Mucky Tundra
19 days ago

JA's time is running out. I am only looking at the 2025 draft at this time. He will be on the team next year or the Packers will take a $19 mil cap hit.
Since he will be paid more than $25 mil next year and over $27 mil in 2026 he is going to start.

Originally Posted by: wpr 



Given the amount of bodies the team could use at the CB position and they won't have the number of extra picks they've had in the past few years, I was thinking it would be more of a two year thing. One guy early and one guy late in 2025+however they decided to go in 2026. Gutes got no problem using multiple picks on a position and even if the position currently has guys under contract for another year or two.

In addition, the team could potentially cut Jaire in 2026 with a post June 1 designation  and save $19.5 million. Since Jaire has played only full season the past 3 and already missed two games this season, another significant injury might have the team looking for an early off ramp.
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beast
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19 days ago

As of now GB is going to need a CB. Stokes will be gone. Nixon is a pretty good returner but not a boundary corner. Valentine and Ballentine are ok but They need a better option.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


See if you like this Mock better

Here is the BEEF!
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1.28: DT Walker
6'6" 345 lbs pass rushing penetrator, he has NT size, but he plays as the penetrating DT. And unlike some DTs whom rotate out a lot, Walker stays in most of the game like Kenny Clark did. Having over 700 snaps last year when a lot of starting college DTs finish seasons with under 450 as teams rotate them out.

2.59 CB Davis
6'3" 190 lbs, runs a sub 4.5 (good for that height), excels in man coverage and run defense. His grade has actually taken a hit this season as he has been struggling in zone cover. But with the blitzing that Hafley likes to do, our CBs will see man coverage and it's easier to coach a guy up in zone coverage than man coverage.

3.88 TE Warren
In 6 games, he's got 513 yards. Including a record tying 17 catches in one game again USC. 6'6" 260lb, runs about 4.65 (faster than Kraft), great athletic that's a natural hands catch (former QB), needs to improve blocking, but he plays with a very mean attitude, so they desire is there, just a lot of college focus on receiving more than blocking for TEs.

I think Gute would like to have a two TE system at times. Musgrave has tons of talent, but gets injured every season, going all the way highschool.

3.92 RT/OG Cornelius
Absolutely dominated at Rhode Island before transferring to Oregon and kept playing at a high level at RT. Some want to move him to OG, but I think that's mainly just because of his 6'4" height. But like Bakhtiari and Tom, I think he can stay at OT despite only being 6'4". But 315 lbs, and he can move some guys no matter which position you put him at.

4.118 CB Marshall
Florida has produced some qualify CBs but they have usually had one fatal flaw, lack of speed. That's not the case with Marshall whom at 6' 200lb has 4.42 speed, and you can see it as he has a lot of exciting athletic tipped passed. But even if he gets his hands on a lot of passes, don't expect him to catch the ball. Marshall clearly prefers man coverage over zone coverage, but he's much improved in zone this year. But probably will keep needing coaching up on zone in the pros.

4.128 LT Nelson
6'7" 315, 3 year starter for Wisconsin both in a power run offense and now an Air Raid offense, with tons of experience in all styles of blocking. Good at everything, but not great enough, especially with foot speed which could give him issues with some extreme quick pass rushers.

5.160 OT Crenshaw-Dickson
Started at both OT positions for 3 years at San Diego State before transferring to Florida and starting at RT. Also despite the jump in competition has seemingly had his best season. 6'6" 322 lbs.


This mock draft should help with potential FAs in NT Slaton, CB Stokes, CB Ballentine, OT Dillard... and maybe C Myers if one of them moves to OG and then Jenkins goes to Center.


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wpr
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19 days ago

See if you like this Mock better

Here is the BEEF!
 pff_mock_results - 2024-10-16T154701.751.png You have insufficient rights to see the content.
1.28: DT Walker
6'6" 345 lbs pass rushing penetrator, he has NT size, but he plays as the penetrating DT. And unlike some DTs whom rotate out a lot, Walker stays in most of the game like Kenny Clark did. Having over 700 snaps last year when a lot of starting college DTs finish seasons with under 450 as teams rotate them out.

