macbob
14 years ago


But Zombie throws stats like candy on a playground.. I can throw stats out back that support the element of my stance.

"zombieslayer" wrote:



And this is why I'm done arguing this argument.

I did a shitload of research analyzing what it takes to win the Super Bowl. It started with Raider Pride saying "Defense wins Championships" and in the effort to prove him wrong, I proved him right. I found that if we take all the stats there are, the one that had the highest rates of a SB winning team is the #1 D.

Then I found what is more effective - an elite QB or an elite RB. It became obvious an elite QB was more effective and it wasn't even close. I proved all this with hours of research. This stuff isn't exactly easy to do.

In fact, it was so skewed that my conclusion was #1 D is the #1 qualifier for winning the SB. 2nd is an elite QB who doesn't throw INTs in important games. The elite RB couldn't even be considered because it didn't matter. In fact, the elite RB didn't have that much bearing on a team's record, period.

Now if you want to take all the research I've done and just say I'm throwing stats around without any meaning, then you can take my college degree too and I must have apparently paid off my professors as well as I apparently don't know what I'm doing with research, right?

Do you even realize how condescending what you said is? I actually take pride in what I'm doing here. I find football fascinating and would like to believe I'm a contributing member to this forum.

"Pack93z" wrote:



Zombie-

Your analysis above looks spot on to me. D's the #1 factor, followed by a good QB.

Not looking for the elite RB that you mention above (though I'd love to have one...there's examples throughout, such as Denver, where John Elway was not able to win the SB until he had Terrell Davis to take someof the offensive load off of him.)

I'm not looking for the Packers to become primarily a running team. Just want the Pack to run the ball enough to attract the defenses attention and distract them from our passing game, so that they're not loading up all of the time after the QB.

Running 13 times a game (like we did in two early losses) is not enough to attract the D's attention. I thought Mike McCarthy called a pretty good game against NE and NYG, mixing in enough runs to get the D's attention and open up the passing game. I'd be happy with a 35 pass/25 run ratio.

I greatly enjoy your analysis and discussions. Packz is just yanking your chain--you Maddenite. :icon_smile:
Pack93z
14 years ago



However, I will also say that more emphasis on the run has seemed to work better for the Packers this year. Maybe it's because the O-line is just not stout enough to pass protect on play after play when the defense is expecting the pass. Maybe it's because our receivers can't get open consistently enough for that kind of offense to work.

"Greg C." wrote:



Agreed.. I don't want a run based team.. but I want a team that looks like the past two weeks.. run enough to setup the pass and shred them with it.

Nothing more..

I posted my thoughts on why run to help the offense enough.. this is it to a tee.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
14 years ago

Zombie.. it was intended to be a joke.. if it offended I am truly sorry.

My comment was meant in the number of statistical numbers you put up was extensive..

I apologize once again if I offended and sounded condescending.. that was not the intent.

I understand your frustration with the stats.. I littered this thread and the playground thread with stats countering the pass heavy ratio but they are ignored as well.

Last two games I have been happy with the mix and the amount of totes.. but I took a bit of offense to being told that basically I am blind with what I see.. then post a visual and get told again that they didn't bite.


But I did not intent to come off as condescending. I was wrong again in that matter in my framing of my post.

"Pack93z" wrote:




UserPostedImage
UserPostedImage

:onfloor: ::razz:
UserPostedImage
dhpackr
14 years ago
I'd like to see Kuhn have more opportunities @ halfback with Quinn Johnson as his lead blocker!
So if you meet me Have some courtesy, Have some sympathy, and some taste
Use all your well-learned politesse, Or I'll lay your soul to waste
Zero2Cool
14 years ago
The rules in the NFL make it easier for their to be an Elite QB than an Elite RB, was that factored into your research?
UserPostedImage
wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
14 years ago
link 


The Green Bay Packers' running game hasn't been great the past two games, but it's at least been good enough to take some of the burden off quarterbacks Aaron Rodgers and Matt Flynn.

The Packers ran the ball a season-high 38 times for 143 yards (3.8 average) during a 31-27 loss to New England two weeks ago with Flynn starting in place of Rodgers, who was sidelined by a concussion. Green Bay had 35 rushing attempts for 119 yards (3.4 average) during a 45-17 victory over the New York Giants last week with Rodgers back in the lineup.

Packers coach Mike McCarthy's faith in the running game has come a long way since a 20-17 loss to the Chicago Bears in Week 3, when the Packers registered a season-low 15 rushing attempts, two of which were scrambles by Rodgers. McCarthy called passes on 78 percent of the plays that Monday night at Soldier Field.

Expect that ratio to be closer to 50-50 when the Packers (9-6) and Bears (11-4) meet again Sunday at Lambeau Field.

