Finley88Beast
14 years ago

I didn't like the 3 shitty run strategy employed by Mike on that drive, but thanks to Rex, it ended up working out.

"musccy" wrote:



To be honest it wasn't too bad because it risks stoping the clock throwing against a good defense.Plus wouldn't rex calling a timeouts take into fact here for calling runs idk.But he was being smarter than aggressive and throwing against that good of defense is risky that late in the game and they could of had an easier time getting to the endzone.

Hell i would of called three run plays to..

All in all the plays called there wasn't "shitty".

We were facing what one of the best run defenses.If we got a first down running you would be saying it is a shitty strategy.
A Quote from my brother Mike(Bears Fan)
"Fucking Greg Jennings"
After he makes a catch
musccy
14 years ago
I completely understand the McCarthy's intent, especially in a defensive struggle, I also understand that it worked to perfection.

With that said, as Redsox pointed out, under any scenario, the Jets would have had adequate time, possibly with timeouts, to construct a successful final drive. With 4+ min left, I would rather have seen the packers try to get a 1st down or two.
zombieslayer
14 years ago


Wasn't there some book written on clock management or something and how coaches suck at it? I can't remember the title but I'd be interested about reading the stats in there about the whole calling timeouts too early.

"RedSoxExcel" wrote:



Yes. You can order it here:
http://www.johntreed.com/FCM.html 

John T Reed is a highly successful real estate investor who exposes frauds. He also is a football coach who has consulted NFL coaches. He knows his stuff.

UserPostedImage
My man Donald Driver
UserPostedImage
(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷
Greg C.
14 years ago

Green Bay Packers at 04:12
1-10-GB 35 (4:12) 30-J.Kuhn left guard to GB 37 for 2 yards (52-D.Harris, 91-S.Pouha).

Timeout #1 by NYJ at 04:08.
2-8-GB 37 (4:08) 32-B.Jackson right end to GB 35 for -2 yards (22-B.Pool, 57-B.Scott).

Timeout #2 by NYJ at 04:03.
3-10-GB 35 (4:03) 32-B.Jackson right end to GB 36 for 1 yard (97-C.Pace).

Timeout #3 by NYJ at 03:59.
4-9-GB 36 (3:57) 8-T.Masthay punts 41 yards to NYJ 23, Center-61-B.Goode, out of bounds.

New York Jets at 03:50

So lets say 4:12 - 3:32. 3:32 - 2:58. Then call a timeout. You'd have the ball back with lets say 2:50 with 2 timeouts. Then lets say you run 3 pass plays and miss (7 seconds each), you could punt it with 2:29 or whatever and have 2 timeouts and the 2 minute warning, still only being down by 6.

And that assumes that the Packers still run on 3rd down (as I would guess that the Packers may choose to just throw on 3rd down as the Jets were not burning timeouts).

I just don't see the upside between having the ball with 2:50 with 2 timeouts versus having the ball with 3:50 with no timeouts. By using all your timeouts at 4:00, you are conceding that this will be your last drive either way. So why not just save the timeouts and see what happens.

Also lets say its 3rd and 8 with 2:58 left and you then use your first timeout. Then lets say the Packers convert. Then you still have a chance to 2:58-2:54 (2nd timeout), 2:54-2:50 (3rd timeout), 2:50-2:10, then get the ball back. The saving timeout strategy also would have given your team leeway if the Packers convert (which didn't happen here but still).

Also I thought horrible 3rd down call on the 2nd last drive. Why go for hte endzone, why not run a screen or even a run to make a shorter 4th down situation as you are in 4th down territory. I was confused by Rex Ryan.

"RedSoxExcel" wrote:



Much thanks for the breakdown. I see where you are coming from, and maybe that would've been a better strategy, but I just don't think it would've made much difference, if any. Also, you are putting your thumb on the scales by failing to account for four or five seconds of runoff for each play. Plus, when you go from 3:32 to 2:58 that is a 34-second play clock rather than 40 (though 39 is more realistic, with the ball being snapped one second before the play clock expires).

So using your strategy, it would really look more like this:

Packers with the ball at 4:12, first down, run play to 4:08 and clock keeps running. Snap the ball at around 3:29 on second down. Next play runs the clock down to 3:24, then the clock goes down to 2:45 before the third down snap. This play takes four more seconds, to 2:41, then the Jets call timeout. If the punt play takes nine seconds, as it did in the game, the Jets get the ball back with 2:32 on the clock instead of 2:50.