2.59 CB Davis
6'3" 190 lbs, runs a sub 4.5 (good for that height), excels in man coverage and run defense. His grade has actually taken a hit this season as he has been struggling in zone cover. But with the blitzing that Hafley likes to do, our CBs will see man coverage and it's easier to coach a guy up in zone coverage than man coverage.

3.88 TE Warren
In 6 games, he's got 513 yards. Including a record tying 17 catches in one game again USC. 6'6" 260lb, runs about 4.65 (faster than Kraft), great athletic that's a natural hands catch (former QB), needs to improve blocking, but he plays with a very mean attitude, so they desire is there, just a lot of college focus on receiving more than blocking for TEs.

I think Gute would like to have a two TE system at times. Musgrave has tons of talent, but gets injured every season, going all the way highschool.

3.92 RT/OG Cornelius
Absolutely dominated at Rhode Island before transferring to Oregon and kept playing at a high level at RT. Some want to move him to OG, but I think that's mainly just because of his 6'4" height. But like Bakhtiari and Tom, I think he can stay at OT despite only being 6'4". But 315 lbs, and he can move some guys no matter which position you put him at.

4.118 CB Marshall
Florida has produced some qualify CBs but they have usually had one fatal flaw, lack of speed. That's not the case with Marshall whom at 6' 200lb has 4.42 speed, and you can see it as he has a lot of exciting athletic tipped passed. But even if he gets his hands on a lot of passes, don't expect him to catch the ball. Marshall clearly prefers man coverage over zone coverage, but he's much improved in zone this year. But probably will keep needing coaching up on zone in the pros.

4.128 LT Nelson
6'7" 315, 3 year starter for Wisconsin both in a power run offense and now an Air Raid offense, with tons of experience in all styles of blocking. Good at everything, but not great enough, especially with foot speed which could give him issues with some extreme quick pass rushers.

5.160 OT Crenshaw-Dickson
Started at both OT positions for 3 years at San Diego State before transferring to Florida and starting at RT. Also despite the jump in competition has seemingly had his best season. 6'6" 322 lbs.


This mock draft should help with potential FAs in NT Slaton, CB Stokes, CB Ballentine, OT Dillard... and maybe C Myers if one of them moves to OG and then Jenkins goes to Center.

Originally Posted by: beast 



Tripling up at OT is interesting. I realize Gute has a panche for doing that but after taking Morgan this year it seems like a slight reach. I understand that someone is going to get moved inside. Perhaps Cornelius.
While they may well need to go heavy at CB using 5 picks at "two" positions kind of limits them from getting players to add depth elsewhere. But again this is the wwwwway to early draft so it's fine.
The consensus mock draft big board has Walker at #20, going to Bengals at 8. If GB can get him at #32 awesome.
Likewise Davis should go in the first round. If he drops all the way to the bottom of the second we better grab him.
Getting another TE is interesting. If Musgrave comes back healthy and if he meets the expectation fans have for him, do we need to spend another high pick on that position? I don't know. Taking Warren is the same as saying Musgrave is a bust. It's difficult to get the ball to 4 or 5 WRs and 3 TEs too.
What about Parker Brailsford at C Redshirt Soph Bama. 6-2 290. Take him in the 3rd round.


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beast
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19 days ago

Tripling up at OT is interesting. I realize Gute has a panche for doing that but after taking Morgan this year it seems like a slight reach.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


That absolutely was not planned. In round 3, I just wanted an OT, then in rounds 4 and 5 I thought they were the best available. Plus I really don't like our lack of depth behind the starters.

As far as Gute drafting three OL, it's happened before in 2020, 2021, 2022 and in 2024. Though usually one of the OL has some experience at Center. But Gute has drafted 3 OL a lot in recent drafts.

And I haven't seen Morgan take a snap at OT yet. (I have read about it, but haven't seen it).

using 5 picks at "two" positions kind of limits them from getting players to add depth elsewhere.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


True, but right now, they're fairly good at QB, WR, S and they just drafted a bunch of LBers, hopefully Van Ness breaks out at some point, and I did draft a DT and TE fairly high.

What other positions are there? Kicker I guess.

Also, are they going to want to pay both Walker and Tom top dollar starting money? These rookies can backup as rookies and then the best one can replace the OT that the Packers decide to no re-sign.

