Mucky Tundra
10 years ago

Out with the old. In with the new. It’s a harsh reality in several walks of life. Perhaps nowhere is it more evident than the National Football League.

JSOnline  wrote:


nerdmann
10 years ago

"Ultimately, defense goes back to attitude, desire and pursuit," nose tackle B.J. Raji said.



Then there's this:

If the Packers are to take a jump against the run, Raji figures to be instrumental. Drafted as a run-stuffing nose tackle back in 2009, he filled that roll with aplomb early in his career.



So, BJ was drafted as a run stuffer!?
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
OlHoss1884
10 years ago
Short anser, yes. With the switch to a 3-4, a big guy to anchor the middle was needed and he was the highest rated for that role from his days at BC. I think he was expected to push the pocket up the middle as well, as he was that highly touted, but the basic role for which he was drafted was to absorb blockers and stuff the run, as with any NT.

Overall, the number of times we've had guys playing out of position because of injuries or ineffectiveness has hurt the performances of others around them, and it's made the whole defense appear as if it's trying to avoid a mistake instead of aggressively punishing people.

Now that I think we've covered any glaring needs on that side of the ball, a season of reasonable health should make this one of the better defenses in the league. (I am thinking rating 10-15).


"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits" --Albert Einstein
DakotaT
10 years ago

Short anser, yes. With the switch to a 3-4, a big guy to anchor the middle was needed and he was the highest rated for that role from his days at BC. I think he was expected to push the pocket up the middle as well, as he was that highly touted, but the basic role for which he was drafted was to absorb blockers and stuff the run, as with any NT.

Overall, the number of times we've had guys playing out of position because of injuries or ineffectiveness has hurt the performances of others around them, and it's made the whole defense appear as if it's trying to avoid a mistake instead of aggressively punishing people.

Now that I think we've covered any glaring needs on that side of the ball, a season of reasonable health should make this one of the better defenses in the league. (I am thinking rating 10-15).

Originally Posted by: OlHoss1884 



If you are correct, that should be enough to win the Super Bowl, given our high powered offense and good kicking game.

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beast
10 years ago

So, BJ was drafted as a run stuffer!?

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



Short anser, yes. With the switch to a 3-4, a big guy to anchor the middle was needed and he was the highest rated for that role from his days at BC. I think he was expected to push the pocket up the middle as well, as he was that highly touted, but the basic role for which he was drafted was to absorb blockers and stuff the run, as with any NT.

Originally Posted by: OlHoss1884 



After thinking it over, I think the answer is yes... I believe Raji was drafted as an explosive NT that would be hard for OL to keep up with like he was in college.

That being said, I don't believe Raji was drafted as a run clogger to clog the OL, which they've been asked to do the last two years switching to the more traditional (conservative) 3-4 system, where I do believe Pickett was the better fit for NT in that system (and don't think Raji's style of play fit in it at any position other than 2-4 nickel rush DT).


That being said, I believe Boston College ran both the 3-4 and 4-3 system while Raji was in college, and Raji would play an aggressive 3-4 DE (like Cullen Jenkins did (different styles)) and Ron Brace (who plays a lot like Pickett did (but Pickett was much better/longer) played the NT role. And I think Raji played 3-4 DE some his first year... and the basically aftermath of that was... his arms/length isn't long enough to pass rush from out there and handle being further out and having to deal with the talent/size/length of NFL OTs.

So it's possible the Packers thought Raji might be able to play at 3-4 DE as well before his rookie year... but the general thinking is he was drafted to play NT (because he's NT size).


"Ultimately, defense goes back to attitude, desire and pursuit," nose tackle B.J. Raji said.



Watching Raji the last couple of years... I think Raji has very limited desire/attitude to run clog... so it might be very good that the Packers are rumored to be switching systems and getting away from the system with so much run clogging... of course he's going to be asked to play NT, which normally the position that gets asked to do it the most, so he could still be asked to do it (maybe).

And of course, Raji has a down year before they even switched to the run clogging system... after the Super Bowl year he didn't seem the same either... but they maybe could of had something to do with losing Nick Collins and Cullen Jenkins, as well as Tramon Williams and Woodson not being the same as the year before... Williams had that shoulder injury which he wasn't the same for a couple year... and Woodson seemed to lose a step that season.
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nerdmann
10 years ago
Raji's always been more of a penetrator, imo.

Oh yeah, that article also had a quote about how Datone is a "prototype" 3-4 DE, because he's 285 lbs. lol
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
beast
10 years ago

Raji's always been more of a penetrator, imo.

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



I COMPLETELY agree with that... but that being said penetrators can be run stuffers as well, as they penetrator to the run and make the tackle. Which is why I sort of debated the phasing ... because when I first read, "run stuffer" when talking about the NT, I thought run clogger, and Raji is no run clogger.

He's CLEARLY a penetrator... but you can still be a run stuffer and penetrator. So it's not technically wrong... but did seem wrong when I first read it, which is why I think you also questioned it in the first place.
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steveishere
10 years ago

I COMPLETELY agree with that... but that being said penetrators can be run stuffers as well, as they penetrator to the run and make the tackle. Which is why I sort of debated the phasing ... because when I first read, "run stuffer" when talking about the NT, I thought run clogger, and Raji is no run clogger.

He's CLEARLY a penetrator... but you can still be a run stuffer and penetrator. So it's not technically wrong... but did seem wrong when I first read it, which is why I think you also questioned it in the first place.

Originally Posted by: beast 



Yeah, JJ Watt is a good example of this. He's always attacking but he stops runs just as much as he gets after QBs because of it.
steveishere
10 years ago

Raji's always been more of a penetrator, imo.

Oh yeah, that article also had a quote about how Datone is a "prototype" 3-4 DE, because he's 285 lbs. lol

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



You left out the most important half of the quote which was the part that he's 6'4". The weight isn't as important as the length to be a "prototype". It's so funny to you yet look at the top players at that position like JJ Watt, Calais Campbell, Cameron Jordan, Justin Smith. They are all longer and lighter players like Datone.

I don't think Datone was even 285 last year though he looked leaner as the year went on and was probably more like 270 ish which if you aren't monster strong like Justin Smith is probably too light. If he's 285-290 and can keep that weight over the season he'll be fine.
nerdmann
10 years ago

You left out the most important half of the quote which was the part that he's 6'4". The weight isn't as important as the length to be a "prototype". It's so funny to you yet look at the top players at that position like JJ Watt, Calais Campbell, Cameron Jordan, Justin Smith. They are all longer and lighter players like Datone.

I don't think Datone was even 285 last year though he looked leaner as the year went on and was probably more like 270 ish which if you aren't monster strong like Justin Smith is probably too light. If he's 285-290 and can keep that weight over the season he'll be fine.

Originally Posted by: steveishere 



I'd like to see him at least 290. If he can get it done like like one of the top for people at his position in the league, then that's great. He has yet to prove that. I would think it would help him to add a little.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
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