zombieslayer
13 years ago

Barnett missed a lot of games during his last three seasons as a Packer. He played in something like 29 out of a possible 48. I liked Barnett, but he was another grab an drag tackler who seemed to be getting fragile. I think Hawk was the better choice over Barnett.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Understood about the injury thing.

This is another case where hindsight's 20/20. Barnett ended up playing the full season for the Bills and had a better year than Hawk.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
PackerTraxx
13 years ago

Barnett missed a lot of games during his last three seasons as a Packer. He played in something like 29 out of a possible 48. I liked Barnett, but he was another grab an drag tackler who seemed to be getting fragile. I think Hawk was the better choice over Barnett.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



This is why I was never a big Barnett fan. He was great at making sure the back didn't gain 10 yards, but he seldom stopped them from gaining 5.
Why is Jerry Kramer not in the Hall of Fame?
buckeyepackfan
13 years ago

I'm too fricken tired to rattle your cage today Buckeye, so I'll let this one slide.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



😂 🤐 😂
I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!
nerdmann
13 years ago
Demovsky 

“Watching film I felt like I got stuck on blocks a little too much,” Hawk said Thursday after the team’s mandatory minicamp concluded. “When I was able to blitz, a lot of times I’m blitzing up the middle or going against a center or a guard, and I feel like I got Velcroed or stuck to them a little too much. So I’ve focused on working on my hands and getting off (blocks) and get to the ball more.”


“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Dexter_Sinister
13 years ago

This is why I was never a big Barnett fan. He was great at making sure the back didn't gain 10 yards, but he seldom stopped them from gaining 5.

Originally Posted by: PackerTraxx 



One of these days someone is going to have to prove that to me. I have seen that argument quite a few times, but nobody has anything concrete to back it up besides opinion. Since it tends to be people who already didn't like Barnett, I am thinking the eye test won't be unbiased.

I made some attempt to see how many yards down field Barnett made his tackles on running plays, I had nothing to compare it too, but it didn't look that bad. Certainly not 5 yards per carry. Barnett had the most tackles on the team but a wide margin most years, if he was consistently failing to make stops, the Packers yard per carry allowed would have been worse.

In the last 3 years Barnett was a starter the whole year, the Packers YPC allowed on D was 4.1 in '06, 3.9 in '07 and 3.6 in '09.

When he wasn't in for most of the year the D allowed 4.6 and 4.7 ypc in '08 and '10.

If Barnett was getting carried 5 yards, he was initiating contact over a yard before the line of scrimmage consistently.

Now I thought Barnett was a tool as much as anybody else. But if anybody knows me, they know I want to see the numbers. To me, the accusation that Barnett couldn't make a tackle and using the eye test as evidence makes me trust that measure of a player even less. And I don't trust it in the slightest already.

Basically I am saying, until you show me, I don't believe it.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
porky88
13 years ago

Even if Hawk manged to get knocked down to 2nd string there is no point in cutting him. You are still on the hook for almost all of his salary and he's a great teammate/locker room guy and would be a great back up as long as he didn't get too disgruntled about it. Either way the fact that they like DJ Smith that much is great news.

Originally Posted by: Stevetarded 


Players know how much their teammates make. I can't imagine Desmond Bishop appreciating that Hawk (a second stringer) makes more than him, especially if he leads the team in tackles. There are so many variables that goes into the 53-man roster. In Hawk's case, I think you cut your losses if Smith beats him for the starting job. Maybe you try to trade him before cut down day. I can't justify hanging onto him at his salary unless he's a starter.
zombieslayer
13 years ago

One of these days someone is going to have to prove that to me. I have seen that argument quite a few times, but nobody has anything concrete to back it up besides opinion. Since it tends to be people who already didn't like Barnett, I am thinking the eye test won't be unbiased.

I made some attempt to see how many yards down field Barnett made his tackles on running plays, I had nothing to compare it too, but it didn't look that bad. Certainly not 5 yards per carry. Barnett had the most tackles on the team but a wide margin most years, if he was consistently failing to make stops, the Packers yard per carry allowed would have been worse.

In the last 3 years Barnett was a starter the whole year, the Packers YPC allowed on D was 4.1 in '06, 3.9 in '07 and 3.6 in '09.

