Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
8 years ago
Since the lockout really, my passion for football hasn't changed in the slightest, but my investment in the NFL as a whole has fallen off greatly. I still follow it, I still pay attention, but I am not all in like I once was. I have filled the jonesing with college and high school ball...

While the lockout (greed) started my waning passion for the league, it is more the changing of the game at its core that is slowly killing my interest. From the bias in the rule books toward the "candy-ass" QB's to the overall general theme to truly put the defense at a increased disadvantage rule by rule. The emphasis to make the game an offensive tilted game... an uneven playing field if you will.

And while I get the importance of making the game safer, instead of teaching players to actually form tackle from the youth up, they are trying to enforce a magical "sweet" spot to drill players or forcing them to go low and knee cap more players. Making jersey grabs around the nameplates just another form to allow the offense to have the advantage. On and on.... adjustments to the game are not made just to make it safer, they are geared to making it more and more about scoring then defending.

And don't get me started on the freaking inability to clearly define a catch.... lol...

Where I would like some help, throw out some thoughts on what still makes the NFL great, still makes it king of professional sports.

Explain why the product is better today than it was 10 years ago... or 20.... open my eyes that probably have grown into the old man protesting the damn kids to get the f@#k off my lawn.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
nerdmann
8 years ago
I look at it as ritual combat. Western culture was founded on the Greek Agon, the contest of wills between equally matched opponents. The use of the will to cultivate excellence through strenuous effort.

Boxing is fixed. I suppose there's MMA.

Goodall has some fixation with changing rules every year to turn the game into Madden. To me, that shit is cheap and gimmicky. From the deferring coin toss rule, to this bullshit with extra points and the new touchback rule, it's destroyin the game.

What really bothers me is the subjectivity of calls against the defense. Officials routinely decide the outcome of games.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
8 years ago
You pretty much nailed it. There have been so many changes it hardly resembles the game I grew up with.

They will never take it back to the old ways when NFL Inc is wallowing in gold. If they owned their own printing press they could never print it as fast as they are making now.
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sschind
8 years ago
I wonder if the changes are really having the effect that people are complaining about or is it just that, something to complain about. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to tell anyone how to enjoy the game or what changes they should or should not complain about. All I am saying is that you should ask yourself are the current changes really going to make that big of a difference in the game and if not are they worth worrying about. Are we going to be sitting around after each game wondering if a cut block here or there would have been enough to spring Eddie Lacy for the TD? I doubt it.

All this talk about the game tilting toward the offense and yet it was a stifling defense that won the last Super Bowl. I love hard defensive play and a good old fashioned pound the ball on the ground type game and I agree that the changes are geared towards getting away from that. IMO that just makes it all the more special when it happens. RBs seem to be so devalued now that one who is special is really special.

All these comments as to how the game doesn't even resemble the game of old IMO are also blown way out of proportion. Its still 11 guys trying to stop 11 other guys from moving the ball down the field. I'm sure there were lots of complaints that the merger would ruin the game and I'm sure there were those who were not all that keen on plastic helmets and facemasks either. All that and the game is stronger than ever.

I suppose I'm a bit different from most fans here in that I was never a real big football fan. I'm a huge Green Bay Packer fan but if the Packers aren't playing I'm just not that interested. Bronco's/Panthers was the first Super Bowl I watched since the Packers beat the Steelers and there were probably only 4 or 5 I watched between that one and the previous Packers appearance in the game. As such, these changes just don't affect me. I guess its partly because I have come to realize that I have no affect on the game so why should I let the game affect me. I watch each game primarily to be entertained not to analyze the outcome, though I do that as well from time to time.

So while I can't give you specifics on how to regain your passion for the NFL I can suggest that you stop taking it all so seriously. Instead of worrying why its not that important to you anymore embrace the fact that you have a new found appreciation for the college and high school game. Enjoy what you can, be it the Packers winning or the vikings and Bears losing or whatever and let the rest of it go. Its a game and IMO its not worth it.

The Bottom line for me, the NFL is not great. The Green Bay Packers are great and its because of the NFL that they exist so in that respect I am grateful to the NFL but if it weren't for the Packers and the Wilmot Panthers and the Western Kenosha County Bulldogs I might not ever watch another football game in my life. And it doesn't bother me at all to feel that way.
Laser Gunns
8 years ago
The lockout wasn't "greed".

The contract between the NFLPA and NFL expired (as it should). If you expected anything but barbs from the union or league you are fooling yourself. It negotiation tactics..

The NCAA is a FAR more corrupt shit machine than the NFL. So how you could prefer that I have no idea. (Why the fuck am I going in debt to pay my tuition while they build a 30-million dollar stadium?)

Edit: TWO HUNDRED AND EIGHTY MILLION DOLLAR RENOVATION.

The NFL rule changes brought on the the lawsuits of the players.. The same entitled shits who's free education apparently isn't good enough to teach them repeated head trauma is bad for long term health.

You can't not like one but like the other. Because it's mostly the same shitheads

As far as protecting the QB.. It is a little nuts at times, but it is a good change. They are too important to not only the franchise's success but also the players around him. Having a rotation of backup QBs greatly diminishes the earning potential of the players around him.