Now, if they happen to run three nice, quick incompletions right off the bat, followed by a punt, they may turn the ball over to the Packers before the two minute warning, so they can use that clock stoppage plus the two timeouts to get the ball back with around 1:50 remaining. Then your strategy works. But if there is a sack or a tackle in bounds, or even one or two incompletions where the QB has to run around and chew up a lot of time, the Packers will get the ball back after the two minute warning. Then they will run an extra 39 seconds off the clock (because the Jets have only two timeouts), plus three plays that total around 13 seconds, and with another nine-second punt play, you're looking at the Jets getting the ball back with AT BEST something like 49 seconds left with no time outs, needing to score a TD. Most likely the best they're going to get out of that is a Hail Mary pass into the end zone.

So in this scenario, which is quite likely, you get your second possession, but it is a very poor scoring opportunity, especially for an offense that has done almost nothing all day long.

I think Rex's idea was to get one possession with plenty of time. This would allow them to run more plays to try getting the TD. If he had the Colts offense with Peyton Manning, maybe he would've employed your strategy.

My head hurts now.
blank
gbguy20
14 years ago
Certain coaches don't have any idea how to manage the clock just like certain coaches don't have a clue when they should and shouldn't go for 2 (chilly)
BAD EMAIL because the address couldn ot be found, or is unable to receive mail.
Zero2Cool
14 years ago
I think Mike said he ran the ball hoping to force the Jets to burn their timeouts. If we had passed and it fell incomplete (which many balls did thanks to wind, weather and bad mechanics :P) the clock would have stopped without them burning a time out.
UserPostedImage
Since69
14 years ago

I didn't like the 3 shitty run strategy employed by Mike on that drive, but thanks to Rex, it ended up working out.

"musccy" wrote:



Hivemind. +1
UserPostedImage
Since69
14 years ago

I think Mike said he ran the ball hoping to force the Jets to burn their timeouts. If we had passed and it fell incomplete (which many balls did thanks to wind, weather and bad mechanics :P) the clock would have stopped without them burning a time out.

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



That's good hindsight and/or damage control on Mike's part, but even I knew that running 3 times would lead to a sure 3-and-out, which certainly was not what we needed...
UserPostedImage
RedSoxExcel
14 years ago
Greg, I agree, I did a quick calculation and you are right about the new timing taht should be taken into account.

But I still don't like it. Because let's say the other team gets a first down after you burn your first time out, then your really screwed. If you save your first timeout, its 3:29 in your timing, with all three timeouts remaining.

I just don't see hte benefit of calling the timeout at 4:08. I would think its better to have 3:24 and three timeouts than 4:08 with two timeouts. Then lets say you stop them again, sure call a timeout. Then 3:20 with two timeouts and 3rd down. The Packers may throw then because you still have timeouts and then you may get the ball back with 3:10 with two timeouts.

I guess its one of those agree to disagree but I just don't see the upside with calling a timeout at 4:08, I am a big fan of keeping your timeouts until you absolutely need them. I'd always rather have 2 or 3 timeouts with 2:10 or 2:30 or whatever left, than have no timeouts with 4:00 minutes left.
blank
Greg C.
14 years ago

I think Mike said he ran the ball hoping to force the Jets to burn their timeouts. If we had passed and it fell incomplete (which many balls did thanks to wind, weather and bad mechanics :P) the clock would have stopped without them burning a time out.

"Since69" wrote:



That's good hindsight and/or damage control on Mike's part, but even I knew that running 3 times would lead to a sure 3-and-out, which certainly was not what we needed...

"Zero2Cool" wrote:



