DakotaT
12 years ago

Pickett  has another year on his contract unless I missed something in the last couple days.

High cap number.. but still signed. Are you stating he should be reworked at a lower number?

Originally Posted by: Pack93z 



I thought Pickett was up this year.
UserPostedImage
QCHuskerFan
12 years ago

While I am not proposing a swith to 4-3. Matthews would not be wasted as a 4-3 LBer. He could make an outstanding MLB in a 4-3. He would be like Urlacher. His pass rush ability would allow him to keep blockers off him in run support, he has the coverage skills and his speed would work good covering sideline to sideline.

Originally Posted by: PackFanWithTwins 



He wouldn't be wasted, but not outstanding. Less utilized in his area of excellence.

It would be like Detroit moving Calvin Johnson to safety. Yes, he might be productive there. But why would you do that?
BAD EMAIL because the address couldn ot be found, or is unable to receive mail.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
12 years ago

He wouldn't be wasted, but not outstanding. Less utilized in his area of excellence.

It would be like Detroit moving Calvin Johnson to safety. Yes, he might be productive there. But why would you do that?

Originally Posted by: QCHuskerFan 



Because you're the Lions?

[grin1]


And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
doddpower
12 years ago

He wouldn't be wasted, but not outstanding. Less utilized in his area of excellence.

It would be like Detroit moving Calvin Johnson to safety. Yes, he might be productive there. But why would you do that?

Originally Posted by: QCHuskerFan 



LOL, it's not even close to being that extreme of a change. CM3 would still be rushing the passer on passing downs exactly as he has been doing since he entered the league, and likely still playing defensive end on some variations of base packages, as well. He would just be utilized in different roles in a creative 4-3 hybrid scheme; sometimes a MLB, sometimes an OLB for a play or two, etc. Make no mistake about it, he would still be the teams best pass rusher, and no defense coordinator worthy of the title would not allow him to rush the passer most of the time.

I agree with the overall premise though that CM3 is ultimately likely best suited for a 3-4 OLB, but I don't think there would be that big of a difference in a 4-3 with the right coach. It's still a completely different scenario than moving Kampman to OLB. Clay already drops into coverage and spies often as it is, and he can rush the QB and play in space at an elite level. Not to mention, it can be argued that almost every other defensive player is either better suited for a hybrid 4-3 style of defense or, at the very least, as suited as they are for a 3-4. The net effect of that could easily be better defensive play around the board.

It doesn't matter though, as this discussion is just an interesting thought experiment. The Packers are sticking with a 3-4 under Dom Capers. I'm fine with that, but I think giving Ray Horton a shot at defensive coordinator would be a "risk" well worth taking.
Zero2Cool
12 years ago

He wouldn't be wasted, but not outstanding. Less utilized in his area of excellence.

It would be like Detroit moving Calvin Johnson to safety. Yes, he might be productive there. But why would you do that?

Originally Posted by: QCHuskerFan 



What? How the heck do you compare moving a WR to S equally as moving a 3 - 4 OLB to a 4 - 3 DE? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Those are vastly different sets of skills between the two, one striking difference is the requirement to go from breaking tackles to actually making tackles.




Why couldn't Clay Matthews play OLB in a 4 - 3? Why would he have to be switched to a DE? My high level understanding would be he'd benefit from having another guy on the DL which would allow him to unleash on the QB.
UserPostedImage
QCHuskerFan
12 years ago

What? How the heck do you compare moving a WR to S equally as moving a 3 - 4 OLB to a 4 - 3 DE? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Those are vastly different sets of skills between the two, one striking difference is the requirement to go from breaking tackles to actually making tackles.




Why couldn't Clay Matthews play OLB in a 4 - 3? Why would he have to be switched to a DE? My high level understanding would be he'd benefit from having another guy on the DL which would allow him to unleash on the QB.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



The point is that every team we face would be elated if we made Matthews into a 4-3 LB. Because it would limit his pass rushing. Much like making Johnson a safety would excite every team because it would be taking him away from catching touchdowns.

Let's try again. Does Minny make a habit of splitting AP out wide? No. Why? Well, if he is split out wide, it removes the threat of him running the ball. If the defense doesn't have to defend the run with AP, is their life better? Yes. So by continually splitting him out wide, Minny would help the other team. Lining CM3 up as an outside backer in a 4-3 would be removing him from the role he performs best. Yes, I know he can still blitz. But he would not be rushing the QB as much as he does in a 3-4. It's not possible.

Let's look at the 4-3 for a second. A 4-3 is designed to pressure the QB with the DL. So don't tell me he can still rush the QB a lot, because the defense is designed to not need that. When you blitz in a 4-3 you either rush 5 and depend on 6 to cover which is a risk, or you drop a 290lb lineman into coverage, again, not ideal.

