play2win
10 years ago
Let me get this straight.... I said "Packer People," once, and stevie gets his undies in a twist and ruins a perfectly good thread? And this gets another, separate "Packer People" thread started?

Wow. Awesome!

Happy Offseason motherfuckers!

Bigger point is we really need playmakers, and maybe we should be more willing to work with some talented players who have these qualities while also bringing along a downside or a little baggage.

Johnny Jolly. Great, yeah, he's got the baggage, but this happened to one of Ted's guys, on Ted's watch. Koren Robinson, actually, another Ted drafted player.

I want to know why we didn't go after a badass MF like Bernard Pollard at S back in the day. Hell, I want to know why the hell Holmgren wanted Wayne Simmons off the team after helping us win SB XXXI. And, Randy Moss could have been paired with Favre if Ted really truly tried harder.

For those too young to recall, I think the Packer People jag started after the Mossy Cade train wreck, and the James Lofton fiasco. Wolf adding Rison actually fell outside of this window, and his stay was very short.

I want Ted to sign some bad ass defenders. Plain and simple. We need some talent and attitude.
steveishere
10 years ago

Let me get this straight.... I said "Packer People," once, and stevie gets his undies in a twist and ruins a perfectly good thread? And this gets another, separate "Packer People" thread started?

Wow. Awesome!

Happy Offseason motherfuckers!

Bigger point is we really need playmakers, and maybe we should be more willing to work with some talented players who have these qualities while also bringing along a downside or a little baggage.

Johnny Jolly. Great, yeah, he's got the baggage, but this happened to one of Ted's guys, on Ted's watch. Koren Robinson, actually, another Ted drafted player.

I want to know why we didn't go after a badass MF like Bernard Pollard at S back in the day. Hell, I want to know why the hell Holmgren wanted Wayne Simmons off the team after helping us win SB XXXI. And, Randy Moss could have been paired with Favre if Ted really truly tried harder.

For those too young to recall, I think the Packer People jag started after the Mossy Cade train wreck, and the James Lofton fiasco. Wolf adding Rison actually fell outside of this window, and his stay was very short.

I want Ted to sign some bad ass defenders. Plain and simple. We need some talent and attitude.

Originally Posted by: play2win 



Ha! All I did was ask you to prove what you were claiming and you didn't seem to like that. I don't disagree that we need more playmakers but crying about the past doesn't accomplish anything. Everyone's a genius in hindsight. Would it have been cool to draft Richard Sherman instead of Davon House heck yeah but even Seattle didn't think much of Sherman in the draft or they wouldn't have waited until the 5th round to take him.

Talent is king and we need more talent, period. Guys like Navarro Bowman, Luke Kuechly, Lavonte David aren't necessarily "bad ass" but they are awesome. Not saying to disregard someone because they have a bad attitude or whatever but it's not that important regardless of how much it gets fans fired up.
play2win
10 years ago
It's alright steveishere. I did back it up with the corresponding info. My point was really that I wonder if the pendulum has swung too far the other way, precluding us from landing some top talents.

Also, know that I'm not in favor of adding a bunch of criminals just to win. It is indeed a slippery slope. Ted has added a lot of good people to our roster, but we are definitely lacking some good players, at many positions.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
10 years ago

What is your problem?

A half hearted attempt by Ted Thompson, to me, does not automatically translate to "trying." I guess it does to you.

Originally Posted by: play2win 



Agree with this.

Thompson has had two major free agent acquisitions in his tenure as GM. Both were in 2006. That means he has had nine (about to be 10, I expect) years in which he has not made a single major free agent acquisition.

I'm not bothered by the fact that Ted missed on Lynch or that he missed on Moss or that he missed on any individual free agent acquisition. I'm not bothered by the fact that he missed one person who was a Packer person or that he missed one person because he wasn't a Packer person.

What I'm bothered by is that he has made just two free agent acquisitions that I would count as major in his entire tenure as GM, and none since 2006.

Nor is "he was in cap hell" enough of an explanation. Other teams (and not just the Snyders and Jones) have been at least as tight against the cap and found a way. And, again, it's been 9 years.

Draft and develop isn't enough. Just re-signing your own players (before or after they become free agents) isn't enough.

Not unless you are the best drafter in NFL history by a standard deviation or so.

IMO.

If he's only been able to get two substantial free agents since 2005, then either isn't trying or he isn't trying enough.

IMO.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
DakotaT
10 years ago
I don't think free agent's want to come and play in Green Bay. How many of you would take a vacation to Bismarck? Enough said!
UserPostedImage
texaspackerbacker
10 years ago
It ain't about Green Bay climate or the Green Bay social scene or whatever. It's about MONEY #1 and WINNING #2. The huge majority of the time, the team offering the best deal financially gets the player. About the only exception would be somebody turning down a bigger offer from a chronic losing team.