Not to mention the shitty boring sloppy games. There are not 32 NFL QBs worthy of starting at any given time.. And it is apparent how losing the QB potentially dooms a season.

MintBaconDrivel
Dec, 11, 2012 - FOREVER!
DarkaneRules
8 years ago
Posted to wrong topic
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
8 years ago
Completely respect your opinion sschind, and that is more or less what it has become for me, not a passion just another form of entertainment.

Thing is, it is the core game of football, the intimate chess match that has fueled over 4 decades of craziness... and yes, many of the changes do impact the game greatly. But yes, that does make a run like the Broncos had late last season even more special, as the cards are stacked against them more in the rule books. My counterpoint to that, I would like to see more of that style sprinkled in the weekly fantasy driven games of every weekend. Balance so to speak... not a league were if you have a talented QB, you have a built in advantage that takes more to overcome. Could the same not be said about passing offenses? Where the truly special ones stand out if the game isn't geared toward making more games shootouts with high octane passing games?

Just a couple numbers to put context to that continuing slide...

2015 -
League Pt - 11680
League Yards - 180566
Passing Yards - 124847
Comp % - 62.99%
Pass TD - 842
INT - 436
TD/INT Ratio - 1.93

League Avg 1990 -1995
League Pt - 8946
League Yards - 141452
Passing Yards - 92010
Comp % - 56.02%
Pass TD - 561
INT - 490
TD/INT Ratio - 1.14

2005 -
League Pt - 10556
League Yards - 161751
Passing Yards - 104168
Comp % - 59.46%
Pass TD - 644
INT - 506
TD/INT Ratio - 1.27

From the 90's to last season - 39,000 plus more yards a season... and almost 33,000 of them passing yards. Points up over 30%... 2 to 1 ratios of TD to Picks. The 2005 marker gives some idea of the trend.. year by year they are slowly tilting the scales. In 1996 they started to enforce the 5 yard rule with much more scrutiny, that slowly bumped the numbers... then they added all the candy ass QB rules throughout the next decade to get to the track meets of today.

Yes, in the end, it is still and offense against a defense... but it is a loaded game to lend to fantasy football and the casual fans. Again... making the teams with talented QB's at even more of an advantage.



"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
8 years ago

The lockout wasn't "greed".

The contract between the NFLPA and NFL expired (as it should). If you expected anything but barbs from the union or league you are fooling yourself. It negotiation tactics..

Originally Posted by: Laser Gunns 



The owners opted out of a deal that had existed and was renewed successfully 4 times in a period that seen record growth in both operating profits and players salaries... both sides were winning.. yet they both needed more.

How is that not the definition of greed?

But in the end, yes I expected conflict, but I also expected them to be able to reach an agreement within a 3 year window to prevent a work stoppage.

As far as the NCAA, no I am not a fan of the organization itself and the greed they display, but I certainly like that brand of football much more than the pro product being shuffled out weekly.


"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
8 years ago
Like sschind I've always been a Packer fan rather than a NFL fan. So, as long as the Packers still interest me, that's all I care about. And when it comes to the Packers, so far I've pretty much been able to retain my interest despite all of the following which I despise about the game's evolution:

1. The legalism. The rule book of football should neither look like, be as long as, or read like, the US Tax Code. It should be nearly as simple as the pick-up games we played when I was a kid. Simple 5 or 15 yard penalties for offsides, illegal procedure/motion, holding, clipping, too many men on field, delay of game, pass interference [I would support making this one a 15 yard penalty], intentional grounding, personal foul, unsportsmanlike conduct. Late hits/taunting, celebration, whatnot either fit easily in a basic fairness interpretation of one of the last two or aren't penalties.

("Basic fairness" and "interpretation" being applied as if the big kid referree were a local magistrate untrained in the law rather than someone who thinks like a lawyer.)

2. The legalism, part II. Approaching rules like perfect justice is possible. Bad calls will get made, some of them that will forever go down in history as "my team got screwed by the refs". Tough. That's the way ordinary life works. And this is just a damn game. Worrying about getting a game perfect when real life is never in this world going to approach perfection is just damn loony.

3. The marketing focus. Virtually everything not determined and argued about in the manner of bad lawyers is determined according to the worst of corporate marketing philosophies. Uniform police. Playing games on plastic. Players and execs who bitch about the condition of the field or the rain.

4. Dumbing down the game. MNF booth shots/interviews and ESPN "reporters". Sideline "commentary." Play by play and color commentary: "Starr. Dowler. Touchdown" is all you need for video. Radio that describes the formation and substitutions and evolution of play as it happens is good. Frank Gifford pre-game highlights or Howard Cosell halftime highlights are good. Everything else is crap and more crap. .

4. Dumbing down the game meets the marketing focus. If I want to listen to Hank Jr's or PRince's singing, I'll listen to a CD or go to a concert; if I want to ogle Faith Hill's legs, I'll watch a you-tube video. It's about the damn game. It's not about simplifying the game so any braindead couch potato can stay awake enough to drink a 12 pack and eat two family-size bags of potato chips. Anyone who takes a little bit of time thinking about the game (a little bit of time means "have played or supervised to pickup football games between 10 year olds twice", knows that football is more than having ten touchdowns a game and protecting prima donnas so they can have 4000 passing yards every season.

