isocleas2
6 years ago
I thought about tieing this with the DACA kids since they also are being used as political bargaining chips at the moment, but the issue is different enough it should have its own topic.

What do you guys think, should we be separating children from their parents for the crime of crossing into the country illegally? Also how do you feel about families seeking asylum from violence in central america, should they be treated differently?

One of my first girlfriends in college was from Latvia her parents immigrated here when she was 4 or 5, and her father wasn't able to get his papers to travel for a few years after that. She still had her mother, aunt, sister and cousins but the way she talked about how traumatic it was to be without her father clearly left a longterm impression on her. I worry that migrant children being sent to state foster care are going to be far worse off than that.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/nation-now/2018/05/25/immigration-children-separated-families-lost-column/643793002/ 

The feds lost — yes, lost — 1,475 migrant children. Before announcing a plan to separate more children from families, shouldn't there be a plan to adequately protect the children?
DarkaneRules
6 years ago
Politicians have no souls.
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
KRK
  • KRK
  • Veteran Member
6 years ago
This has been an issue for sometime, but now that Obama is out of office, “its all Trump’s doing...”
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-05-28/caged-migrant-children-photo-goes-viral-left-rages-trump-except-it-happened-under 

alas he has to clean up many messes not of his creation.

Regrettably, the children are facing the consequences of their parents decisions....as we all do. That is the way the world works.

The best solution, is to not allow them to get here in the first place. Until that is solved, any solutions are fruitless.

I would suggest that any effective solution is not a government solution. If there are going to be shelters for these kids, it needs to be done by organizations, probably faith based, that will take nurturing care of the kids.

The government will screw it up...as it does just about every other thing it touches.









In Luce tua Videmus Lucem KRK
Cheesey
6 years ago
KRK, you summed it up well.
Until we can stop people from coming here illegally, this kind of thing will happen.
In the end, whose fault is it really? It’s the people that CHOOSE to break the laws that were set up to protect American citizens, by coming here illegally. It’s not anyone else’s fault.
What are we supposed to do? Ignore our laws because they have children?
THEY broke the law and KNEW the consequences if they got caught. The consequences to their children belongs on THEIR heads only.

Just more proof that we need a wall to protect our border. That would end this from happening in the future.
UserPostedImage
dyeah_gb
6 years ago

I thought about tieing this with the DACA kids since they also are being used as political bargaining chips at the moment, but the issue is different enough it should have its own topic.

What do you guys think, should we be separating children from their parents for the crime of crossing into the country illegally? Also how do you feel about families seeking asylum from violence in central america, should they be treated differently?

One of my first girlfriends in college was from Latvia her parents immigrated here when she was 4 or 5, and her father wasn't able to get his papers to travel for a few years after that. She still had her mother, aunt, sister and cousins but the way she talked about how traumatic it was to be without her father clearly left a longterm impression on her. I worry that migrant children being sent to state foster care are going to be far worse off than that.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/nation-now/2018/05/25/immigration-children-separated-families-lost-column/643793002/ 

The feds lost — yes, lost — 1,475 migrant children. Before announcing a plan to separate more children from families, shouldn't there be a plan to adequately protect the children?

Originally Posted by: isocleas2 



You seem to be quite sympathetic and concerned about this issue. Just curious. How many refuge children in the foster system have you adopted? How much money have you given to Central American charities to help those victims? Not saying this applies to you, but there alot of people that like to make themselves feel morally superior about this issue while expecting others to bear the burden. Look at the example in affluent (and very liberal) New York City as one of many recent examples.

The reality is that this has nothing to do with the poor families and children and everything to do with attacking the executive branch for trying to enforce the laws.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool - R. Feynman
nerdmann
6 years ago
They don't lose the children. They harvest their organs. After sex trafficking them, of course.

What kind of parent would bring their child to a place where they know they are going to be taken away?
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
nerdmann
6 years ago

You seem to be quite sympathetic and concerned about this issue. Just curious. How many refuge children in the foster system have you adopted? How much money have you given to Central American charities to help those victims? Not saying this applies to you, but there alot of people that like to make themselves feel morally superior about this issue while expecting others to bear the burden. Look at the example in affluent (and very liberal) New York City as one of many recent examples.

