dfosterf
16 years ago
I don't like this thread, I don't like it at all. Nodak makes far too much sense and I hate it when that happens, especially coming from a Vikings fan. The only response I have to silly threads like this one is... Oh ya, well, I'm gonna go get my big brother... THEN we'll see.
NodakPaul
16 years ago

no edge on the passing game? Come on, you have tarvaris jackson and who at receiver?

"warhawk" wrote:



I didn't look at the Packers passing offense versus the Vikings passing offense. Why would I? Those two units are never on the field at the same time.

When I look at the Vikings passing DEFENSE versus the Packers passing OFFENSE, I call it a tie. When I look at the Vikings passing OFFENSE against the Packers passing DEFENSE, I gave the advantage to the Packers.

"NodakPaul" wrote:



And what basis can you possibly use to support this? You pass defense has been one of the worst in the league and our pass offense one of the best. If, in fact, this catagory was even close to a tie it would be us losing 34-0 instead of you guys.

You guys have plenty of strengths but pass defense ain't one of 'em and until they prove that not to be true it is what it is. The facts are your DB's do not match up well with our catch and run receivers so I cannot see how in the world you can call this a draw.

The bottom line is if AP breaks loose for big gains we probably lose the game and there is certainly reason to be concerned (for us) that this could happen but our passing offense is going to get the better of the Vikes pass "D".

"gakko" wrote:



<sigh> Did you even read the original post? I think I stated my reasons pretty well. Here is that particular section again:


Vikings Passing Defense vs Packers Passing Offense
Edge: None

For the Pack, Driver and Jennings can be difference makers, and even though Rodgers is new to the starting spot, this is his fourth year in the system. HOwever, the Packers OL is in a bad spot. Not only have they not given the QB any time so far in preseason, Scott Wells was also hampered by a torso injury throughout preseason. If he can't start, expect Spitz to continue to fill in at center. With the extent of Josh Sitton's knee injury still unknown, we could be looking at Barbre and Colledge as the two startign guards this year. If the OL was in better shape, the edge would go to the Packers here. But because of the OL, it is a tie.
On the Vikings side, I am not going to cite Minnesota's last place ranking in total passing yards last year because that stat is skewed by the run defense. Sharper and Madieu Williams are still learning to work with each other, and they haven't been on the field together a lot in the preseason. Griffin is looking better, but still needs some polishing at the CB position. Jared Allen will definitely bring the pressure, and will get at least one sack. The Vikings easily have one of the best DLs in the league, and that should translate into a much better passing defense.

"NodakPaul" wrote:



While your pass offense was very good last year, there are several things different this year. I like Rodgers as a QB, but he will not put up the same kind of numbers that Fav-re did last year - especially not in his first NFL start. Your OL has also been hit hard by the injury bug.

As for the Vikings, while our pass defense was poor last year, there are several things different this year. Specifically the addition of a pass rush, which was sorely lacking last year.

I agree that the packers WRs have the edge over the Vikings secondary, especially with M.Williams out. But they are only a part of the passing equation. You also have a green QB behind a suspect OL against the best DL in the league. The advantages and disadvantages to both teams even out rather well.
"There's the snap, Rodgers with a quick drop - in trouble! AND SACKED BY ALLEN! The ball is lose, the ball is lose, and recovered by Kevin Williams! And that's the ball game! Childress and the Vikings FINALLY beat the Packers!"
--
zombieslayer
16 years ago
The whole Packers Pass O vs Vikings Pass D rests on our OL vs their DL. Yes, we have better WRs than their DBs. I think Nodak has stated this more than once. But as we saw in the Super Bowl, the threat of a superior WR staff can be minimized by a strong pass rush.

The Giants DBs were average at best and Randy Moss was hands down the best WR in the NFL last year. What happened? The DL never gave Brady enough time to even look for an open receiver.

So this whole argument goes to how our OL fares up against their DL. Our OL is battered. We'll need Wells healthy, and we'll need better blocking by our RBs because you know someone will get through.

I'm guessing the determining factors in this game will be turnovers and the battle of our OL vs their DL. AP is the 2nd best RB in the NFL, but if we can keep him off the field, then we can minimize his threat.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
pack_in_black
16 years ago




......


And the Packers have lost a key component to their second ranked passing attack from last year. While I think that Rodgers will be a good QB, I don't think he will be able to put up a very good performance against the Vikings. First start ever, nationally televised game, a quarter of the fans still booing him, going against the best DL in the league, and Fav-re's picture printed on every ticket. Lots of pressure...

"NodakPaul" wrote:





First, that Favre on the tickets line made me laugh. Since I think I detected humorous intent, I doubt Aaron's gonna be on the sidelines between drives looking at fans' ticket stubs... lol


While I agree he'll show a little response to the pressure, he did fine on MNF's preseason opener, so the national audience thing shouldn't be a big factor, the Lambeau faithful gave him a standing o in his first appearance as a starter, and MM is a good enough coach to call plays to protect him from your admittedly impressive d-line.