"When our attempts are where they have been the last couple weeks, that's the vision of the offense," McCarthy said. "The vision of the offense is not to go out and line up with five wide receivers for 35 snaps. That's not what we're trying to do here.

"I think sometimes that's what people try to say that's what we're trying to do here. I think the quarterbacks and receivers like to do that. But this is not a game of seven-on-seven. It's a game that starts at the line of scrimmage, and it's important to the success of the quarterback which the system is ultimately built around, making him successful that you need to run the ball."

Rodgers was very successful against the Giants, completing 25 of 37 passes for a career-high 404 yards with four touchdowns and no interceptions for a passer rating of 139.9.

According to ESPN's Stats & Information, Rodgers was 11 of 12 for 241 yards with three touchdowns a perfect 158.3 passer rating on play-action passes against the Giants. The play-action fakes were effective because the Giants had to respect the Packers' running game, which produced just enough to warrant attention.

John Kuhn opened the game with a 5-yard run and Brandon Jackson followed with four yards on the next play. The series eventually ended with a punt, but Rodgers hit wide receiver Jordy Nelson for an 80-yard score on the opening play of the second series after Giants safety Antrel Rolle bit on a fake handoff to Jackson.

Backup halfback Dimitri Nance opened the next series with two runs for a combined 11 yards to spark a 10-play drive that ended with a field goal.

"If we can get the ball where it's second-and-6, Mike has a lot of good calls on that sheet," Packers offensive coordinator Joe Philbin said. "A bunch of good ones. Second-and-12, there's still some good ones, but not as many."

Rodgers also had completions of 38 yards to Nelson, 33 to Donald Driver, 26 and 24 to Greg Jennings and 16 to Andrew Quarless off play-action fakes against the Giants. A 5-yard touchdown pass to Kuhn was set up by a fake, as was a 1-yard touchdown pass to tight end Donald Lee.

"We have action passing plays in the plan every week," Packers quarterbacks coach Tom Clements said. "And obviously if you get the running game going, the defense has to react a little bit more to the run fake and you get the opportunity for big chunks of yards. I think it's an important part of our thought process."

Rodgers finished with 45 pass attempts against the Bears on Sept. 27. He completed 75.6 percent of those attempts for 316 yards, but the Packers managed just two touchdowns and a field goal despite gaining 376 yards and holding the ball for 35 minutes, 49 seconds.

Clements thought Rodgers did a good job of staying patient and taking what the Bears gave him.

"That's a large part of it," Clements said. "Because when teams play that, they're trying to take away the easy passes and still prevent the down-the-field throws. You have to be patient; you've got to make sure you're making the right decisions. And if the opportunity is there to make the downfield throw, take it, but don't get bored just taking easy completions."

The Packers averaged 4.2 yards per carry against the Bears, with three runs of 11 yards or longer. But Green Bay went long stretches without running the ball, which showed how little McCarthy trusted the ground game.

Clearly, his attitude has changed as the Packers reach the end of the regular season.

"You have to honor the run now," said Jackson, who leads the Packers with 684 yards. "You just can't disregard it now. We're at a stage now where we're running the ball, eating up clock, and if you don't honor it, we'll get you."


UserPostedImage
Pack93z
14 years ago


According to ESPN's Stats & Information, Rodgers was 11 of 12 for 241 yards with three touchdowns a perfect 158.3 passer rating on play-action passes against the Giants. The play-action fakes were effective because the Giants had to respect the Packers' running game, which produced just enough to warrant attention.

"wpr" wrote:



A few more than I had counted.. but it definitely was effective.

Thanks WPR.. +1
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Zero2Cool
14 years ago

A few more than I had counted.. but it definitely was effective.

Thanks WPR.. +1

"Pack93z" wrote:



Should have taken your socks an sho.....nm
UserPostedImage
Pack93z
14 years ago
What.. the left one has five toes as well.. kind of webbed and rubberier.. but toes no less. lol.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Zero2Cool
14 years ago

What.. the left one has five toes as well.. kind of webbed and rubberier.. but toes no less. lol.