When he wasn't in for most of the year the D allowed 4.6 and 4.7 ypc in '08 and '10.

If Barnett was getting carried 5 yards, he was initiating contact over a yard before the line of scrimmage consistently.

Now I thought Barnett was a tool as much as anybody else. But if anybody knows me, they know I want to see the numbers. To me, the accusation that Barnett couldn't make a tackle and using the eye test as evidence makes me trust that measure of a player even less. And I don't trust it in the slightest already.

Basically I am saying, until you show me, I don't believe it.

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister 



Yes. People let their personal biases get in the way of facts. Like the Favre fiasco, people took sides and there wasn't much of an honest appraisal on Favre's abilities. They were either exaggerated good or exaggerated bad, depending on which side of the fence you took.

I know, bad example and my apologies for bringing him up. But he's immediately who comes to mind when biases get in the way of facts.

I showed Barnett's stats last year with Buffalo. They weren't too shabby and he's certainly missed here. I know he had personality issues. That's not what I'm discussing. I'm discussing his actual abilities.

I think the best criticism of Nick Barnett comes down to availability. 🇲🇲 talks about accountability and availability. Barnett's raw numbers spoke for themselves. However, he did miss a lot of games in the past few years and that was a valid argument for letting him go. His performance wasn't.
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
Zero2Cool
13 years ago

One of these days someone is going to have to prove that to me. I have seen that argument quite a few times, but nobody has anything concrete to back it up besides opinion. Since it tends to be people who already didn't like Barnett, I am thinking the eye test won't be unbiased.

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister 



I said it, I like Nick Barnett and have since the day he was drafted. Remember when he was at someones house and fell into a metal fence giving him a black eye before he even donned a Packers uniform?

It's also convenient to say you want that proven to you because so many websites have the stat "point of contact" and "point of tackle" so you can measure it up against others, lol.

I'm probably guilty of holding to high of a standard on middle/inside linebackers. The games I've seen Ray Lewis play, he seems to always knock the guy backward or they are tackled quick. Nick Barnett it seems he's out of position, not shedding blocks and gets guys from behind while they have momentum going forward and they drag him a bit. I want linebackers to make the contact, not react to it.
UserPostedImage
Zero2Cool
13 years ago

I think the best criticism of Nick Barnett comes down to availability. 🇲🇲 talks about accountability and availability. Barnett's raw numbers spoke for themselves. However, he did miss a lot of games in the past few years and that was a valid argument for letting him go. His performance wasn't.

Originally Posted by: zombieslayer 



lol, just realized this thread is about Smith and Hawk haha oops. Anyhow, I think Barnett led the Packers in tackles most of his years as a Packer.

Edit, stats + curiosity = my weakness. Barnett led the team every year he played except three times, two of which he was injured.
UserPostedImage
DakotaT
13 years ago

lol, just realized this thread is about Smith and Hawk haha oops. Anyhow, I think Barnett led the Packers in tackles most of his years as a Packer.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Well he should have, he was the fricken MLB in a 4-3. The thing that always bugged me about Barnett besides the samurai dance, was that anybody he tackled never went backward. Just never any thump to him. Hawk has the same problem.