Just my two pennies
UserPostedImage
Thanks to Pack93z for the sig!
TheEngineer
16 years ago




......


And the Packers have lost a key component to their second ranked passing attack from last year. While I think that Rodgers will be a good QB, I don't think he will be able to put up a very good performance against the Vikings. First start ever, nationally televised game, a quarter of the fans still booing him, going against the best DL in the league, and Fav-re's picture printed on every ticket. Lots of pressure...

"pack_in_black" wrote:





First, that Favre on the tickets line made me laugh. Since I think I detected humorous intent, I doubt Aaron's gonna be on the sidelines between drives looking at fans' ticket stubs... lol


While I agree he'll show a little response to the pressure, he did fine on MNF's preseason opener, so the national audience thing shouldn't be a big factor, the Lambeau faithful gave him a standing o in his first appearance as a starter, and MM is a good enough coach to call plays to protect him from your admittedly impressive d-line.

Just my two pennies

"NodakPaul" wrote:



I think Aaron has learned something between preseason game 1 and preseason game 4. That's if you try and push too hard to do well and try to make things happen, chances are you're going to get sacked. Just play within yourself and make the quick throws, and he'll be fine.

For this reason I think he'll be less daunted by the the MNF game, and it won't be as big as a factor as it usually is for 1st time starters (who are generally within their first 2 or 3 years - not a 4 year, same offense man like Rodgers).
blank
warhawk
16 years ago

no edge on the passing game? Come on, you have tarvaris jackson and who at receiver?

"NodakPaul" wrote:



I didn't look at the Packers passing offense versus the Vikings passing offense. Why would I? Those two units are never on the field at the same time.

When I look at the Vikings passing DEFENSE versus the Packers passing OFFENSE, I call it a tie. When I look at the Vikings passing OFFENSE against the Packers passing DEFENSE, I gave the advantage to the Packers.

"warhawk" wrote:



And what basis can you possibly use to support this? You pass defense has been one of the worst in the league and our pass offense one of the best. If, in fact, this catagory was even close to a tie it would be us losing 34-0 instead of you guys.

You guys have plenty of strengths but pass defense ain't one of 'em and until they prove that not to be true it is what it is. The facts are your DB's do not match up well with our catch and run receivers so I cannot see how in the world you can call this a draw.

The bottom line is if AP breaks loose for big gains we probably lose the game and there is certainly reason to be concerned (for us) that this could happen but our passing offense is going to get the better of the Vikes pass "D".

"NodakPaul" wrote:



<sigh> Did you even read the original post? I think I stated my reasons pretty well. Here is that particular section again:


Vikings Passing Defense vs Packers Passing Offense
Edge: None

For the Pack, Driver and Jennings can be difference makers, and even though Rodgers is new to the starting spot, this is his fourth year in the system. HOwever, the Packers OL is in a bad spot. Not only have they not given the QB any time so far in preseason, Scott Wells was also hampered by a torso injury throughout preseason. If he can't start, expect Spitz to continue to fill in at center. With the extent of Josh Sitton's knee injury still unknown, we could be looking at Barbre and Colledge as the two startign guards this year. If the OL was in better shape, the edge would go to the Packers here. But because of the OL, it is a tie.
On the Vikings side, I am not going to cite Minnesota's last place ranking in total passing yards last year because that stat is skewed by the run defense. Sharper and Madieu Williams are still learning to work with each other, and they haven't been on the field together a lot in the preseason. Griffin is looking better, but still needs some polishing at the CB position. Jared Allen will definitely bring the pressure, and will get at least one sack. The Vikings easily have one of the best DLs in the league, and that should translate into a much better passing defense.

"gakko" wrote:



While your pass offense was very good last year, there are several things different this year. I like Rodgers as a QB, but he will not put up the same kind of numbers that Fav-re did last year - especially not in his first NFL start. Your OL has also been hit hard by the injury bug.

As for the Vikings, while our pass defense was poor last year, there are several things different this year. Specifically the addition of a pass rush, which was sorely lacking last year.

I agree that the packers WRs have the edge over the Vikings secondary, especially with M.Williams out. But they are only a part of the passing equation. You also have a green QB behind a suspect OL against the best DL in the league. The advantages and disadvantages to both teams even out rather well.

"NodakPaul" wrote:



In '05 when we had the top rated pass defense I thought it was a joke because nobody HAD to throw it to beat us. Conversely, I see no justification for a poor pass defense because you stop the run well? What does that have to do with anything other than they should KNOW they opposing teams are going to throw it at them and SHOULD be able then to stop it.

Your same comments could easily have been made last year about how outclassed our young "O" line would be against that "D" front yet we eaked out a 34-0 win.

