nerdmann
8 years ago

When Dakota speaks on Rodgers like this, here is what I see:

Ted Thompson sitting in a comfy chair in the grotto wearing his safari hat and sunglasses, a smoking jacket over his silk pajamas, puffing on a pipe, drinking a Dos Equis and two slightly plumb pasty white Wisconsin chicks clad in cheese foam bras and panties sitting on each arm of his chair each with one arm on his shoulder.

He snaps his fingers and says, “Chives, go get me Gronkowski!”

He then turns to Dakota and says, "I don’t find TEs very often, but when I do I find me some Gronkowskis."

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 



Talent is not what has kept us out of the SB, the last two seasons.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Zero2Cool
8 years ago
Speaking as a moderator AND fan here, I couldn't give two craps what anyone sees when someone else speaks. No one is coming to the site to read what one fan thinks about another fan. This is a Packers discussion forum so how about we stick to analyzing the PACKERS? Thank you.


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Porforis
8 years ago

Yeah, yeah - and having mediocrity at one of the skill positions on a prolific offense is fucking stupid and epic failure from our GM. And some of you guys defend that stupid shit.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



And yet you've continued to ignore a perfectly valid series of requests to explain what specifically our epic failure of a GM who is fucking stupid should have done instead and why. I mean, shouldn't it be super easy to explain if he's that fucking stupid?

Not trying to be a pain in the ass or anything, honestly interested in your opinion on this one (and in general trying to promote actual discussion). I'll be the first to admit that I'm not into football enough to pay attention to anything but the higher-end FAs, upcoming draft class and the like and that the majority of the people on this forum are better-informed than I am on this.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
8 years ago

Accepting you cannot have 22 All Pro future Hall of Famer's is not accepting mediocrity on the roster. It's more likely that folks understand the NFL has a Salary Cap, roster limitation, and the pool of talent in the NFL is spread thin among 32 NFL teams.



I sure as heck hope we try to find one! I really think a middle field stretching TE would do the offense magic.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Does GB use all of their salary cap?
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Zero2Cool
8 years ago

Does GB use all of their salary cap?

Originally Posted by: Wade 



Packers have $6.953 million of the 2015 Salary Cap that can be carried over to 2016.
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Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
8 years ago

Packers have $6.953 million of the 2015 Salary Cap that can be carried over to 2016.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



And the Packers had more than one whose quality might have been substantially increased with an extra expenditure of 6 million 2015 dollars, no?

Could one have bought someone better than Rodgers at TE with 6 million? Better than Perillo or the other guy whose name I can't remember?

No team can afford to pay 22 all-pros. But any team can, and should, be spending money to improve at positions where they don't have all-pros. And the farther a position is from having an all-pro, one might argue, the more effort they need to be giving to upgrade.

And few positions on the GB roster have current personnel performed at a level more below the all-pro level than TE.



And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Zero2Cool
8 years ago

And the Packers had more than one whose quality might have been substantially increased with an extra expenditure of 6 million 2015 dollars, no?

Could one have bought someone better than Rodgers at TE with 6 million? Better than Perillo or the other guy whose name I can't remember?

No team can afford to pay 22 all-pros. But any team can, and should, be spending money to improve at positions where they don't have all-pros. And the farther a position is from having an all-pro, one might argue, the more effort they need to be giving to upgrade.

And few positions on the GB roster have current personnel performed at a level more below the all-pro level than TE.

Originally Posted by: Wade 



Wade, in the NFL you do not spend your last nickel when you have core players (e.g. MIKE DANIELS) to re-sign.

The Packers had confidence Richard Rodgers (who had a good last quarter of 2014) would progress from year one to year two and probably didn't think Andrew Quarless would miss significant time due to injury. Do you pay 32 year old Owen Daniels 3 yr(s) / $12,250,000 when he failed your physical and with the aforementioned tight ends? If you use hindsight, sure, especially since the hindsight tells you Jordy Nelson is lost due to ACL. Daniels was also signed prior to the NFL Draft.

The injury to Sam Barrington hurt the inside linebacker position.

Every team in the NFL has positions where they could upgrade. The problem is simply because you have X amount of dollars after the season, it does not directly correlate to being able to acquire the missing talent.
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Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
8 years ago
I thought that six+ million was AFTER the Daniels re-signing?

I understand the need to keep a fund for during-season/injury-replacement signings. Yet with all the injuries the Packers had, they still didn't use that much?

I think the point others are making is that this is not a one-time thing for Thompson. How many years have the Packers had "money left" despite having lots of injuries? How many years have they had *more* than $6-7 left?

Any financial manager worth his/her salary knows the importance of saving for contingent risks. But any financial manager worth that salary also knows that too much saving is also a bad thing. Any financial manager knows you also have to take risks, some of them substantial.

The real question is where do you draw the line. I don't think anyone has argued that Thompson should be taking the risk management approach that Dan Snyder does. That would be like your financial adviser telling you to put all your money into naked option trading. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

But there is a difference between conservative and TOO DAMN CONSERVATIVE. Which is the argument that many Ted Thompson critics are making.

