Pulled this out of another thread.. and thought it had enough merit to stand on its own...

Without throwing out the so and so sucks statements, in an honest opinion.. what needs to happen with the Packers in your opinion to improve.

Given.. less injuries.. beyond that or go deeper into it..




Agreed to a point.. but I look at the defense and I question that.. heck even the offense for that matter..

We have vets at every level of the defense.. Barnett, Kampman, Pickett, Chillar, Harris, Woodson, Collins is past that point and honestly is playing well except for the occasional "throw a shoulder at them" tackle instead of wrapping them up.

With the amount of ball that most of these 3rd and some of the 2nd year players have played.. they should be farther along than some of them are.. that speaks of position coaching and development.

Key areas of concern to me are Linebackers and offensive line.. we seem to have a hard time developing mentally and fundamentally sound players in those areas.

I think the offensive line speaks for itself.. player after player has been run through there and we have very little growth to show for it.. system or position coaches need to be re-evaluated and changes are in order.

People might be a little surprised about my claim at linebacker.. but I don't see the growth there.. our talent isn't maturing in that area..

Has Hawk taken the step to become that of a #5 pick and the beast he was in college? Not yet.. solid player.. but arguably not much more advanced than he was as a rookie.

Barnett, about the same type of player he was when Mike McCarthy and Moss took over... fringe pro bowler most seasons.

Poppinga... same player that has the talent to play in this league but is plagued with the same mental mistakes and hasn't picked up much to improve his sub par coverage skills.

Bishop and Hodge came to this team with noticeable talent.. but flashed that raw ability on the field early.. neither have matured to date.. albeit Hodge had injury after injury.. but still..

People talk about Moss as a developing coach.. I don't see it..

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I don't expect many of you to agree with me, but I honestly think this team can win as currently constructed.

Sure, it would be nice to improve on the O-line a bit and to get another pass rusher on the D-line, but every team has weak areas.

Even with those two problems + all the injuries, this team has been in every single game outside of New Orleans. Missed FG against Minnesota. Chance to drive down field for a game winning FG or TD against Carolina, Atlanta, Tennessee, and Tampa. If 3 of those 5 games go our way, we're 8-4 and considered a Super Bowl contender.

I know Coach's pressers are boring and frustrating, but I think in large part, he's right. There are minor things that need to be corrected to help us win games. I also think some of it is just bad luck. Miami lost a ton of games by small margins last year. It was reasonable to expect they'd pull some of those out this year and they have.

Some of it's on Aaron. As great as he's been this year, he has yet to drive us down field int he final minutes. Hey, he's young and he'll learn it.

I'm not saying we shouldn't focus on the lines in the draft or that we shouldn't bring in a free agent or two, but we don't need a Julius Peppers type. I actually think Bert Berry would be a good low cost guy to bring in to help out on passing downs.

Ten of or Twelve games have been against teams with winning records. We're not getting beat by average teams. We're losing by close margins to some of the leagues best teams. To me, that's not the mark of a bad football team; it's the mark of a team that's a small step or two from joining the class of elite NFL teams.

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*edited.. way to flame the thread.. start that thread in the Back Alley.. Thanks.*

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Agreed for the most part.. but most of those small problems are ones that shouldn't be.

Mental lapses, lack of attention to fundamentals and blown assignments are tell tale signs of deeper issues.

I do believe we have the talent to win... I look at say the Giants roster and they don't have far and away that much more overall talent than we have.. but they do something we don't.. tracing back into last year.

They don't beat themselves.. they don't make the same mistakes over and over and over again.

I hope we don't blow this thing up.. but I certainly hope that we address the areas that have shown themselves to be concerns.. we might not get them totally addressed but growth and notable improvement would be a good sign...

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I think we're on the same page here. The problems seem to be in coaching/lack of discipline. All of that can be corrected with the current team. The talent we need to win is in place.

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That's just stupid. If you want to debate Ted's strengths and weaknesses that's fine. But over-the-top flaming like that is meaningless.

pack93Z, I'm right there with you about the linebackers. I, too, fail to understand the love for Winston Moss. We've got two first-round draft picks out there and we still can't blitz, stop the run or cover a tight end.

I think our defensieve (you know... originally that misspelling was a typo. But I like it - kind of appropriate) staff needs an overhaul in the offseason. New blood, too. Promoting from within hasn't been the answer for three years running.

I'd offer Rod Marinelli the DC gig the day after he gets the axe in Detroit.

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Excellent point. +1

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I think a new defensive coordinator, a new special teams coach and an offensive coordinator that actually coordinates the offense would be a good start.
McCarthy calling the plays isn't getting it done, he is too conservative and unimaginative (SEE RUNNING INTO THE TEETH OF THEIR DEFENSE AND GETTING STUFFED AT THE 1 ).
A big time pass rusher via freeagency.

I also wonder about Winston Moss since the linebacking corps remains very pedestrian

I'm not opposed to a new Defensive Coordinator, but I'd say the offense is just fine. Only the Giants, Jets, Saints, and Cardinals have scored more points than we have. Even if you adjust for the defensive touchdowns, we're still a top ten offense, regardless of whether or not you disagree with a few particular play calls.

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I think we need to find another DT to rotate into the mix..

Cole has moments but not much more than that..

Jolly has legal issues to worry about..

Pickett has played under this performance of 07'

Harrell is still an unknown.. can he stay healthy and can he make plays?

Jenkins will help, but make a call, if you are going to use him in the interior rotation, then you better have better depth than Monty and Hunter.. keep tabs on the development of Thompson.. if you have questions about whether he is the guy that will take a step next season.. add another proven veteran to help protect the team in case of a crippling injury.

At Linebacker.. personally I would move Barnett outside, I would see if Bishop is the "guy" in the middle and I would either shift Poppinga to a pass rush specialist and start Hawk/Chillar, MLB, Barnett..

If Hawk isn't still nicked up and that is the reason he looks so stiff out there... it might be time to dangle him out there and see if you can find value.. is a liability in coverage other than just a flat zone right now, but maybe he is hurt beyond what is known. At this point he is a two down backer... making to much coin for those two downs.

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