5. Getting rid of end-zone to end-zone bump-and-run coverage. Do you realize there are 51 players who have more total receiving yards than Ray Berry? How many of them do you think would still exceed his total had they, as he did, played his entire career before the stupid league started adding to the illegal contact rules. People like to say today's players are better blah blah blah.....well, I beg to disagree. Jerry Rice might have still made the Hall of Fame. But he would never have had 2.5 times Berry's passing yards. (Similarly, Peyton Manning may well still have been a first-ballot HOFer; but would he have been able to last long enough to enter Johnny Unitas's neighborhood in either TDs or yards? I'm skeptical.)

6. The incredible lack of a sense of history going back more than a decade or so. Packer fans and (IMO the team itself) are so far above the league average in this respect it is just incredible. I venture a guess if you did a representative sample of NFL "fans" who pay regular attention to what the idiots in the "color commentator" parts of the press box and who sit at "Sportscenter" desks, you'd discover that less than 10% of them even know who Ray Berry was, much less how much he did under the old rules of wide receiver protection. And while more of them would know who Unitas was, how many know what he managed under the old non-pass-happy rules?

And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
8 years ago
Wade that is the whole problem. NFL Inc dumbs down the rules because they would rather have 100 million casual fans- most who never picked up the ball. Than 5 million fans who know the history of the game and came home after dark with mud on their pants, blood on their face and their shirt ripped and stretched 3 sizes larger than it was when they left home that morning.
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Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : Even with the context it's ... what?
Mucky Tundra (20-Nov) : Matt LaFleur without context: “I don’t wanna pat you on the butt and you poop in my hand.”
beast (20-Nov) : We brought in a former Packers OL coach to help evaluate OL as a scout
beast (20-Nov) : Jets have been pretty good at picking DL
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He landed good players thanks to high draft slot. He isn't good.
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He can shove his knowledge up his ass. He knows nothing.
beast (20-Nov) : More knowledge, just like bring in the Jets head coach
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : What? Why? Huh?
beast (19-Nov) : I wonder if the Packers might to try to bring Douglas in through Milt Hendrickson/Ravens connections
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : The Jets fired Joe Douglas, per sources
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Jets are a mess......
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Pretty sure Jets fired their scouting staff and just pluck former Packers.
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Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : When you cycle the weeks, the total over remains for season. But you get your W/L for that selected week. Confusing.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the totals are accurate..nrvrtmind
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : I don't follow what you are saying. The totals are not the same as last week.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : ok so then wht are the totals the same as last week?
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : NFL Pick'em is auto updated when NFL Scores tab is clicked
Martha Careful (19-Nov) : The offense was OK. Let's not forget the Bear defense is very very good.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Who updates the leaderboard on NFLPickem?
beast (19-Nov) : Has the Packers offense been worse since the former Jets coach joined the Packers?
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Offense gets his ass in gear, this could be good.
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Backup QB helped with three wins. Special Teams contributed to three wins.
bboystyle (18-Nov) : Lions played outside thats why. They scored 16 and 17 in the only 2 outside games this year
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : The rest of the NFL is catching up to Packers ... kicking is an issue throughout league
packerfanoutwest (18-Nov) : Packers DL Kenny Clark: We knew 'we were going to block' Bears' game-winning field goal attempt
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : Lions seem to be throttling everyone, but only (only) got 24 lol maybe the rain is why
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : Packers vs Lions game doesn't seem so bad.
beast (18-Nov) : Dennis Green "They are what we thought they were, and we let them off the hook!"
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : comment of the day Z2Cool "Bears better than we want to admit. Packers worse than we think. It's facts."
Mucky Tundra (17-Nov) : my worst case scenario: Bears fix their oline and get a coach like Johnson from the Lions and his scheme
Zero2Cool (17-Nov) : Bears get OL fixed amd we might have a problem
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : Pretty sure they already have scouting reports on guys who aren't even starting for their college team. The future is now for me.
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : I tend to let Gute and Co. Worry about the future.
beast (17-Nov) : That's great news and Packers need to keep upgrading their OL, DL and DBs this off-season, so missing one guy doesn't kill them
beast (17-Nov) : That's great news and Packers need to keep upgrading their OL, DL and DBs this off-season, so missing one guy doesn't kill them
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : Jaire and Evans Williams are both ACTIVE! Good news.
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : The badgers really need to change the whole offensive scheme. No draws no screens plus the quarterback is marginal
Cheesey (17-Nov) : If the Badgers had a decent QB, they would have won. The guy can't hit a wide open receiver
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : chop block
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : there was a very questionable job Block call that upon viewing replay was very borderline
beast (17-Nov) : How so? (I didn't watch)
Zero2Cool (17-Nov) : Badgers got hosed vs Oregon
packerfanoutwest (16-Nov) : damn,he hasn't played since week 2
Mucky Tundra (15-Nov) : poor guy can't catch a break
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