Silentio
13 years ago

blah blah

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



You still didn't answer my question. Is the Arizona game an example of letting a team hang around or not?
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evad04
13 years ago

sdfhasdlfja ;slkdfj ;lkdjf l;aksjdf fuzzy logic sldkfj saldfkj ;lsdfj laskfj over generalizations laskfj alkfjasld;fkjaskl;j

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 


UserPostedImage
William Henderson didn't have to run people over. His preferred method was levitation.
"I'm a reasonable man, get off my case."
tromadz
13 years ago

Here's the bottom line. If you wanna sit there and cheer for your team to play mediocre football and consistently play down to the level of clearly inferior teams, go ahead and do that. Is that what Lombardi preached? Is that what Mike McCarthy preaches?

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 



Pretty sure they didn't preach anything about cheering for your team. What the shit is wrong with your brain?
Dexter_Sinister
13 years ago

Here's the bottom line. If you wanna sit there and cheer for your team to play mediocre football and consistently play down to the level of clearly inferior teams, go ahead and do that. Is that what Lombardi preached? Is that what Mike McCarthy preaches?
This is the same argument people have about the Grant v Starks debate. Starks is clearly the superior player, but people like Grant, because they identify with him. Most people are themselves not spectacularly talented or well endowed with god given skills. So they tend to hold that against the winners, the people who are better than them. They tend to identify with the underdog. That's cool. Especially if your team is an underdog. But guess what. The Packers are the world champions. We are the Goliath right now. I'm not gonna sit here and root for us to act like the underdogs, just because most of the fans are themselves mediocre in real life. That doesn't satisfy me emotionally. But then I myself am not mediocre in real life.
This is the same with all the Favre worshippers. Yeah, he always melted down in the playoffs. But people still worshipped him, even though Aaron Rodgers was clearly the better QB. Why? Because they identified with him for emotional reasons. They hated Arodge, because he knows how to shower regularly. They called him gay. Ted Thompson too. Why? Because Ted and Aaron are not dumb, scuzzy, uneducated white trash. Plain and simple. They don't care how good of a player he is. They care about how similar he is to themselves, as a person.

Originally Posted by: nerdmann 


Like your bitching will make the team change? Like our happy go lucky, generally pleasant demeanor will cause the team to fall into mediocrity?

Here is a thought, bitch at the people who can change something. Instead of taking it out on people who can do nothing about it if you did magically convince them you are right. Which you aren't.

Grant is producive even when there isn't a hole, Starks can go out and find them if one develops. Different and both contribute. That is why we want to keep both. I don't have a clue why you only want one of them. Except maybe secretly hoping for mediocrity but afraid to come out of the closet. (Not that there is anything wrong with that.)

Thinking we can't change the team isn't mediocrity. It is called being rational. Thinking the world revolves around you and thinking you are better than everyone else is called narcissism.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
gbguy20
13 years ago
i tried to start an mvp chant in gameday chat today and was booted

its G tho.

maybe later in the year it will be more appropriate.
BAD EMAIL because the address couldn ot be found, or is unable to receive mail.
Silentio
13 years ago

Grant is productive even when there isn't a hole, Starks can go out and find them if one develops. Different and both contribute. That is why we want to keep both.

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister 



At the risk of diverting nerdmann’s fleeting attention away from the pressing question of how the loss to AZ is an example of letting teams hang around -- this is a great point about Grant and Starks. One thing you don’t see from Grant is dancing around before he makes a cut. Starks has been doing entirely too much of this the last two games. When Starks finds a hole he is obviously more explosive than Grant, but his eagerness to bust off a big play is also a drawback (Favre, anyone?). Grant is less of a playmaker (not to say he doesn’t have great plays) than he is a decision maker, sometimes to his downfall. That said, a Ryan Grant decision usually nets at least one positive yard. Thus far Starks has been either very exciting to watch, or worth a negative yard or two.

Starks is very fun to watch in the passing game though, eh?
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Nonstopdrivel
13 years ago
UserPostedImage

Sometimes you just have to resurrect a classic.
UserPostedImage
Silentio
13 years ago

UserPostedImage

Sometimes you just have to resurrect a classic.

Originally Posted by: Nonstopdrivel 



Yes, but I’m right.
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evad04
13 years ago

One thing you don’t see from Grant is dancing around before he makes a cut. Starks has been doing entirely too much of this the last two games. When Starks finds a hole he is obviously more explosive than Grant, but his eagerness to bust off a big play is also a drawback (Favre, anyone?). Grant is less of a playmaker (not to say he doesn’t have great plays) than he is a decision maker, sometimes to his downfall. That said, a Ryan Grant decision usually nets at least one positive yard. Thus far Starks has been either very exciting to watch, or worth a negative yard or two.

Originally Posted by: Silentio 



The 16-yard run by Starks early was a thing of beauty. That's the type of play where you just go, "Wow" (or some other variation thereof, including but not limited to: f*ck yea!) edit: realizing more context is helpful. Starks ran over three dudes at the end of the run and still didn't go down.

When he commits to a run lane, or even just busts outside, you can see what he's capable of. When there isn't an obvious hole, he can be a bit tentative and dance ala B-Jack style. In the last few games this has resulted in some less than desirable gains (err, losses?).

Grant has been accused of running into his blockers a lot. I won't deny that I've seen it happen, but I think it may be more because Grant mostly picks an angle and goes forward. Starks may be better at getting something out of nothing, but Grant has great vision (unlike the charges by, well, you know) that he has bad vision. And Grant isn't tentative in a way has him dancing behind the line of scrimmage.

Again, it can't be said enough that having them both is to our benefit.
William Henderson didn't have to run people over. His preferred method was levitation.
"I'm a reasonable man, get off my case."
Dexter_Sinister
13 years ago

At the risk of diverting nerdmann’s fleeting attention away from the pressing question of how the loss to AZ is an example of letting teams hang around -- this is a great point about Grant and Starks. One thing you don’t see from Grant is dancing around before he makes a cut. Starks has been doing entirely too much of this the last two games. When Starks finds a hole he is obviously more explosive than Grant, but his eagerness to bust off a big play is also a drawback (Favre, anyone?). Grant is less of a playmaker (not to say he doesn’t have great plays) than he is a decision maker, sometimes to his downfall. That said, a Ryan Grant decision usually nets at least one positive yard. Thus far Starks has been either very exciting to watch, or worth a negative yard or two.

Starks is very fun to watch in the passing game though, eh?

Originally Posted by: Silentio 



I very much enjoy watching both.

To me the difference is between agility and power. If you run with your feet under you with heavy body lean, it is difficult to cut. If you run with a wide stance on your toes, you are balanced and can stick a foot in the ground and take off anywhere.

For Grant, if the hole is where it is supposed to be, he hits it hard and fast. He will make 8 yards and blow the crap out of a poor safety who gets in his way, like in Chicago. If the hole isn't there, Grant is under power and lean and can't change direction easily. But he can push the line 3-4 yards when there isn't a hole. He doesn't get a ton of huge runs, but he makes yards most of the time. Even when there isn't any to be had.

Starks is all balance and agility. He can cut anywhere then get up on his toes and sprint fast. He can explode in any direction. Sometimes you have to take what you can get. Starks doesn't do that.

Starks is explosive and scary. I like having that in the backfield sometimes.

Most of the time I would settle for a guaranteed 4 yards though.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
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