You also seem to put a lot of eggs in the Jared Allen basket to all of a sudden take a team that was poor at rushing the QB and now they will be good there. Better does not make good enough until that is proven.

I like Ted Thompson because he deals in reality and gets the guys that are needed to really make a team better over pure optimism. The Vikes struck one cord there and that was Allen but as far as TJack, he should be long gone and some guys remotely capable to the days of Moss are sorely needed at receiver. No, an ex-Bear that's never done jack against us does not qualify.

It's no coincidence that the teams hoisting the big trophy at the end all chuck it pretty damn good. You can say what you want about NY and yes they played unbelievable on defense but what won that SB was Eli getting hot those last 7-8 games. He plays same ole, same ole, and NY get's no where near the SB. That's reality.

And if ARod doesn't get it done you can pretty well know we will suck too so that you see that reality is for everyone.
"The train is leaving the station."
bozz_2006
16 years ago
well done warhawk. +1
UserPostedImage
zombieslayer
16 years ago

The Vikes struck one cord there and that was Allen but as far as TJack, he should be long gone and some guys remotely capable to the days of Moss are sorely needed at receiver. No, an ex-Bear that's never done jack against us does not qualify.

"warhawk" wrote:



To beat the Vikings this year is to beat them the same way in '07. Keep AP off the field. How? Get an early lead. Childress will panic and start playing TJack instead of their dynamic running duo and we win.

Things we cannot do:
1) turn the ball over,
2) let anyone get to Aaron.

I don't see the big deal about Berrian. He's an average WR. Not a huge pickup. We keep their running game off the field and force them to pass, we win in a blowout.

I'm always worried about the Vikings every year because on paper, they look absolutely sick. Then the season starts and they implode.

On paper, the Vikings should be in a position to challenge us for the NFC North. But as I've said earlier this year, even without Favre, the NFC North is ours. The Vikings will find a way to screw it all up.

Sorry, Nodak. You know what they say about history.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
NodakPaul
16 years ago


It's no coincidence that the teams hoisting the big trophy at the end all chuck it pretty damn good.

"warhawk" wrote:



Yeah, like Brad Johnson when he won with Tampa Bay. Oh wait no... I must have been thinking about Trent Dilfer with the Ravens. No wait, that's not it either... Let's see, the Bears made it to the big game because Grossman played so... good?

Well Manning is great... but for some reason he only has one ring - and that was against the Bears. Fav-re was pretty damn good, but when was the last time he got a ring? The Pats broke Minnesota's record for most points scored in a single season last year. Coincidently neither team got a ring when they did so.

History is riddled with teams who are successful with a great defense but average offense. Having a great passing game is NOT the sole way to a SB birth.
"There's the snap, Rodgers with a quick drop - in trouble! AND SACKED BY ALLEN! The ball is lose, the ball is lose, and recovered by Kevin Williams! And that's the ball game! Childress and the Vikings FINALLY beat the Packers!"
--
porky88
16 years ago


It's no coincidence that the teams hoisting the big trophy at the end all chuck it pretty damn good.

"NodakPaul" wrote:



Yeah, like Brad Johnson when he won with Tampa Bay. Oh wait no... I must have been thinking about Trent Dilfer with the Ravens. No wait, that's not it either... Let's see, the Bears made it to the big game because Grossman played so... good?

Well Manning is great... but for some reason he only has one ring - and that was against the Bears. Fav-re was pretty damn good, but when was the last time he got a ring? The Pats broke Minnesota's record for most points scored in a single season last year. Coincidently neither team got a ring when they did so.

History is riddled with teams who are successful with a great defense but average offense. Having a great passing game is NOT the sole way to a SB birth.

"warhawk" wrote:



Wait a second. This isn't the first time I've heard a Viking fan compare their team to those teams but that defense isn't on the level of Baltimore's or Tampa Bay's from those Super Bowl years. Their defensive line maybe but Derrick Brooks or Ray Lewis isn't there.

Tampa Bay had a nice passing game the year they won the Super Bowl. Johnson threw for over 3,000 yards and 22 touchdowns. Also only 6 picks when I looked it up which is amazing. Keyshaun Johnson was a pretty good receiver too something Minnesota really doesn't have.

You strike me as someone who is a realist. Do you think that defense can be like the Ravens? If not then do you think Jackson can have a season like Brad Johnson?