The consensus mock draft big board has Walker at #20, going to Bengals at 8. If GB can get him at #32 awesome.
Likewise Davis should go in the first round. If he drops all the way to the bottom of the second we better grab him.

Originally Posted by: wpr 

Yeah, PFF just had them down right now as they had some early season struggles, but looks like a number of draft prospects might have a better 2023 than 2024.

The consensus draft, whom do they have the Packers taking?

Getting another TE is interesting. If Musgrave comes back healthy and if he meets the expectation fans have for him, do we need to spend another high pick on that position? I don't know. Taking Warren is the same as saying Musgrave is a bust. It's difficult to get the ball to 4 or 5 WRs and 3 TEs too.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


Sounds like you're complaining about having too many good players...

If the Packers have two good and healthy TEs then they can run more two TE sets and create mismatches. Then just running 3 WRs all the time.

What about Parker Brailsford at C Redshirt Soph Bama. 6-2 290. Take him in the 3rd round.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


Not sure he was still on the board. As PFF has him listed as #70 overall. Also I don't think he'll be on Gute's draft board.

Of all the OL that Gute has drafted, C Jacob Monk is the only one that's under 6'4"... Monk is 6'3" and Brailsford is 6'2". And some places Brailsford is listed as only 275 lbs. And supposedly he's a great pass blocker but sub average run blocker based on grades this year.

I think USC's OC Jonah Monheim might be up the Packers alley, as his best season was 2022 at RT, then in 2023 he played LT, now 2024 he's playing Center.

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wpr
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18 days ago
As usual, so many comments. So little time on my part to respond.

That absolutely was not planned. In round 3, I just wanted an OT, then in rounds 4 and 5 I thought they were the best available. Plus I really don't like our lack of depth behind the starters.

Originally Posted by: beast 



I figured as much. These are not criticisms on my part. Merely comments. I am not a good draft dude.

As far as Gute drafting three OL, it's happened before in 2020, 2021, 2022 and in 2024. Though usually one of the OL has some experience at Center. But Gute has drafted 3 OL a lot in recent drafts.

Originally Posted by: beast 



I didn't mean to imply it has never been done before. I said I found it interesting. Especially after using a 1st round pick the year before.

To recap in 2020 the Packers took:
6 Jon Runyan Jr. OT
6 Jake Hanson C
6 Simon Stepaniak OT
None of them were high draft picks. Only Runyan made the team.The prior year they took Jenkins C in the 2nd so they did draft 3 OL after spending a high pick the year before. Your picks are 3rd, 4th and 5th. Slightly higher than 2020.

2021 saw the packers take:
2 Josh Myers C
4 Royce Newman G
6 Cole Van Lanen OT
Spread out throughout the draft. They already knew they had depth issues.

2022
3 Sean Rhyan OL
4 Zach Tom OL
7 Rasheed Walker OL

I don't have a problem with them taking multiple hits on the line. The have taken a lot of players. Most, like Newman don't pan out.

2024
1 Jordan Morgan OL
5 Jacob Monk OL
6 Travis Glover OT
It's early but I don't see Monk or Glover as being starting players.
One of the things the Packers have done for years is to draft OT and move them inside. As I mentioned I am not a draft person are your OT able to play elsewhere?
I will again say I don't have an issue taking multiple swings at the OL. After doing so for the past few years I would think 2025 is a time they look at other positions to build the depth.
The nice thing about the wwwwway to early drafting, there is no wrong answer because it is wwwwway too early.

And I haven't seen Morgan take a snap at OT yet. (I have read about it, but haven't seen it).

Originally Posted by: beast 



Perhaps next year. Will Walker be on the team in 2025? I don't know. Will Morgan beat him out for the LT job? I don't know.


True, but right now, they're fairly good at QB, WR, S and they just drafted a bunch of LBers, hopefully Van Ness breaks out at some point, and I did draft a DT and TE fairly high.

What other positions are there? Kicker I guess.

Originally Posted by: beast 


As you pointed out they have drafted a lot of OL over the past 4 years. Perhaps depth at CB. (You did take two) Another LBer. EDGE always needs help and they have not figured out the IDL yet.

