Zero2Cool
13 years ago

In order to "stay clean" one needs to "get clean." Jolly is an addict -- that can't be underplayed here.

Originally Posted by: evad04 


Very true. It's a shame his "family" was excluded from him. I think if the Packers were still able to influence his decisions ... either directly or indirectly ... he would have been better off.
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Dexter_Sinister
13 years ago
The problem was Jolly stayed with his friends who all were invested in his staying an addict. He should have gotten out of Houston and stayed away from anyone who would try to drag him back into the lifestyle.

Fighting your own addiction is tough enough when you have people who want you to be clean, fighting that and the people who want to sabotage your recovery is impossible.

Sometimes all love and support in the world is not enough.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
Silentio
13 years ago

The problem was Jolly stayed with his friends who all were invested in his staying an addict. He should have gotten out of Houston and stayed away from anyone who would try to drag him back into the lifestyle.

Fighting your own addiction is tough enough when you have people who want you to be clean, fighting that and the people who want to sabotage your recovery is impossible.

Sometimes all love and support in the world is not enough.

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister 


This is why it would have been great for him to stay around the Packers organization. An addict (no matter the substance, from alcohol, to cocaine, to purple drank) needs people around him who will not enable drug seeking behavior and who will demand accountability from the individual. Being required to show up to team meetings, standing on the sideline during practice, and hanging around current Packers players might have given Jolly the support he needed.

At the very least, the league, when it suspends players and refuses to allow them contact with their team for drug related offenses, should have a policy in place whereby players are either forced to enter rehab, or at least are given the option of rehab. Isn’t it in the league’s best interests to have young, talented players clean and available? Why not set up a system within the league that seeks to combat the systemic issue of drug and alcohol dependence among NFL players? It seems to me that Goodell and the league (and the law to some extent) treat addiction as a moral issue. It is not. As evad04 already expressed, it is very much a systemic issue disproportionately affecting poor inner city communities (and in the case of meth poor rural communities). It is also a medical issue, and an issue very much influenced by genetics on the individual level. Of course the responsibility of the individual as a one with agency to make choices plays in to the equation, but to boil the issue of addiction down to morality is an ethical failing on the league’s part, especially considering the amount of money the league generates from the young (sometimes very young) men cast into the role of millionaire overnight, and taken out of any support system that does exist.

In Jolly’s case, it sounds as if there was not much of a support system around him to begin with. Perhaps he found one in Green Bay, but then he was removed from that support as part of disciplinary action handed down by the NFL. This strikes me as fundamentally unmerciful.

edit: I should add that having a support system around, even one that knows the in and outs of recovery from addiction, does not necessarily mean an addict will get clean or remain sober. Good families, friends, and addicted individuals see relapse happen, perhaps even more frequently than they see successful and ongoing recovery. In Jolly’s case, it is tragic that he was not even given the opportunity to remain in a place where recovery may have been possible.
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dfosterf (9h) : Looking for guidance. Not feeling the thumb.
Mucky Tundra (15h) : If they knew about it or not
Mucky Tundra (15h) : I don't recall that he did which is why I asked.
Zero2Cool (19h) : Guessing they probably knew. Did he have cast or something on?
Mucky Tundra (10-Apr) : Did they know that at the time or was that something the realized afterwards?
Zero2Cool (9-Apr) : Van Ness played most of season with broken thumb
wpr (9-Apr) : yay
Zero2Cool (9-Apr) : Mark Murphy says Steelers likely to protect Packers game. Meaning, no Ireland
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Mucky Tundra (8-Apr) : *CHOMP CHOMP CHOMP*
Zero2Cool (2-Apr) : WR who said he'd break Xavier Worthy 40 time...and ran slower than you
Mucky Tundra (2-Apr) : Who?
Zero2Cool (2-Apr) : Texas’ WR Isaiah Bond is scheduled to visit the Bills, Browns, Chiefs, Falcons, Packers and Titans starting next week.
Zero2Cool (2-Apr) : Spotting ball isn't changing, only measuring distance is, Which wasn't the issue.
Zero2Cool (2-Apr) : The spotting of the ball IS the issue. Not the chain gang.
Mucky Tundra (2-Apr) : Will there be a tracker on the ball or something?
Zero2Cool (1-Apr) : uh oh
Martha Careful (1-Apr) : Too bad camera's can't spot the ball as well.
Mucky Tundra (1-Apr) : So will the chain gang be gone completely or will they still be around as a backup or whatever?
Zero2Cool (1-Apr) : The method for measuring first downs in the NFL will switch from chain gangs to camera-based technology in 2025, the league announced.
Martha Careful (1-Apr) : A big step in the right direction. Just put in the college system is very very good.
Zero2Cool (1-Apr) : NFL has passed a rule that allows both teams to possess the ball in OT during the regular season
Zero2Cool (1-Apr) : Touchbacks on kickoffs will now bring the ball to the 35-yard line.
beast (31-Mar) : It might of gotten more popular recently, but braiding hair (even men) in certain cultures goes back for centuries.
Martha Careful (30-Mar) : Is men braiding their hair a new style thing? Watching the NCAA men's tournament many players have done
Zero2Cool (29-Mar) : Ha. Well, it'd be nice for folks to reset their own password. Via validated email 😏
beast (29-Mar) : Monopoly was supposed to be an educational game, that show how evil capitalism was and how we should avoid it
beast (29-Mar) : Lol, I was thinking username would be better, as then I wouldn't have to keep an email up to date lol 😂
beast (29-Mar) : Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : I was thinking email because I think it'll make folks keep it up todate lol
wpr (29-Mar) : sure is
Zero2Cool (29-Mar) : Monopoly is a rip off of The Landlord's Game
wpr (27-Mar) : 28 days until the draft
earthquake (27-Mar) : Which seemed strange to my 9 year old self, that you could be a fan for a team other than the one you play for
earthquake (27-Mar) : Nothing eventful happened, other than it being clear that he was a bengals fan
earthquake (27-Mar) : And we went and hung out with him one afternoon, I must have been 9 or so
earthquake (27-Mar) : That’s wild, when I was a kid my friend lived in the same apartment complex in De Pere
Mucky Tundra (27-Mar) : Only career highspot was a 200 yard rushing game while playing for the Cardinals
Mucky Tundra (27-Mar) : He is a former Packer. Drafted out of Northern Illinois. Didn't do much in GB.
dfosterf (26-Mar) : Despicable
Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : Former NFL. I think Packers too
Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : NFL RB Leshon Johnson has been charged in a massive dog fighting operation, with the FBI seizing over 190 Pit Bulls
Mucky Tundra (26-Mar) : Some real irony of a QB as short as Wilson playing for the Giants
Mucky Tundra (26-Mar) : Giants country, let's be the tall beings of lore!
Mucky Tundra (26-Mar) : Russell Wilson signs with the Giants.
Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : I was thinking email because I think it'll make folks keep it up todate lol
wpr (25-Mar) : I don't think there is a significant difference. I use a user name for many. Others email.
Martha Careful (25-Mar) : email
Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : would it be better to use EMAIL or USERNAME to log into a site?
wpr (25-Mar) : Thanks Zero
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