But the last isn't my argument, though. Me, I think the more damning argument against Thompson is that he doesn't diversify enough against the big risks he does take. Putting as many of his personnel investment eggs as he does into the "draft and develop" basket means he isn't gaining the diversification insurance that comes from splitting that personnel investment into assets that are different in kind (and so less correlated with each other's return).

In the way he apportions his buying between draft and free agency/trades, he's a riverboat gambler. A different sort of gambler than Snyder, but a serious gambler nonetheless. Snyder is a high-stakes pot limit Omaha player in Las Vegas. Thompson is a medium stakes limit stud player somewhere in New England I don't want him hanging out in Vegas. But I do wish he'd spend a little more time than he does at the higher stake limit games at the Bellagio. With his bankroll, and his general high level poker abilities, he would actually reduce his overall risk by doing so.

I think if Ted actually put his full range of skills to work he would have all the people who currently rave about his excellentness still raving plus have a lot of us bitchers on his bandwagon as well. Because when it comes down to it, Thompson is going to outperform Daniel Snyder regardless. If I had $150 million to bankroll one GM/owner in poker, and Thompson agreed to vary his game more, I'd put him against anyone in the league except maybe Belichek.

John Elway has been outperforming Thompson in my opinion. But if Thompson agreed to diversify his approach among draft-and-develop, free agency, and trading more, everything else he brings to the table means he'd blow that arrogant b*stard from Stanford/Denver out of the water. Year after year.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
DoddPower
8 years ago

I thought that six+ million was AFTER the Daniels re-signing?

I understand the need to keep a fund for during-season/injury-replacement signings. Yet with all the injuries the Packers had, they still didn't use that much?

I think the point others are making is that this is not a one-time thing for Thompson. How many years have the Packers had "money left" despite having lots of injuries? How many years have they had *more* than $6-7 left?

Any financial manager worth his/her salary knows the importance of saving for contingent risks. But any financial manager worth that salary also knows that too much saving is also a bad thing. Any financial manager knows you also have to take risks, some of them substantial.

The real question is where do you draw the line. I don't think anyone has argued that Thompson should be taking the risk management approach that Dan Snyder does. That would be like your financial adviser telling you to put all your money into naked option trading. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

But there is a difference between conservative and TOO DAMN CONSERVATIVE. Which is the argument that many Ted Thompson critics are making.

But the last isn't my argument, though. Me, I think the more damning argument against Thompson is that he doesn't diversify enough against the big risks he does take. Putting as many of his personnel investment eggs as he does into the "draft and develop" basket means he isn't gaining the diversification insurance that comes from splitting that personnel investment into assets that are different in kind (and so less correlated with each other's return).

In the way he apportions his buying between draft and free agency/trades, he's a riverboat gambler. A different sort of gambler than Snyder, but a serious gambler nonetheless. Snyder is a high-stakes pot limit Omaha player in Las Vegas. Thompson is a medium stakes limit stud player somewhere in New England I don't want him hanging out in Vegas. But I do wish he'd spend a little more time than he does at the higher stake limit games at the Bellagio. With his bankroll, and his general high level poker abilities, he would actually reduce his overall risk by doing so.

I think if Ted actually put his full range of skills to work he would have all the people who currently rave about his excellentness still raving plus have a lot of us bitchers on his bandwagon as well. Because when it comes down to it, Thompson is going to outperform Daniel Snyder regardless. If I had $150 million to bankroll one GM/owner in poker, and Thompson agreed to vary his game more, I'd put him against anyone in the league except maybe Belichek.

John Elway has been outperforming Thompson in my opinion. But if Thompson agreed to diversify his approach among draft-and-develop, free agency, and trading more, everything else he brings to the table means he'd blow that arrogant b*stard from Stanford/Denver out of the water. Year after year.

Originally Posted by: Wade 



I largely agree. I have always thought and sometimes said that Ted Thompson is as big of a gambler the NFL has. He puts an INCREDIBLE amount of pressure on himself and others by mostly relying on the draft. The draft is very difficult for even the best talent evaluators. To almost solely rely on the draft is a HUGE gamble, it's just not as much of a financial gamble. I don't know how Ted Thompson does it. He's pretty darn good at it, but he needs to be better if that's going to be his main approach.

I've always thought he has the flexibility to realistically make a few more free agency moves. I do like signing free agents that have been cut so that the Packers don't lose compensatory draft picks, though. I think that's a very smart strategy, especially when one drafts well.
steveishere
8 years ago
The packers spent to within 1 or 2 million of the league salary cap this year I believe. That extra carry over money is not an extra 7m/ year to spend on some big signing. It can only be used during 1 season. It's been carried over from previous seasons. I don't know what they are planning to use it on but I don't really see any reason to complain as long as they are spending close to the league cap.
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