The reality is that this has nothing to do with the poor families and children and everything to do with attacking the executive branch for trying to enforce the laws.

Originally Posted by: dyeah_gb 



The people who overthrew the US government on Sept 11, will do anything and everything to get their power back. How often do you see a news piece, late night comedian, morning show or anything whatsoever in the mainstream media favorable in anyway towards the "Trump Junta?"

I mean, except for Roseanne...
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Barfarn
6 years ago

The reality is that this has nothing to do with the poor families and children and everything to do with attacking the executive branch for trying to enforce the laws.

Originally Posted by: dyeah_gb 



There's no law intimating in any way that these kids should be separated from parents.

There are some very specific laws that regulate how our government is to treat a person, who is not a citizen, that presents themselves at a US border seeking asylum. And these laws are NOT being followed.

Why dont you describe the law/laws the executive branch is enforcing by this action...just one!
Barfarn
6 years ago

This has been an issue for sometime, but now that Obama is out of office, “its all Trump’s doing...”
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-05-28/caged-migrant-children-photo-goes-viral-left-rages-trump-except-it-happened-under 

alas he has to clean up many messes not of his creation.

Regrettably, the children are facing...

Originally Posted by: KRK 



The regret shows there's a moral compass to work with; but your blame on Obama is egregiously misplaced.

The current Administration announced their NEW “get tough” policy to separate Children from parents. This NEW policy was first announced by Sessions in Scottsdale, AZ on May 7.

But, it’s okay! John Kelly doubled down on certifying the NEW policy by announcing the separated children would be “taken care of” by being put in “foster care or whatever.” Imagine your children are taken, you scream, “where are you taking them?!?!” And you’re told they’ll be taken to “foster care or whatever.” Whatever?! Really? WTF!

Of course, separations have occurred under each and every past administration. There is a HUGE difference between a random occurrence of abuse and a pronounced premeditated purposeful POLICY to part parents from their progeny.

The administration announces a policy that warms the heart of their racist and xenophobic sycophants. At the same time a message is sent that today’s Statue of Liberty has dropped the torch of liberty and tabula ansata and now dons an ICE badge and a slave catching net. The announcement of separating children, the Wall, the “Muslim Bans”, the pardoning of Arpaio, the acquiescence to the uptick in murders and physical abuses by ICE agents, etc. are about sending a message [Nerd picked up on this] to the world’s nonwhites: “WE DON’T WANT YOU…If you come you will be harassed.”

If only it would end there; a moral America would deal with this quickly! But then…

Trump tweets falsely that he’s just following Obama’s laws.

Then the right-wing, alt-right media machine goes into propaganda overdrive.

Zerohedge examples one random abuse, posting a pic of 2 kids in a cage from 2014 and opines that Trump is just cleaning up Obama’s mess.

The National Review posts “A Twitter Fail Reveals That Media Narratives about Obama Still Trump the Truth.” It’s the same pic of the 2 kids in a cage in ’14, with same message.

Every single right-wing radio show that we monitor spoke of the same 2014 pic; most talked about this for the ENTIRE show…just over and over and over again. A broadcast designed to inform discusses a topic and moves on. The steady repeated drumbeat of the same message and mantras repeated over and over is a pure act of propaganda.

Of course, they had a few other stories, like the National review: “We lost sight of immigration debate;” “The border hysteria.” And others toss in an MS-13 story and/or a story of an immigrant committing a crime.

FYI: This is the exact propaganda tact Nazi’s used in the 1930’s when discussing the Jewish; anyone remember that outcome?
KRK
  • KRK
  • Veteran Member
6 years ago
B,
I don’t understand why you are asserting that I blamed Obama. I am merely pointing out the hypocrisy of the left which, now that Trump is President, wants to make this a problem of his doing.
I agree with your assertion that the lack of a moral compass is a major problem in our country. A moral compass and a moral society is a key underpinning of our constitutional republic.
In Luce tua Videmus Lucem KRK
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