gbguy20
4 years ago
Another thread to rehash how terrible Micah Hyde was in GB. Lets not act like we expected him to be great anywhere he went. Lets also not act like we wouldn't have been outraged had we given him the contract that buffalo did.
BAD EMAIL because the address couldn ot be found, or is unable to receive mail.
Zero2Cool
4 years ago

I agree that they probably needed a heavy zone scheme to be at their absolute best, though I still wonder how Hyde (and Randall for that matter), would have done at Safety for the Packers.


I'm not sure about that... because if they were finding guys to fit a scheme, then they did it wrong, because clearly they were finding guys that fit THE WRONG scheme. Which would suggest to me that either they were finding the best players no matter the scheme.

Also with that, we saw one problem with always trying to adapt your scheme to your talent... as our best two CBs were Shields and Hayward.

Shields basically being a man coverage specialist and Hayward being a zone coverage specialist...

They couldn't adapt the scheme to fit both as they had to pick one scheme or the other. So when grabbing the BPA and adjusting to the strengths of the players, Sometimes leads to the trouble of different talented players not working in the same type of scheme.

PS: Back then when searching for a solution, I finally found a scheme that did both.... for years VA Tech ran a scheme where half of the field (with their best CB) was in man coverage, and the other half was in zone. But that's the only place I've ever seen if successful done often, and I'm not sure if that would work in the pros.

Originally Posted by: beast 



I'm not sure I follow the perceived issue mentioned. If Shields is better at man, you lock him on WR2 and if Hayward (who was slot I believe) is better at Zone, you have him cover WR1 with Safety help. This is a fairly common strategy and I'm not sure why it wouldn't have worked other than Hayward and hamstrings had a love/hate relationship.
UserPostedImage
Cheesey
4 years ago
Hyde and Hayward.....just what I have said in the past. Letting good players go, and trying to fill those voids in the draft. Kids coming out of college rarely make a huge impact right away. Some not for several seasons. So you let known good guys leave for “best player available” hopes. Hopes that may never develop.
I know you can’t keep everyone. And I agree that better 1year early then 1 year late. But guys that are good and not over the hill, you need to hold onto if you want a shot at a championship.
UserPostedImage
beast
4 years ago

I'm not sure I follow the perceived issue mentioned. If Shields is better at man, you lock him on WR2 and if Hayward (who was slot I believe) is better at Zone, you have him cover WR1 with Safety help. This is a fairly common strategy and I'm not sure why it wouldn't have worked other than Hayward and hamstrings had a love/hate relationship.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Have you actually seen any team do that for an entire season? Or even 8 games?

I know they it's a fairly common short term strategy to deal with certain players it certain teams, but I haven't seen (or if I did, didn't realize it) that any team has consistently done it the majority of muliple back to back to back games.