Also, are they going to want to pay both Walker and Tom top dollar starting money? These rookies can backup as rookies and then the best one can replace the OT that the Packers decide to no re-sign.

Originally Posted by: beast 


Tom - yes
Walker - IDK.

Yeah, PFF just had them down right now as they had some early season struggles, but looks like a number of draft prospects might have a better 2023 than 2024.

The consensus draft, whom do they have the Packers taking?

Originally Posted by: beast 


Amarius Mims OT Georgia @ 25. I thought about selecting him but would like help at CB and EDGE too.

Sounds like you're complaining about having too many good players...


If the Packers have two good and healthy TEs then they can run more two TE sets and create mismatches. Then just running 3 WRs all the time.

Originally Posted by: beast 



Nope. Never. I repeat I said your selections were interesting. Not wrong. Probably the most interesting aspect is 3 OT insead of mixing a C or G in the mix. Of course I am not implying they can't move one of your selections inside. But my comment was if you have 3-4 good WR and 3 good TE they can't all get on the field at the same time. A few of them will be underutilized. That's one of the reasons we don't have 8 WR like some fans wanted a few years ago. A 3rd OT is more needful than WR 7 is. I realize you already know this.


Not sure he was still on the board. As PFF has him listed as #70 overall. Also I don't think he'll be on Gute's draft board.
Of all the OL that Gute has drafted, C Jacob Monk is the only one that's under 6'4"... Monk is 6'3" and Brailsford is 6'2". And some places Brailsford is listed as only 275 lbs. And supposedly he's a great pass blocker but sub average run blocker based on grades this year.

I think USC's OC Jonah Monheim might be up the Packers alley, as his best season was 2022 at RT, then in 2023 he played LT, now 2024 he's playing Center.

Originally Posted by: beast 



I looked at Brailsford's height. Somewhere in the back of my mind I remember reading that a smaller C is not all bad. Larger centers have a problem snapping the ball then moving into position to block. In reality I don't see where an inch or two matters as much as the players own innate abilities.


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beast
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16 days ago

One of the things the Packers have done for years is to draft OT and move them inside. As I mentioned I am not a draft person are your OT able to play elsewhere?

Originally Posted by: wpr 

Cornelius at 6'4" should be able to slide into OG without any issues. The other two might need to stay at OT due to be 6'6" or taller. Some 6'6" guys can play OG, but not all.


I will again say I don't have an issue taking multiple swings at the OL. After doing so for the past few years I would think 2025 is a time they look at other positions to build the depth.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


Where as I look at the teams depth and think one of the areas that they have the least amount of depth is the OL.

The OL depth scares me a lot more than the depth elsewhere, I don't care that we've drafted a lot of OL, I think they need to keep drafting them until the OL depth is a strength.

And right now, OG might be great... but OT depth might be non-existent. And with Myers being a FA, Center looks like a whole, unless they're planning on moving Jenkins there full-time.

Perhaps next year. Will Walker be on the team in 2025? I don't know. Will Morgan beat him out for the LT job? I don't know.

Originally Posted by: wpr 

Currently Tom, Walker and Rhyan all become FAs in 2026... that's potentially three starters in one off-season. Might be nice to have some 2nd year players ready to replace them.

As for things we don't know, do the Packers have plans to let Morgan compete at OT going forward? Or is he mainly an OG?


As you pointed out they have drafted a lot of OL over the past 4 years. Perhaps depth at CB. (You did take two) Another LBer. EDGE always needs help and they have not figured out the IDL yet.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


I mock drafted two CBs, and took a DT in the first round. And Edge has great depth, they don't need depth, but they could use another stud at the top of the draft, but then that would of taken away from the DT or CB that I mocked.

I think LB is fairly solid, assuming they're going to re-sign Wilson again. Maybe McDuffie too, but maybe not. I think another depth guy, that does well on STs.



Probably the most interesting aspect is 3 OT insead of mixing a C or G in the mix.

Originally Posted by: wpr 

I feel like we're pretty good at OG, at least until Jenkins goes to C or Morgan goes to OT.

Also I feel like the Packers don't draft OGs, they draft OTs and move them to OGs... and a few Centers too.