Let's not even think about CM3 as a middle backer. That's just wrong.
BAD EMAIL because the address couldn ot be found, or is unable to receive mail.
Rockmolder
12 years ago
Didn't seem to stop Von Miller a whole lot in his first year with the Broncos.

You can use a LB in a pass rushing role very effectively in a 4-3, as well. It's not like he's always coming on the rush in the 3-4. Maybe the drop back percentage would be a bit higher, but not that crazy.

Don't know why we're having this discusson, though. If there's one thing that doesn't work, it's switching schemes every four years. Don't know why it'd be necessary to go to the 4-3, all of a sudden. Especially since everyone was jumping out of joy when we fired Sanders and went to the 3-4 with Capers.
doddpower
12 years ago

Didn't seem to stop Von Miller a whole lot in his first year with the Broncos.

You can use a LB in a pass rushing role very effectively in a 4-3, as well. It's not like he's always coming on the rush in the 3-4. Maybe the drop back percentage would be a bit higher, but not that crazy.

Don't know why we're having this discusson, though. If there's one thing that doesn't work, it's switching schemes every four years. Don't know why it'd be necessary to go to the 4-3, all of a sudden. Especially since everyone was jumping out of joy when we fired Sanders and went to the 3-4 with Capers.

Originally Posted by: Rockmolder 



As I said earlier, it's just an interesting thought experiment, especially considering how many Packers defensive players currently on the roster seem to be much better suited for a 4-3.

Re: the previous discussion, CM3 would be rushing from a DE/OLB position on obvious passing downs, regardless of whether he was standing or had a hand in the dirt in a 3-4 or 4-3 scheme. The only difference would be is that he would play more of a "rover" role, almost like Charles Woodson has done in the past on 1st and 2nd downs in a 4-3, depending on the situation. And at times, I'm sure he would still line up as a DE in base packages, as well. I wouldn't view that as much of a problem at all, and very well could be a good thing. He already does similar things now, especially against mobile QBs when spying. I'm not sure why some think it would limit his pass rushing opportunities at all, at least with a good coordinator. But as has been said, it's nothing more than something interesting to talk about in a long season, because it's not happening. Hopefully several of these other more prototypical 4-3 can make a better transition to a 3-4 defense next season though. Or better yet, we get more appropriate 3-4 personnel, especially DL and LBs.

dhazer
12 years ago
All this talk about switching to a 4-3 and wasting CM3's talents is actually funny. You people do realize he was a DE in college right? Thats what he was drafted as and he had to learn the 3-4 scheme. I know we won't switch cuz we are in the same type of years we were in with Favre. You know the ones where we get to the playoffs but then get knocked out.
Just Imagine this for the next 6-9 years. What a ride it will be 🙂 (PS, Zero should charge for this)
UserPostedImage
Rockmolder
12 years ago

All this talk about switching to a 4-3 and wasting CM3's talents is actually funny. You people do realize he was a DE in college right? Thats what he was drafted as and he had to learn the 3-4 scheme. I know we won't switch cuz we are in the same type of years we were in with Favre. You know the ones where we get to the playoffs but then get knocked out.