In most of the examples mentioned - Lynch, Moss, etc., I actually side with Thompson in not signing them. Paying big money for a RB with a few years on him is almost never a good idea, and Moss looked like a long shot to be worthwhile to get based on his general attitude. A lot of players who fall short of being "Packer people" still might be worth the risk. Moss IMO was not.

Just the same, Thompson should have seen obvious weaknesses on the Packer team and done more to fix them - like getting a quality cover Safety this year.
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play2win
10 years ago
Thompson should have gotten a quality cover Safety LAST YEAR! Or, maybe made a trade for one when Collins went down in 2011.

We saw the reliance on one player, Aaron Rodgers, and how that adversely affected our team this past season. It was a window to our real and true strength -or lack thereof- as a football team. I was floored by how badly we fared without him on many levels, even though I agree, any team losing their starting QB, and former NFL MVP, would suffer greatly.

I found this interesting in how a similar situation in Denver with Peyton Manning might be translating directly to our own current woes, and our standing in today's NFL:

A MATTER OF STYLE. Doesn’t it seem that the philosophical approach to football ultimately made the difference? Denver is led by Manning. He is THE unquestioned leader of the team. He is the boss and the players are the employees. It was that way in Indy as well. How he goes, so goes his team. It was obvious the psychological effect the game had on Peyton. He was shell-shocked in his post-game interview, stammering for words, his confidence shattered. In contrast, Seattle is an 11-man team effort with interchangeable parts. Anyone can step up on any given game day. It showed once again on Sunday that football is a team sport.

—Michael, Los Angeles

http://mmqb.si.com/2014/02/04/russell-wilson-seattle-seahawks-super-bowl-xlviii/2/ 

Great observation, very similar to what our Packers team is facing currently with Rodgers.

Point is, at this stage we are WAY more like the DEN team who got their asses handed to them than we are the SEA who gave them the beat down. We have SO MANY HOLES on our team to address, especially on defense. Currently, we are in dire need of upgrades at FS, SS, OLB, ILB, NT, DE and possibly TE and WR, maybe even CB if we can't get the Shields deal done.

I was pretty happy to see Mike Daniels comments the other day about assuming more of a leadership role. We need more of that. Take some of the emphasis off of Rodgers being the end all for this team, and get some super talents all across the board to make a real, winning "team." It is time to add at least one premiere talent at any of those positions on D, and work to fill out the rest of our roster with upgrades, as opposed to sticking with some of our own who haven't been getting the job done. It would be nice to see the team leadership expand to other areas of our Packers team other than QB.

Leadership has been a problem in GB. When your trusted veteran CB, Tramon Williams, comes out publicly to state this after the season's end, maybe it is time to start listening. Add some quality, proven vets Ted. I found it really odd that we were in some games after Rodgers went down, except for our defense tanking. How the hell does Rodgers going down correlate to such a swift downfall in our defense? Well, pretty much the same way Peyton being flustered in the SB against SEA brought their entire team down. Too heavy a reliance on one player.

Figuring Ted likes to stick solely to the draft, I would be hard pressed to see us returning to another SB and winning for at least a few years, knowing many important players we've added in the last few drafts are slipping in their development (Burnett, Perry, House, Hayward, Worthy to name a few), and it will take time for new draftees to develop enough to make the significant contributions we have been lacking, needing to truly compete.

Zero2Cool
10 years ago

Thompson should have gotten a quality cover Safety LAST YEAR! Or, maybe made a trade for one when Collins went down in 2011.

Originally Posted by: play2win 



I know right! I mean, WTF, why didn't he go to "Safeties 'R Us" and fix that because quality safeties are a dime a dozen, ya know!!
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play2win
10 years ago

I know right! I mean, WTF, why didn't he go to "Safeties 'R Us" and fix that because quality safeties are a dime a dozen, ya know!!

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



That's funny. But, the reality was Collins was a Pro Bowl Safety. Morgan Burnett was seeing his first real action after sitting out most of the 2010 with a knee injury. That left Charlie Peprah. Our depth chart at Safety literally listed Burnett, Collins and Peprah.

So, laugh all you want about there being some kind of shopping center for Pro Bowl Safeties, but losing a player as important to the team as Collins, in September (trade deadline that year was Oct 18th, 2011)… Ted had enough time to try to work a deal or sign another player, especially knowing we are primed to make another SB run. Without a player like Collins, we were significantly less primed, with just two safeties remaining on the roster, Peprah and Burnett.