"Pack93z" wrote:

hah thats hot
UserPostedImage
Fan Shout
dfosterf (46m) : 50 cent hookers? I'm moving to Green Bay. I thought it was just real estate that was more affordable there. šŸ˜‚
Zero2Cool (1h) : Sure seems site going down more than 50Ā¢ hooker
Mucky Tundra (27-Jul) : Golden with two TDs in red zone drills today
Mucky Tundra (27-Jul) : @JacobMorley Shoutout to Quinn Ewers for allowing Matthew Golden to be available when Green Bay picked.
Zero2Cool (27-Jul) : The menu you expanded to log in, it's the first icon under "PackersHome" .. maybe i should add text to it
dfosterf (27-Jul) : Feelin' pfowish can't find the sun. No big deal, will drag a laptop out when the time comes
Zero2Cool (27-Jul) : if you're on mobile, open the menu and its the "sun" icon
dfosterf (27-Jul) : Can't find the toggle, lol
dfosterf (27-Jul) : I can find that the Microsoft lady rep for Titletown Tech is the philanthropy boss for the entire Microsoft corporation, but. .
Zero2Cool (27-Jul) : There's a toggle for light/dark theme. Super easy.
dfosterf (27-Jul) : The white background beta was hard to read, especially the quotes
dfosterf (27-Jul) : Hopefully the color scheme remains the same
dfosterf (27-Jul) : *Friday*
dfosterf (27-Jul) : 100 million would be 539 million as of Fridsy
dfosterf (27-Jul) : Heck, they could have taken a hundred milliion and invested in DAVE inc. last year (semi random, humor, but real)
dfosterf (27-Jul) : Beer brat and ticket is where the money comes from
dfosterf (27-Jul) : The 40th is Titletown Tech itself. This is a pet project of both Ed Policy and Mark Murphy
Zero2Cool (27-Jul) : New site coming along nicely. The editor is better than what we have here. Oh yeah!
dfosterf (27-Jul) : No profit that I know of. 0 for 40
dfosterf (27-Jul) : The woke reference has to do with the makeup and oftentimes objectives of the companies they invested in
packerfanoutwest (27-Jul) : beer and brats woke? say whom?
beast (27-Jul) : I don't want to get into politics, but how is, beers and brats considered to be "woke"? Food is food...
beast (27-Jul) : That being said, I'm not saying all 100% should be that way, but not surprised if majority are Wisconsin based
beast (27-Jul) : And if everyone has heard of them, then it it probably has less growth potential and less community based
beast (27-Jul) : Well isn't the investing person supposed to invest the money?
dfosterf (27-Jul) : I swear if I were to discover that one of them has invented a virtue signalling transmitter I will not be surprised, lol
dfosterf (27-Jul) : 39 companies so far that I bet no one has ever heard of.
dfosterf (27-Jul) : -Not saying woke, but should- borderline philanthopist venture capital excercise
dfosterf (27-Jul) : Well for one, they are pouring resources into Title Town Tech. Investing beer, brat, hot dog, ticket money into what is pretty much...
beast (27-Jul) : Wow, 95% drop in investment revenue? Would be interesting to hear the details of why...
dfosterf (25-Jul) : It's my one day deal complaint dept. on shareholder meeting day
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Probably a homer access credential intimidation kinda thing
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Meathead "journalists" skip this, concentrating on operational revenue when convenient. They switch when net revenue is more favorable.
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Resulting in an actual drop of net revenue of 12.5%. She is from Minnesota. Just sayin'
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Any plans to hold Maureen Smith (CFO) accountable for a 95% drop in investment revenue?
Mucky Tundra (25-Jul) : In your face, HBO!
Mucky Tundra (25-Jul) : @ByRyanWood Mark Murphy: ā€œA great source of pride of mine is that we were never on Hard Knocks.ā€
Mucky Tundra (25-Jul) : *years
Mucky Tundra (25-Jul) : @mattschneidman Mark Murphy says he anticipates ā€œmany Packers gamesā€ being played in Germany, Ireland and/or the U.K. over the next 5-10 yea
dfosterf (25-Jul) : *cafeteria* I have hit my head also, so I sympathize
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Possibly hit his head leaning into the glass protecting the food in the cafateria
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Maybe a low flying drone
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Did Savion Williams run into a goalpost or something?
Mucky Tundra (25-Jul) : also, no bueno when a guy starts getting concussions right off the bat in his career
Zero2Cool (25-Jul) : Concussion is worse. Banks probably vet off day via back booboo claim
Mucky Tundra (25-Jul) : @AndyHermanNFL Jordy Nelson out at camp today. No word if he’s in play for one of the two open roster spots ; )
dfosterf (25-Jul) : Is that better or worse than Banks bad back?
Zero2Cool (25-Jul) : Savion concussion ... not good.
packerfanoutwest (24-Jul) : Aaron Rodgers’s first pass of first team period was picked off
Mucky Tundra (24-Jul) : tbh I didn't hear of his passing
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
17h / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

18h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

18h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

27-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

27-Jul / Feedback, Suggestions and Issues / Zero2Cool

27-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

25-Jul / Around The NFL / Mucky Tundra

25-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

25-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / TheKanataThrilla

25-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

25-Jul / Around The NFL / beast

24-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

24-Jul / Around The NFL / beast

24-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

23-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

Headlines
Copyright Ā© 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.comā„¢. All Rights Reserved.