Originally Posted by: dhazer 



He wasn't, actually. He played the elephant position at USC. Pretty much as stand-up hybrid DE/LB. Very similar what he plays here in Green Bay.
Fan Shout
Zero2Cool (9m) : Simmons put up an emoji with cheese.
beast (22m) : Not sure anyone is interested in Isaiah Simmons... Collin Oliver might of taken his potential slot
beast (30m) : I'm going with Jax Ulbrich is not telling the whole truth... he accidentally came across it? Why would a defensive coordinator have a QB #?
Zero2Cool (1h) : He's not that great, but final piece of the script.\
Zero2Cool (1h) : If we add Isaiah Simmons, book your Super Bowl tickets
Mucky Tundra (1h) : Colts 1st round TE Tyler Warren also got prank called, was that Jax Ulbrich as well?
Zero2Cool (1h) : Jax Ulbrich, Jeff Ulbrich’s son, released an apology for his role in the Shedeur Sanders prank call.
Martha Careful (1h) : apparently he did not participate in practice or play on the east west shrine game nor the NFL combine. The kid was a mediocre spoiled brat
Mucky Tundra (2h) : Yeah that one that was a super wounded duck that Sanders supporters are highlighting to prove a point
Zero2Cool (2h) : Shough is the guy who missed guys at combine isn't he?
beast (2h) : It's not official until I'm dead! I have a chance still! (Not really)
Mucky Tundra (11h) : I could feel my body decomposing in real time when I read that
Mucky Tundra (11h) : @MIKEYSAINRISTIL Tyler Shough will officially be the last person drafted to the NFL born in the 1900’s
Mucky Tundra (21h) : saw the tweet, he meant the city
Mucky Tundra (21h) : Was that for the team or the city?
Zero2Cool (22h) : Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter · 3m Draft grade is in: Green Bay gets an A. The people, the city, the venue were all superb. NFL Draft’s next
Zero2Cool (22h) : Matt LaFleur says Jaire Alexander is participating in #Packers offseason program, which has been conducted virtually during this first week
Zero2Cool (22h) : ✅ ...
buckeyepackfan (23h) : Check
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : Matthew Golden cahanged 81 to 22??
TheKanataThrilla (26-Apr) : Sam Howell to Vikings...guess no Aaron
Martha Careful (26-Apr) : 1 round 7 min, with one extra minute if there is a trade. 2nd round 4 minutes, 3rd -3, 2 thereafter IMO
Martha Careful (26-Apr) : Agree
dfosterf (26-Apr) : Great idea imo
dfosterf (26-Apr) : 1st round to 7 minutes with one extension
dfosterf (26-Apr) : NFL comissioner wants to shorten the 2st
Mucky Tundra (26-Apr) : @jalenreagors They’re discussing if Sheduer can go back to college on NFL Network LMFAOOOOO
beast (26-Apr) : Great point Martha
beast (26-Apr) : Buddy Ryan used to say if a candy bar goes missing, there are two to blame, Rex and Rob 🤪 jk 😁
Martha Careful (26-Apr) : Bum Phillips used to say there are two ways to get better. Get better players or get players to play better. We have a new DL coach
Zero2Cool (26-Apr) : Yes. Look at the losses last year. They can win.
beast (26-Apr) : Can Packers win with their current DL?
bboystyle (26-Apr) : waiting for a pass rusher.
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 5 minutes between picks in the 3rd
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 3rd. Hate this phone
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 4rd
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 5 minutes in the 4
dfosterf (25-Apr) : 7 minutes between picks in the 2nd round
Martha Careful (25-Apr) : Sorry to bitch, but the headline writers in that section absolutely mislead, or don't know how to read. It is maddening
Martha Careful (25-Apr) : No thanks. Not a dependable guy to be in the right place and run the right route. Dumb as a box of rocks.
Zero2Cool (25-Apr) : Losing 2nd round pick for a one year rental, not ideal. Especially a headcase.
TheKanataThrilla (25-Apr) : Pickens for Jaire may be interesting. Definitely not sure we want Pickens long term.
dfosterf (25-Apr) : No.Absolutely not
Zero2Cool (25-Apr) : NO NO NO NO NO NO!!1 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬
dhazer (25-Apr) : scenario: Our main prospects are off the board when our pick comes around, do we just throw a 2nd round pick at Pittsburgh for Pickens
TheKanataThrilla (25-Apr) : Hopefully she had some comfort that her son will be live his dream when she passed away. Sad news.
Mucky Tundra (25-Apr) : Damn that sucks
Zero2Cool (25-Apr) : News about Derrick Harmon mom, saddening.
Zero2Cool (25-Apr) : Mark Murphy: "I predict we will trade up once and down twice."
beast (25-Apr) : Rip the Packers and getting the fans yelling and booing him
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2024 Packers Schedule
Friday, Sep 6 @ 7:15 PM
Eagles
Sunday, Sep 15 @ 12:00 PM
COLTS
Sunday, Sep 22 @ 12:00 PM
Titans
Sunday, Sep 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Oct 6 @ 3:25 PM
Rams
Sunday, Oct 13 @ 12:00 PM
CARDINALS
Sunday, Oct 20 @ 12:00 PM
TEXANS
Sunday, Oct 27 @ 12:00 PM
Jaguars
Sunday, Nov 3 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 17 @ 12:00 PM
Bears
Sunday, Nov 24 @ 3:25 PM
49ERS
Thursday, Nov 28 @ 7:20 PM
DOLPHINS
Thursday, Dec 5 @ 7:15 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 15 @ 7:20 PM
Seahawks
Monday, Dec 23 @ 7:15 PM
SAINTS
Sunday, Dec 29 @ 3:25 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 5 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Recent Topics
4m / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

16m / Packers Draft Threads / Mucky Tundra

19m / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

1h / Around The NFL / bboystyle

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

2h / Packers Draft Threads / Mucky Tundra

3h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

9h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

19h / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

19h / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

19h / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

19h / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

19h / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

20h / Packers Draft Threads / wpr

22h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.