In a defensive struggle it is best to be conservative when playing with a lead. Basically the Packers won because they got three turnovers and the Jets got zero. The handoffs were the best way of insuring that it stayed that way. I wasn't crazy about it, but it was justified, and it worked.
blank
Fan Shout
dfosterf (3-Jul) : Make sure to send my props to him! A plus move!
Zero2Cool (3-Jul) : My cousin, yes.
dfosterf (3-Jul) : That was your brother the GB press gazette referenced with the red cross draft props thing, yes?
Zero2Cool (2-Jul) : Packers gonna unveil new throwback helmet in few weeks.
Mucky Tundra (2-Jul) : I know it's Kleiman but this stuff writes itself
Mucky Tundra (2-Jul) : "Make sure she signs the NDA before asking for a Happy Ending!"
Mucky Tundra (2-Jul) : @NFL_DovKleiman Powerful: Deshaun Watson is taking Shedeur Sanders 'under his wing' as a mentor to the Browns QBs
Zero2Cool (30-Jun) : Dolphins get (back) Minkah Fitzpatrick in trade
Zero2Cool (30-Jun) : Steelers land Jalen Ramsey via Trade
dfosterf (26-Jun) : I think it would be great to have someone like Tom Grossi or Andy Herman on the Board of Directors so he/they could inform us
dfosterf (26-Jun) : Fair enough, WPR. Thing is, I have been a long time advocate to at least have some inkling of the dynamics within the board.
wpr (26-Jun) : 1st world owners/stockholders problems dfosterf.
Martha Careful (25-Jun) : I would have otherwise admirably served
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Also, no more provision for a write-in candidate, so Martha is off the table at least for this year
dfosterf (25-Jun) : You do have to interpret the boring fine print, but all stockholders all see he is on the ballot
dfosterf (25-Jun) : It also says he is subject to another ballot in 2028. I recall nothing of this nature with Murphy
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Ed Policy is on my ballot subject to me penciling him in as a no.
dfosterf (25-Jun) : I thought it used to be we voted for the whatever they called the 45, and then they voted for the seven, and then they voted for Mark Murphy
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Because I was too lazy to change my address, I haven't voted fot years until this year
dfosterf (25-Jun) : of the folks that run this team. I do not recall Mark Murphy being subject to our vote.
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Ed Policy yay or nay is on the pre-approved ballot that we always approve because we are uninformed and lazy, along with all the rest
dfosterf (25-Jun) : Weird question. Very esoteric. For stockholders. Also lengthy. Sorry. Offseason.
Zero2Cool (25-Jun) : Maybe wicked wind chill made it worse?
Mucky Tundra (25-Jun) : And then he signs with Cleveland in the offseason
Mucky Tundra (25-Jun) : @SharpFootball WR Diontae Johnson just admitted he refused to enter a game in 41° weather last year in Baltimore because he felt “ice cold”
Zero2Cool (24-Jun) : Yawn. Rodgers says he is "pretty sure" this be final season.
Zero2Cool (23-Jun) : PFT claims Packers are having extension talks with Zach Tom, Quay Walker.
Mucky Tundra (20-Jun) : GB-Minnesota 2004 Wild Card game popped up on my YouTube page....UGH
beast (20-Jun) : Hmm 🤔 re-signing Walker before Tom? Sounds highly questionable to me.
Mucky Tundra (19-Jun) : One person on Twitter=cannon law
Zero2Cool (19-Jun) : Well, to ONE person on Tweeter
Zero2Cool (19-Jun) : According to Tweeter
Zero2Cool (19-Jun) : Packers are working on extension for LT Walker they hope to have done before camp
dfosterf (18-Jun) : E4B landed at Andrews last night
dfosterf (18-Jun) : 101 in a 60
dfosterf (18-Jun) : FAFO
Zero2Cool (18-Jun) : one year $4m with incentives to make it up to $6m
dfosterf (18-Jun) : Or Lions
dfosterf (18-Jun) : Beats the hell out of a Vikings signing
Zero2Cool (18-Jun) : Baltimore Ravens now have signed former Packers CB Jaire Alexander.
dfosterf (14-Jun) : TWO magnificent strikes for touchdowns. Lose the pennstate semigeezer non nfl backup
dfosterf (14-Jun) : There was minicamp Thursday. My man Taylor Engersma threw
dfosterf (11-Jun) : There will be a mini camp practice Thursday.
Zero2Cool (11-Jun) : He's been sporting a ring for a while now. It's probably Madonna.
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : We only do the tea before whoopee, it relaxes me.
wpr (10-Jun) : That's awesome Martha.
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : How's the ayahuasca tea he makes, Martha?
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : Turns out he like older women
Martha Careful (10-Jun) : I wasn't supposed to say anything, but yes the word is out and we are happy 😂😂😂
Mucky Tundra (10-Jun) : I might be late on this but Aaron Rodgers is now married
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
4-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

2-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

2-Jul / Fantasy Sports Talk / dfosterf

1-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

29-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

25-Jun / Around The NFL / Martha Careful

23-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

20-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

20-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

20-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

18-Jun / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

16-Jun / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

15-Jun / Random Babble / Martha Careful

14-Jun / Around The NFL / beast

14-Jun / Community Welcome! / dfosterf

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.