texaspackerbacker
11 years ago

Its not that they won't do anything, they can't do anything because there is nothing to do. I don't know what you mean about it being right and proper because it is right and proper. The Browns signed a guy off the practice squad and put him on their 53 man roster. That is all they had to do according to the rules. People are trying to read way more into this than there is. Packers fans seem to want to think that the Browns did something wrong, or are doing something wrong. They did not and they are not.

If the Browns wanted to void the contract they might be able to claim that someone was hiding something but since the Packers did not benefit anything from it they (the Browns) would be hard pressed to prove any deception on the part of the Packers. They may be able to claim Johnson knew and hid it but again, how can they prove it. Unless there is a doctor visit somewhere on record that says he had the injury before the signing there is really nothing they can prove. Besides, it doesn't sound like they want to contest it (if that is what you want to call it) anyway.

Face it Packers fans, Johnson got away and there is nothing anyone can do about it.

Originally Posted by: sschind 



Basically, I agree with you. It ain't as if this was a trade where the Packers got something for him. The Browns clearly went from smart bargain hunter to victim, and Johnson benefited - by deception assuming he knew his condition, by luck if he didn't. He might, however, end up regretting it, because previously, the Packers would have paid for surgery if needed. Now, if the Browns think he cheated them and win their case, it's possible neither team would have to pay. The Packers could re-sign him if that happened, of course, but 4.3 speed probably would have become 4.5 or so, and we might not want him.


Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
djcubez
11 years ago
From what I understand any team can sign a player from another teams practice quad to their 53 man roster. When that happens, the team whose practice quad the player is on has a chance to match the offer and place that player on their 53 man roster or let them go. Also from what I understand, teams that sign players off another teams practice squad are not allowed to give that player a physical until the player has accepted the offer and is on the roster.

With that said, Charles Johnson is already officially a Cleveland Browns player. The physical was done after they signed him. Basically the signing is not contingent on a physical, but rather the player being signed cannot be given a physical until after he's on the team. This makes snatch-and-grabs like this one a little more risky.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24092462/browns-sign-player-with-torn-acl-to-replace-player-with-torn-acl 

Because Johnson was a practice squad player with another team, the Browns were unable to give him a physical until after they signed him. Since Cleveland signed Johnson from the Packers practice squad, the Browns are now stuck with him for at least two more weeks. Per NFL rules, a player that's signed off another team's practice squad has to be a part of the new team's 53-man roster for at least three games.

Zero2Cool
11 years ago
There are cases where the practice squad player does not tell his current team that a team is looking to sign him to their roster. If the player does't tell the current team prior to signing with the new team, then the 'current' team wasn't given a chance to bring them on board. This is what happened with Charles Johnson. Charles didn't tell the Packers, which per a report, left the Packers less than happy.


Edit, McCarthy on C.Johnson: "Fine young man. Wish he was here. I'm very curious to see how this pans out. I don't know if all the facts are in."
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Yerko
11 years ago

I have to think that in the NFL today, that any teams medical crew would be more on top of things than just taking a players word.
Perhaps that's why the Packers are so beset with serious injuries.

Originally Posted by: yooperfan 



Bulaga was almost going to come back from a similar injury. They were contemplating on him playing. My guess is a torn ACL isn't something a medical crew is going to catch unless the player says something. This could easily be the case for this.

I only think that way because coming back may have been an option for Bulaga.
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sschind
11 years ago

From what I understand any team can sign a player from another teams practice quad to their 53 man roster. When that happens, the team whose practice quad the player is on has a chance to match the offer and place that player on their 53 man roster or let them go. Also from what I understand, teams that sign players off another teams practice squad are not allowed to give that player a physical until the player has accepted the offer and is on the roster.


Originally Posted by: djcubez 



The only correction I would make to your description is that the decision is still totally up to the player. If he doesn't want to go to the new team and he wants to stay on the old team on the PS he can. It's not like waivers where the new team acquires his rights. Gurley reportedly turned down an offer to joint he vikings 53 man roster to remain on the Packers PS a few years back. Of course the Packers matched his would be salary from the vikings but that is not a requirement. It was also reported somewhere that the Packers routinely pay their PS players more than the minimum PS salary to encourage them staying.

The question then becomes why would a player refuse a spot on an active roster to stay on the practice squad? Well, in the case of Gurley it was go to a train wreck of a team and be low man on the totem pole locked into a bad situation or stay with a great team with a great passing attack and compete for a likely spot next season. He may still be low man but the low man in the Packers offense is probably much better off than the low man in the vikings offense.

Zero2Cool
11 years ago

The Football Educator wants to completely clarify a situation that developed this past week when the Cleveland Browns decided to “raid” the Green Bay Packers Practice Squad and sign wide receiver Charles Johnson to their own 53-man active roster.

As per NFL Policy
A player signed to a Practice Player Contract remains a free agent in the National Football League; though he is not eligible to be given a tryout, he may terminate his Practice Player Contract at any time to sign an NFL Player Contract with any club. If a Practice Squad player terminates his contract at any time, the club is under no obligation to pay him for that week. However, a player under a Practice Player Contract with one club cannot sign a Practice Player Contract with another club unless the Practice Player Contract with the first club is terminated by the club.

TGC NFL LogoIf a player on the Practice Squad of one club signs an NFL Player Contract with another club (Club 😎, the following rules apply:

The player shall receive three weeks salary of his NFL Player Contract at the 53-player Active/Inactive List minimum even if he is terminated by Club B prior to earning that amount; and

Club B is required to count the player on its 53-player Active/Inactive List for three games (a bye week counts as a game) even if he is terminated, traded, or assigned via waivers to another club or is signed as a free agent to another club’s 53-player roster or another club’s Practice Squad prior to that time. If the player is terminated from Club B’s 53-player roster and signed to Club B’s Practice Squad, he shall continue to count on the club’s 53- player Active/Inactive List but shall not count against the eight-player Practice Squad limit until the three-game requirement has been fulfilled.