I believe the reason for that is because it can create even more problems with different half of the field working differently than the other, so just get the WRs to cross, and the guy in man wants to stay in man, and the guy in zone wants to stay in zone... so now you can two guys on one WR and a WR running free and wide open.
UserPostedImage
Fan Shout
Zero2Cool (25m) : Johnson didn't make it until 2020. Ring 2023. 🤷 Personally, he should have been in years prior to Hall.
Zero2Cool (25m) : HUMP DAY
beast (38m) : Guys that have a good shot at making the NFL Hall of Fame usually get into their teams pretty fast
beast (39m) : Yeah, but is Kampman and the others in the NFL Hall of Fame?
Zero2Cool (44m) : Johnson was Hall of Fame, 2020. Should haev been in Ring a year later, not three years.
Zero2Cool (45m) : I could be wrong there though
Zero2Cool (45m) : Guys like Kampman, Tim Harris, Al Harris, etc all over 15 years. Hall of Fame is 5 year wait
Zero2Cool (47m) : I guess I see players in Packers Hall come way later
beast (50m) : Yeah, usually teams hall of fames are a much lower bar than the NFL
Zero2Cool (51m) : is it uncommon for Hall before Ring?
Zero2Cool (1h) : S Xavier McKinney named first-team All-Pro by NFLPA
beast (2h) : I missed it, sorry, but he got into the NFL Hall of Fame years before that
Zero2Cool (2h) : Jones took his sweet ole time!
Zero2Cool (2h) : Yeah, he's in the ring of honor, just saw video and his name is up there
Zero2Cool (2h) : Didn't they have a thing in 2023 for Jimmy's ring of honor? I swear I saw it
beast (3h) : Though if they're legitimately trying to re-sign MM, then it makes sense.
beast (3h) : Jerry Jones still hasn't put Jimmy Johnson in the Ring of Honor, but he's in the NFL's Hall of Fame, Jones is petty
Mucky Tundra (14h) : Unless the Cowboys are planning an extension, seems kinda petty
beast (16h) : Cowboys denied Bears request
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : From what I'm reading, MM is under contract through the 14th of January; after that he's free game
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : McCarthy let go or not extended??
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Chicago Bears have asked the Dallas Cowboys permission to interview Mike McCarthy for head coaching vacancy
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : The winners page that is
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : I was not hoping for that. It messes up the page lol
beast (6-Jan) : Thank you, and I was really opening we were going to get 4 or more tied for the top 3.
beast (6-Jan) : Thank you, and I was really opening we were going to get 4 or more tied for the top 3.
beast (6-Jan) : Thank you, and I was really opening we were going to get 4 or more tied for the top 3
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : congrats beast on 2024 !
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : congrats porky on winning 2023 pick'em! (oops sorry)
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : Packers have $60M+ of 2025 cap space on paper TODAY.
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Missed FG into a Lions TD; that'll do pig, that'll do
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : That might be it for the Vikings
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Oh so the refs do know what intentional grounding is
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : what the hell was that Goff?! Not much pressure and he just air mails it to Harrison
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : They really need to to get rid of the auto first down for illegal contact
Martha Careful (6-Jan) : watching the Vikings and Lions it's understandable why they swept the Packers. So much better product
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Even when GB got pressure he was throwing darts; vs no pressure on that last pass he just air mails an open guy
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : didn't have guys in his face ... pressure makes difference
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Where was this Darnold vs GB?
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : BALL DON'T LIE
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : how was that not a safety? Goff throws it at an offensive lineman
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Zero, I thought that was a given! ;)
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Zero I looked through earlier and noticed the same thing. Bonkers year. I just wonder if beast put any money on games
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : I'm hoping for BLOODBATH. Pummel one another.
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : 8 people in pick'em would have won any year with their total lol
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : I'm rooting for the Lions to lose.
Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : God help me but I'm rooting for the Vikings to...Vikings to...Christ I can't say it
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : 4 td for Rodgers
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : Chiefs got shutout
Zero2Cool (6-Jan) : Rodgers passes for 3rd TD. might be last game of an amazing career
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2024 Packers Schedule
Friday, Sep 6 @ 7:15 PM
Eagles
Sunday, Sep 15 @ 12:00 PM
COLTS
Sunday, Sep 22 @ 12:00 PM
Titans
Sunday, Sep 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Oct 6 @ 3:25 PM
Rams
Sunday, Oct 13 @ 12:00 PM
CARDINALS
Sunday, Oct 20 @ 12:00 PM
TEXANS
Sunday, Oct 27 @ 12:00 PM
Jaguars
Sunday, Nov 3 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 17 @ 12:00 PM
Bears
Sunday, Nov 24 @ 3:25 PM
49ERS
Thursday, Nov 28 @ 7:20 PM
DOLPHINS
Thursday, Dec 5 @ 7:15 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 15 @ 7:20 PM
Seahawks
Monday, Dec 23 @ 7:15 PM
SAINTS
Sunday, Dec 29 @ 3:25 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 5 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Recent Topics
5h / Green Bay Packers Talk / go.pack.go.

14h / Around The NFL / beast

7-Jan / Fantasy Sports Talk / wpr

7-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

7-Jan / Fantasy Sports Talk / Zero2Cool

6-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

6-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

6-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

6-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

6-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

6-Jan / Featured Content / Zero2Cool

6-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

5-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

5-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / buckeyepackfan

3-Jan / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.