Zero2Cool
11 years ago

What I wish would happen is that those that benefitted from the play, or those who support their side of it, would admit that they got away with it. I have done so with the Majkowski pass that beat the Bears in '89.

Originally Posted by: OlHoss1884 



That wasn't an illegal play.


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OlHoss1884
11 years ago

That wasn't an illegal play.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



It was because a) he was entirely over the line of scrimmage b) the ball was over the line of scrimmage and c) he had stepped over the line of scrimmage. Under all interpretations of the rule, he got away with it. To add fuel to the fire, the replay rules did not have the time limit on them that they do today, but the rule was still clear evidence that the call should be reversed (it was ruled illegal on the field) and it took 8 minutes to decide to reverse it. As much as I would glad to win the game and see Mike Ditka turn purple over it, there is little doubt to unbiased observers that the Packers won on a bad call in that game.

As always, the best way to avoid losing on a bad call is not to be in a position to lose on a bad call, but it doesn't mean that the call wasn't terrible or didn't have a monumental impact on the outcome. In the case of the Fail Mary, the call was blown, the officiating of the ruling on the field was blown, the replay review was blown, and the league even admitted they missed a clear OPI call on Tate.


"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits" --Albert Einstein
Zero2Cool
11 years ago

It was because a) he was entirely over the line of scrimmage b) the ball was over the line of scrimmage and c) he had stepped over the line of scrimmage. Under all interpretations of the rule, he got away with it. To add fuel to the fire, the replay rules did not have the time limit on them that they do today, but the rule was still clear evidence that the call should be reversed (it was ruled illegal on the field) and it took 8 minutes to decide to reverse it. As much as I would glad to win the game and see Mike Ditka turn purple over it, there is little doubt to unbiased observers that the Packers won on a bad call in that game.

Originally Posted by: OlHoss1884 



Wow, that is weird. I watched that game and the replay many years later and he didn't touch grass beyond the line of scrimmage, thus making the play legit. I will have to find that footage and check again.
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SINCITYCHEEZE
11 years ago
I got time for that. Let me help Zero out on this one. Here's the video.





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OlHoss1884
11 years ago
Sorry guys, in the video, the narrator says he's "clearly behind the line of scrimmage at the 15" but if you freeze it, his feet, his body and the ball are all past it. On top of which, the ruling on the field was that it was an illegal pass, and there is NO WAY that is clearly something that should be overturned. The only thing that can even marginally justify the amount of time it took to make the reversal is that they were debating how the rule defined what constituted being over the line, but again, if it is that close, it shouldn't have been overturned, and by any of the possible definitions, he was past the 15.

Now how is THAT for beating a dead horse?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits" --Albert Einstein
Zero2Cool
11 years ago

Sorry guys, in the video, the narrator says he's "clearly behind the line of scrimmage at the 15" but if you freeze it, his feet, his body and the ball are all past it. On top of which, the ruling on the field was that it was an illegal pass, and there is NO WAY that is clearly something that should be overturned. The only thing that can even marginally justify the amount of time it took to make the reversal is that they were debating how the rule defined what constituted being over the line, but again, if it is that close, it shouldn't have been overturned, and by any of the possible definitions, he was past the 15.

Now how is THAT for beating a dead horse?

Originally Posted by: OlHoss1884 



The ball and body can be past the line of scrimmage, providing the thrower releases the ball prior to landing beyond the line of scrimmage. Did that happen? I'm asking seriously. I'm at work and can't really be analyzing video here lol


Edit, Hmm ... I need to re-read this apparently.

http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/11_Rule8_ForwardPass_BackPass_Fumble.pdf 
The offensive team may make one forward pass from behind the line during each down. If the ball, whether in player possession or loose, crosses the line of scrimmage, a forward pass is not permissible, regardless of whether the ball returns behind the line of scrimmage before the pass is thrown.

Item 1: Illegal Passes. Any other forward pass by either team is illegal and is a foul by the passing team, including:

(a) A forward pass thrown when the passer is beyond the line of scrimmage.
Note: It is a forward pass from beyond the line of scrimmage if the passer’s entire body and the ball are beyond the line of scrimmage when the ball is released, whether the passer is airborne or touching the ground. The penalty for a forward pass thrown from beyond the line is enforced from the spot where the ball is released.

(b) A second forward pass thrown from behind the line of scrimmage.

(c) A forward pass thrown after the ball has crossed the line of scrimmage and has returned behind it.

(d) A forward pass thrown after there has been a change of possession.


Edit2, an article on Majik and Instant Replay game
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/57784427.html 
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SINCITYCHEEZE
11 years ago

Sorry guys, in the video, the narrator says he's "clearly behind the line of scrimmage at the 15" but if you freeze it, his feet, his body and the ball are all past it. On top of which, the ruling on the field was that it was an illegal pass, and there is NO WAY that is clearly something that should be overturned. The only thing that can even marginally justify the amount of time it took to make the reversal is that they were debating how the rule defined what constituted being over the line, but again, if it is that close, it shouldn't have been overturned, and by any of the possible definitions, he was past the 15.

Now how is THAT for beating a dead horse?

Originally Posted by: OlHoss1884 



Seeing how the line of scrimmage was the 14 yd line, I'd say he had at least a 1/2 yard cushion. Legal play. Ref's got it right on the review.


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texaspackerbacker
11 years ago

Seeing how the line of scrimmage was the 14 yd line, I'd say he had at least a 1/2 yard cushion. Legal play. Ref's got it right on the review.

Originally Posted by: SINCITYCHEEZE 



Yeah, you beat me to it. The official with the 4th down marker is (or should be) at the line of scrimmage - the 14, not the 15, which makes it clearly legal.

BTW, I thought THE Instant Reply game was 20 some years earlier when Jerry Kramer bulldozed the Dallas line and Bart sneaked into the frozen end zone.


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OlHoss1884
11 years ago
We can disagree on where the line was...but on a review looking at that film it is inconclusive, and therefore shouldn't have been overturned. I called it the 15 because that's what the newsguy called it in that clip, but obviously he's not necessarily right either. Thanks btw to whomever moved these posts to their own thread...they belonged here.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits" --Albert Einstein
Mucky Tundra
11 years ago



Edit2, an article on Majik and Instant Replay game
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/57784427.html 

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



"Mike Singletary walked up to me and whispered, 'Sorry, kid. Too bad it won't count,' " Majkowski said.



😆

Yeah, you beat me to it. The official with the 4th down marker is (or should be) at the line of scrimmage - the 14, not the 15, which makes it clearly legal.

BTW, I thought THE Instant Reply game was 20 some years earlier when Jerry Kramer bulldozed the Dallas line and Bart sneaked into the frozen end zone.

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker 



I've never heard the Ice Bowl called that. I do know after game Kramer said "Thank God for instant replay" since the replays of the sneak made him famous and he named his book after it.

I think it would be a shame if this picture didn't make its way into this thread.

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