If the promotion occurs with fewer than three games remaining in the club’s regular season, the three-game requirement shall not carry over into the next season.

As noted by ProFootballTalk.com
NFL: Green Bay Packers-Rookie MinicampWhen the Browns put quarterback Brian Hoyer on injured reserve with a torn ACL, they replaced him on the roster by signing wide receiver Charles Johnson off the Packers practice squad.

But because it’s the Browns, it couldn’t be that simple.

According to Scott Petrak of the Elyria Chronicle-Telegram, the Browns discovered Johnson had a torn ACL when they gave him a physical, so they’re now placing him on the non-football injury list. He was signed last Saturday, but was inactive for Sunday’s game with the Lions. (Note – Evidently AFTER the Browns & Johnson executed the contract)

Because Johnson was a practice squad player with another team, the Browns were unable to give him a physical until after they signed him. ***WRONG*** Since Cleveland signed Johnson from the Packers practice squad, the Browns are now stuck with him for at least two more weeks. Per NFL rules, a player that’s signed off another team’s practice squad has to be a part of the new team’s 53-man roster for at least three games.

Reality sets in
TGC NFL TryoutsThere’s NOTHING in the handbook stating a club is prohibited from giving a player a physical prior to signing him to their roster. They’re only forbidden to put the player through a “tryout”. In fact it states any player on a club’s Practice Squad remains a free agent, and 99.9% of free agent signings are accompanied with a contingency of “passing the club’s physical”.
The more likely scenario was Cleveland was in a hurry to fill the roster opening, get him immediately out on the practice field, and pushed the signing through the process (perhaps to keep Green Bay from blocking it) without completing their most primary obligation; ensuring the acquired player is healthy.

Two things immediately jump out
First – The media (ProFootballTalk.com and CBSSports.com at the very least) has erroneously reported this story to Cleveland and NFL fans from the get go, and it spread to other reporting sources without them doing their homework as well. You know who you are if you printed it as such.

TGC Joe BannerSecond – The Browns made a ROOKIE mistake by a front office that should know better, and to try and spin that they might have wanted the player anyway, or that the Packers hid the injury is just that… pure spin. The Browns weren’t obligated to be stuck with an injured player. Had they followed normal protocol and given him a physical BEFORE signing (as they fully had the right to do), he would have reverted back to the Packers and been their problem to deal with.

The real question is whether or not Cleveland steps up and reimburses Charles Johnson ANYTHING as a result of placing him on Reserve/Non-Football Injury? They have the latitude to pay all, nothing, or any where in between, of his minimum Paragraph 5 (it’s up to them).

Johnson was making the NFL standard Practice Squad salary of $6000 per week, injured or not. The “right way of doing business” would be to ensure he’s making at the very least just that as a Cleveland Brown.

Somebody should give Craig Domann (Johnson’s agent) a call.


http://www.thefootballeducator.com/clarifying-erroneous-reports-cleveland-browns-charles-johnson/#ixzz2i80kdZAG 


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nerdmann
11 years ago
What a mess.

I hope the kid's ok. Still has potential to be a player.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Zero2Cool
9 years ago

This wasn't a trade.
Too bad for Cleveland.
My question is: why did the Packers medical crew not know this and allow him to practice with the taxi squad, or did they?

Originally Posted by: yooperfan 



The Browns detected the ACL injury during their physical, but not the Packers. That makes me think Charles Johnson didn't mention any pain or discomfort in his knee to the Packers, but did so with the Browns. Or maybe the Browns said we watched your college tape and you look completely different in the tape we watched while with the Packers, what gives? And then it came out that "well my knee is buggin me" or something like that. I see this more likely than the Packers medical staff just being incompetent.
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nerdmann
9 years ago

The Browns detected the ACL injury during their physical, but not the Packers. That makes me think Charles Johnson didn't mention any pain or discomfort in his knee to the Packers, but did so with the Browns. Or maybe the Browns said we watched your college tape and you look completely different in the tape we watched while with the Packers, what gives? And then it came out that "well my knee is buggin me" or something like that. I see this more likely than the Packers medical staff just being incompetent.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



When it comes to neck injuries they ARE incompetent.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
DoddPower
9 years ago

When it comes to neck injuries they ARE incompetent.

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



Such a bummer the Packers let this guy get away. He is so much better than White and it's not even close. Probably better than Janis too.
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beast (22h) : Guys that have a good shot at making the NFL Hall of Fame usually get into their teams pretty fast
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Zero2Cool (22h) : Johnson was Hall of Fame, 2020. Should haev been in Ring a year later, not three years.
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beast (23h) : Yeah, usually teams hall of fames are a much lower bar than the NFL
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beast (8-Jan) : Though if they're legitimately trying to re-sign MM, then it makes sense.
beast (8-Jan) : Jerry Jones still hasn't put Jimmy Johnson in the Ring of Honor, but he's in the NFL's Hall of Fame, Jones is petty
Mucky Tundra (8-Jan) : Unless the Cowboys are planning an extension, seems kinda petty
beast (8-Jan) : Cowboys denied Bears request
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Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Missed FG into a Lions TD; that'll do pig, that'll do
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Mucky Tundra (6-Jan) : Zero I looked through earlier and noticed the same thing. Bonkers year. I just wonder if beast put any money on games
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