For Minnesota to win the Super Bowl I think one of those things need to happen.
Fan Shout
packerfanoutwest (3m) : Packers General Manager Brian Gutekunst says Green Bay’s roster can win, even without adding anyone in the draft.
Zero2Cool (19m) : It's a poor design. New site has SignalR like our gameday chat
wpr (36m) : Ah today's Shout was very quick to post.
wpr (36m) : now 3
Zero2Cool (1h) : Who? What?
beast (10h) : What is he supposed to say? He doesn't want players currently on the team?
Martha Careful (14h) : meh
Zero2Cool (18h) : Sounds like Walker and Wyatt will be with Packers for beyond 2026
Zero2Cool (18h) : It's so awesome.
Zero2Cool (18h) : new site fan shout post fast
wpr (22h) : Slow posting in Fan shout.
wpr (22h) : Only 4
wpr (22h) : Only 4
Zero2Cool (21-Apr) : If only we had a topic to read about and discuss it. That's something new website must have!!!
dfosterf (21-Apr) : Justice Musqueda over at Acme Packing put up an excellent synopsis of the Packers 1st round options this am
wpr (19-Apr) : 5 days
beast (18-Apr) : 6 days
wpr (17-Apr) : 7 days
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : sounds like Packers don't get good compensation, Jaire staying
dfosterf (16-Apr) : Nobody coming up with a keep, but at x amount
dfosterf (16-Apr) : Trade, cut or keep
dfosterf (16-Apr) : that from Jaire
dfosterf (16-Apr) : My guess is the Packers floated the concept of a reworked contract via his agent and agent got a f'
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : Yes, and that is why I think Rob worded it how he did. Rather than say "agent"
dfosterf (16-Apr) : Same laws apply. Agent must present such an offer to Jaire. Cannot accept or reject without presenting it
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : I'm thinking that is why Rob worded it how he did.
dfosterf (16-Apr) : The Packers can certainly still make the offer to the agent
dfosterf (16-Apr) : Laws of agency and definition of fiduciary responsibility
dfosterf (16-Apr) : Jaire is open to a reduced contract without Jaire's permission
dfosterf (16-Apr) : The agent would arguably violate the law if he were to tell the Packers
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : That someone ... likely the agent.
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : So, Jaire has not been offered nor rejected a pay reduction, but someone says he'd decline.
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : Demovksy says t was direct communication with someone familiar with Jaire’s line of thinking at that moment.
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : Demovsky just replied to me a bit ago. Jaire hasn't said it.
dfosterf (16-Apr) : Of course, that depends on the definition of "we"
dfosterf (16-Apr) : We have been told that they haven't because he wouldn't accept it. I submit we don't know that
dfosterf (16-Apr) : What is the downside in making a calculated reduced offer to Jaire?
Zero2Cool (15-Apr) : Packers are receiving interest in Jaire Alexander but a trade is not imminent
Zero2Cool (15-Apr) : Jalen Ramsey wants to be traded. He's never happy is he?
Zero2Cool (15-Apr) : two 1sts in 2022 and two 2nd's in 2023 and 2024
Zero2Cool (15-Apr) : Packers had fortunate last three drafts.
dfosterf (15-Apr) : I may have to move
dfosterf (15-Apr) : My wife just told the ancient Japanese sushi dude not enough rice under his fish
Zero2Cool (14-Apr) : I think a dozen is what I need
dfosterf (14-Apr) : Go fund me for this purpose just might work. A dozen nurses show up at 1265 to provide mental health assistance.
dfosterf (14-Apr) : Maybe send a crew of Angels to the Packers draft room on draft day.
Zero2Cool (14-Apr) : I am the Angel that gets visited.
dfosterf (14-Apr) : Visiting Angels has a pretty good reputation
Zero2Cool (14-Apr) : what
Martha Careful (14-Apr) : WINNING IT, not someone else losing it. The best victory though was re-uniting with his wife
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2024 Packers Schedule
Friday, Sep 6 @ 7:15 PM
Eagles
Sunday, Sep 15 @ 12:00 PM
COLTS
Sunday, Sep 22 @ 12:00 PM
Titans
Sunday, Sep 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Oct 6 @ 3:25 PM
Rams
Sunday, Oct 13 @ 12:00 PM
CARDINALS
Sunday, Oct 20 @ 12:00 PM
TEXANS
Sunday, Oct 27 @ 12:00 PM
Jaguars
Sunday, Nov 3 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 17 @ 12:00 PM
Bears
Sunday, Nov 24 @ 3:25 PM
49ERS
Thursday, Nov 28 @ 7:20 PM
DOLPHINS
Thursday, Dec 5 @ 7:15 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 15 @ 7:20 PM
Seahawks
Monday, Dec 23 @ 7:15 PM
SAINTS
Sunday, Dec 29 @ 3:25 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 5 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Recent Topics
37m / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

12h / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

17-Apr / Random Babble / wpr

16-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

13-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

12-Apr / Feedback, Suggestions and Issues / Zero2Cool

11-Apr / Feedback, Suggestions and Issues / Rockmolder

2-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

2-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

1-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

1-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

31-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

30-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

29-Mar / Random Babble / wpr

28-Mar / Random Babble / Martha Careful

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.