Moving Woodson to Safety, coming off a broken collar bone, and removing him from his CB slot where he gained DPOY honors didn't make a ton of sense to me, but it certainly was a cheap way out.

That was some "bump in the road…"

Collins waved to the crowd while being wheeled off the field.

"He's on pace to potentially have a Hall of Fame career here," McCarthy said. "Hopefully, this is just a bump in the road. We're going to miss him."

Peprah says he's taking the same approach as he did stepping in for Burnett last year.

"They're expecting me to go in and have no drop-off," Peprah said. "I'm going to go in and do the best I can, and hopefully that will be more than enough to get back to where we were last year."

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6993319/nick-collins-green-bay-packers-season-neck-injury

3 years later, we are still jolted by that bump in the road.
steveishere
10 years ago
Considering Woodson had fallen off as a CB and is now currently still playing safety I'd say it made plenty of sense. It's not like we were lacking at the slot CB in 2012 with Hayward.
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Zero2Cool (6h) : 49ers might be down their QB, DL, TE and LT?
packerfanoutwest (20h) : Jaire Alexander says he has a torn PCL
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : Even with the context it's ... what?
Mucky Tundra (20-Nov) : Matt LaFleur without context: “I don’t wanna pat you on the butt and you poop in my hand.”
beast (20-Nov) : We brought in a former Packers OL coach to help evaluate OL as a scout
beast (20-Nov) : Jets have been pretty good at picking DL
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He landed good players thanks to high draft slot. He isn't good.
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He can shove his knowledge up his ass. He knows nothing.
beast (20-Nov) : More knowledge, just like bring in the Jets head coach
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : What? Why? Huh?
beast (19-Nov) : I wonder if the Packers might to try to bring Douglas in through Milt Hendrickson/Ravens connections
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : The Jets fired Joe Douglas, per sources
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Jets are a mess......
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Pretty sure Jets fired their scouting staff and just pluck former Packers.
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Jets sign Anders Carlson to their 53.
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : When you cycle the weeks, the total over remains for season. But you get your W/L for that selected week. Confusing.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the totals are accurate..nrvrtmind
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : I don't follow what you are saying. The totals are not the same as last week.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : ok so then wht are the totals the same as last week?
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : NFL Pick'em is auto updated when NFL Scores tab is clicked
Martha Careful (19-Nov) : The offense was OK. Let's not forget the Bear defense is very very good.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Who updates the leaderboard on NFLPickem?
beast (19-Nov) : Has the Packers offense been worse since the former Jets coach joined the Packers?
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Offense gets his ass in gear, this could be good.
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Backup QB helped with three wins. Special Teams contributed to three wins.
bboystyle (18-Nov) : Lions played outside thats why. They scored 16 and 17 in the only 2 outside games this year
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : The rest of the NFL is catching up to Packers ... kicking is an issue throughout league
packerfanoutwest (18-Nov) : Packers DL Kenny Clark: We knew 'we were going to block' Bears' game-winning field goal attempt
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : Lions seem to be throttling everyone, but only (only) got 24 lol maybe the rain is why
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : Packers vs Lions game doesn't seem so bad.
beast (18-Nov) : Dennis Green "They are what we thought they were, and we let them off the hook!"
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : comment of the day Z2Cool "Bears better than we want to admit. Packers worse than we think. It's facts."
Mucky Tundra (17-Nov) : my worst case scenario: Bears fix their oline and get a coach like Johnson from the Lions and his scheme
Zero2Cool (17-Nov) : Bears get OL fixed amd we might have a problem
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : Pretty sure they already have scouting reports on guys who aren't even starting for their college team. The future is now for me.
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : I tend to let Gute and Co. Worry about the future.
beast (17-Nov) : That's great news and Packers need to keep upgrading their OL, DL and DBs this off-season, so missing one guy doesn't kill them
beast (17-Nov) : That's great news and Packers need to keep upgrading their OL, DL and DBs this off-season, so missing one guy doesn't kill them
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : Jaire and Evans Williams are both ACTIVE! Good news.
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : The badgers really need to change the whole offensive scheme. No draws no screens plus the quarterback is marginal
Cheesey (17-Nov) : If the Badgers had a decent QB, they would have won. The guy can't hit a wide open receiver
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : chop block
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : there was a very questionable job Block call that upon viewing replay was very borderline
beast (17-Nov) : How so? (I didn't watch)
Zero2Cool (17-Nov) : Badgers got hosed vs Oregon
packerfanoutwest (16-Nov) : damn,he hasn't played since week 2
Mucky Tundra (15-Nov) : poor guy can't catch a break
wpr (15-Nov) : wow. That three different things for the kid.
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