As for Centers, there are two I really like and would happily of taken in the 5th round (maybe even 4th) but PFF's grades for them fit more the 6th round. I don't remember their names, but I believe from Florida and Missouri. They have the size Gute is looking for as well.



I looked at Brailsford's height. Somewhere in the back of my mind I remember reading that a smaller C is not all bad. Larger centers have a problem snapping the ball then moving into position to block. In reality I don't see where an inch or two matters as much as the players own innate abilities.

Originally Posted by: wpr 


A lot of teams don't mind smaller Centers. Or a smaller OL once in a while (especially at Center)

BUT, so far Gute OL draft history, just hasn't been one of them.

As long as he's good, I'm cool with a smaller Center. This isn't me arguing against smaller Centers, just, I think either Gute or someone in control of the Packers has a type, and it generally has seemed to be a minimum of 6'4".

As I said, they finally broke that, and went with 6'3" Monk as a

Jenkins 6'4½"
Hanson 6'4⅜"
Myers 6'5¼"
Tom 6'4¼"
Monk 6'3"

Monk is an inch and a quarter shorter than any other Center prospect Gute has drafted. Gute goes for those tall Centers like John Elway went for the tall QBs, except Gute didn't keep drafting them in the first round.


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beast
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12 hours ago
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1.23) CB Revel
A bit of a high risk, high reward situation here, as Revel is a small school CB, coming off a season ending injury, but when healthy, he's been an absolute athletic freak of nature.

Add to that he's got great length, is a fiery competitor, willing to be physically and has played on STe blocking kicks and his potential is through the ceiling.

With his back to the QB, he can get too handy, but the Packers have played a lot of zone coverage and blitz heavy when they go man coverage.


3.67) OL Monheim
In three years, Monheim has started at 3 different positions, RT, then LT and finally Center. His best season was at RT. He moved to Center with the idea that due to his arm length, his future might be on the inside in the NFL.

At Center, Monheim got off to a slow start, but has been doing a heck of a lot better this second half of the season, he just had to adjust to the new position. And Packers love versatility and Monheim might be a 5 OL position player. Though, might be best on the inside at the NFL level. And Monheim has the size that Gute seems to look for at OL.


4.104) WR Bryant
Very physical possession WR. Bryant has build up straight speed to win deep, but lacks explosive movements and change of direction. He's got great body control, hands and is always giving it 100%, and keeps his mother very hot, even during blocking.

Against the Lions, we saw a huge run where the LT and LG took out the DT, Kraft took out the DE, and I believe it was WR Wicks that took out the LB. And as we saw with Lazard, we need some WRs that can both play WR but also block very well.


4.110) DT Harmon
An athletic 6'4" 310lbs, this pick is all about scheme fit. In a defensive scheme that wants it DTs to get off blocks and get penetration, I think Harmon could be the perfect fit. Harmon might struggle against run stopping against double teams, but get him singled up and he gets off blocks and adds pressure to the backfield.


4.115) CB Marshall
It seems like Florida has always delivered a pipeline of technically sound CBs to the NFL, with one major issue, they're slow. Marshall might finally be one of the exception to that, with 4.45 speed, and maybe more importantly, explosive acceleration.

Marshall gets his hands on a lot of passes and knocks them down, but don't expect him to catch many, as he's got stone hands when it comes to catching the ball.


4.124) LT Pierce
I think he's one of the most underrated players in mock drafts, because he plays for the Rutgers, whom never get much hype. All he does is keep getting better, after starting his college career extremely overweight, he's now a fairly athletic 6'7" 345 lbs, and I think he's continuing to work to get the weight even lower.

Pierce started at RT in 2022, and at LT the last two seasons and he just keeps getting better each year. I wouldn't be surprised to see him taken in the top 2 rounds.


5.145) RT Crenshaw-Dickson
A recent transfer from San Diego State, it was unclear how a jump in playing levels to the SEC would be, but so far, Crenshaw-Dickson is doing great in passing protection. Doing well in zone run blocking, but struggling in power run blocking. But pass blocking is always the most important and he seems to be doing that well, in a 6'6" 320lb frame.


5.158 DT Slackman
This one is simple, when healthy, Slackman has been dominant, he just hasn't been healthy in 2024. But he was the previous two seasons.
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