UserPostedImage
Fan Shout
dfosterf (18-Aug) : We do have good depth at running back imo. Still so frustrating. Bitching about it is a futile excercise, which I plan to do anyway.
Mucky Tundra (17-Aug) : Whoops, I thought Zero was saying it was a surprise the Brewers lost and not Lloyd being hurt
Mucky Tundra (17-Aug) : Not a surprise; inevitable
Zero2Cool (17-Aug) : Brewers streak ends at 14
Zero2Cool (17-Aug) : SURPRISE
Mucky Tundra (17-Aug) : @mattschneidman Matt LaFleur on MarShawn Lloyd: “He’s gonna miss some time.”
Mucky Tundra (16-Aug) : CLIFFORD WITH THE TD WITH UNDER 2 TO GO!!!!!
Zero2Cool (16-Aug) : 90 MINUTES UNTIL FAKE KICKOFF!!
Martha Careful (16-Aug) : I think Ruven is a bot, but regardless should be stricken from the site.
Zero2Cool (14-Aug) : Packers RB Josh Jacobs ranked No. 33 in NFL 'Top 100'
dfosterf (13-Aug) : The LVN Musgrave collision- Andy Herman said Musgrave seemed to be the one most impacted injury-wise
dfosterf (13-Aug) : a lower back injury
dfosterf (13-Aug) : Doubs says he's "fine" after injury scare. Some reported it as z
Mucky Tundra (13-Aug) : With LVN that is; need to see what happens in the next practice
Mucky Tundra (13-Aug) : beast, reading about what happened, it sounded like one of those "two guys collide and are moving slow afterwards" type of deals
beast (12-Aug) : I believe Musgrave has been injured every single season since at least a Sophomore in highschool
packerfanoutwest (12-Aug) : Matt LaFleur: “Highly unlikely” Jordan Love plays more this preseason
dfosterf (12-Aug) : Doubs, Savion Williams, LVN, Musgrave all banged up to one degree or another, missing one here I forget
Zero2Cool (12-Aug) : RB Tyrion Davis-Price is signing with the Green Bay Packers.
Zero2Cool (12-Aug) : zero help, dominated. preseason
beast (12-Aug) : QB Jordan Love has surgery
beast (12-Aug) : Martha said Morgan had a lot of help, I didn't watch the OL so I can't say.
Zero2Cool (10-Aug) : Packers LT Jordan Morgan did not allow a single pressure across 23 pass-blocking snaps vs. Jets last night, per PFF
Mucky Tundra (10-Aug) : With buckeye and the reasonable couple, we're currently sitting at 10
buckeyepackfan (10-Aug) : Just posted to re-up on our FFL.
Zero2Cool (10-Aug) : If healthy after, then thats all I care. Well, no drops would be nice
wpr (10-Aug) : I made it through the 1st Q.
dfosterf (10-Aug) : Just gotta figure out how.
dfosterf (10-Aug) : Could have been a worse start, so there is that.
beast (10-Aug) : Yeah, someone tell the Packers football season has started, seems like they weren't ready for it
Mucky Tundra (10-Aug) : Sooooooo many penalties
Mucky Tundra (10-Aug) : It may only be preseason, but this game is a trip to the dentist
Zero2Cool (10-Aug) : Packers do bad -- FREAK OUT!!!!!!
Zero2Cool (10-Aug) : Packers do good -- eh only preseason
dfosterf (10-Aug) : Well that half was fun
Zero2Cool (10-Aug) : Great, zayne is down
Zero2Cool (9-Aug) : 13 minutes away from kickkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkoffff
Zero2Cool (9-Aug) : Had Celebration of Life for my uncle up north. wicked rain hope it dont come south
Mucky Tundra (9-Aug) : THE GREEN BAY PACKERS ARE PLAYING FOOTBALL TONIGHT!!!!!! THIS IS NOT A DRILL!!!!
Zero2Cool (9-Aug) : Woo-hoo
TheKanataThrilla (9-Aug) : NFL Network is broadcasting the game tonight, but not in Canada. Not sure why as no local television is showing the game.
beast (8-Aug) : But the Return from IR designations had to be applied by the 53 man cutdown.
beast (8-Aug) : It's a new rule, so it's not clear, but my understanding was that they could be IR'd at any time
Mucky Tundra (8-Aug) : *had to be IRed at 53
Mucky Tundra (8-Aug) : beast, I thought the designate return from IR players had to be IR at cutdowns to 53, not before
beast (8-Aug) : It's a brand new rule, either last season or this season, prior, all pre-season IRs were done for the season
beast (8-Aug) : But the Packers would have to use one for their return from IR spots on him, when they cut down to 53.
beast (8-Aug) : I think the NFL recently changed the IR rules, so maybe the season might not be over for OL Glover.
Zero2Cool (8-Aug) : Packers star Howton, first NFLPA prez, dies at 95 😔
dfosterf (8-Aug) : Apparently it is too complicated for several to follow your simple instructions, but I digress
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
8h / Green Bay Packers Talk / bboystyle

16h / Fantasy Sports Talk / dfosterf

19-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

18-Aug / Around The NFL / isaiah

18-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

17-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

17-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

16-Aug / Feedback, Suggestions and Issues / beast

15-Aug / Around The NFL / Mucky Tundra

13-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

12-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

12-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

12-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

12-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

12-Aug / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.