millertime
15 years ago
I know this is inappropriate to post right before a game, but I think it is a very interesting topic that could bring about some great discussion. Basically, I wanted to compare GB's recent more conservative team building strategy with that of a more aggressive front office, like the New York Jets.

I will be comparing the Jets strategy with the Packers since 2005 when two new GMs Ted Thompson and Mike Tannenbaum hired two first year coaches to turn around their teams that each went 4--12: Mike McCarthy and Eric Mangini. Both teams have had there ups and downs since then, but let me compare some key moments that show the drastically different approaches taken by these two teams.

Well, Mike McCarthy and Eric Mangini became coaches in the same year. Rex Ryan is now in his first year. Mangini was been 23-25 with the Jets (2 winning seasons, 1 losing season). Ryan has been 3-2 so a total of 25-27, right below .500. In the same 3 year time span McCarthy has been 27-21, but with only one winning season. So I think it is safe to say, that there really hasn't been tht big of a difference in results.

We all know the Packers way of doing things: ie: developing young talent, resigning core guys, relying on the draft, refusing to overspend on veteran free agents etc...

The Jets are a little bit more aggressive. The frequently trade picks for players, sign notable free agents, trade sucessful players that don't fit their scheme, trade up in the draft etc. Some of these have paid off, some not so much. I'd like you guys to debate which strategy you think has worked the best.

Trading Picks for Players
2006
RB Thomas Jones and low 2nd round pick for a high 2nd round pick.
QB Pat Ramsey for 6th round pick

2008
- 3rd and a 5th for Kris Jenkins, a stud 4-3 DT with baggage and drama that they were hoping could make a smooth transition to NT. He did.
- We all know they traded a 4th rounder for Favre right before the season started. The jury may be out on that one, but I think it was the right move for them and was a great value.

2009
CB Lito Shephard for a 5th
WR Braylon Edwards for a 3rd and a 5th and some back ups

Trading successful players that don't fit your scheme
2006 - Trade John Abraham for 1st round pick
2007 - Trade Pete Kendell for 4th round pick
2008 - Trade Vilma for 3rd and 4th

Signing Veteran or High Risk Free Agents
2008 - Signed 3 stud free agents to big deals. All 3 start, and play well.
OG Alan Faneca
RT Damien Woody - former pro bowler who was struggling in Detroit
3-4 OLB Calvin Pace - their best pass rusher
CB Ty Law - provided stop gap for a year or two while young guys develop
TE Bubba Franks - bust
FB Tony Richardson

2009 - Signed two key 3-4 guys
ILB Bart Scott
SS Jim Leonhard

Reaching or Trading Up in Draft

2007
Darelle Revis (trade up)
David Harris (traded up with GB)

2008
Vernon Gholston 3-4 OLB (reach)
Dustin Keller TE (traded up with GB)

2009
Mark Sanchez QB (trade up)
Shonn Greene (trade up)


So looking at their depth chart, I'd say 9/11 starters on offense and 7/11 on defense were acquired by these more risky transactions.

I know this has turned into a long thread, but hopefully it will start some good discussion.
PackFanWithTwins
15 years ago
I don't think either is the right or wrong way to go. Ted's way, is a slower fix, but IMO in the long run puts a more consistent product on the field. And keeps them around.

NYJ way forces them to continue to trade and sign FA. Or go into a rebuild. Look at this last off season. the Jets were over the new cap before FA or the draft ever came about. They have to move players around to keep under the cap.

For coaching I would prefer to be in the Packers way. It gives the coach the ability to build a team. Last year, the Jets sold out on that year really with the signings. If they didn't make the playoffs with the talent that was brought in it was a failure. When working like that there is no room for failure, because of the cuts that will have to be made after the season is over.

What I am waiting to see come to light is the consistency of Ted's way. I believe it allows for less turnover. Get the team close and use FA to finish the team. That way the cost is less, allowing for lesser adjustments the following year. Which IMO will keep the team at the top longer because once it is going right, it doesn't take as long to recover from taking that shot.

Now Ted just needs to get us to that point.
The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
Fan Shout
beast (11m) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th
beast (12m) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly
Zero2Cool (22m) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.
bboystyle (34m) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed
Mucky Tundra (43m) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv
Zero2Cool (1h) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno
beast (1h) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?
packerfanoutwest (1h) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans
Zero2Cool (2h) : I see what you did there Mucky
Zero2Cool (2h) : dammit. 3:25pm
Zero2Cool (2h) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm
Mucky Tundra (2h) : Upon receiving the news about Luke Musgrave, I immediately fell to the ground
Mucky Tundra (2h) : Yeah baby!
Zero2Cool (2h) : LUKE MUSGRAVE PLAYING TONIGHT~!~~~~WOWHOAAOHAOAA yah
Zero2Cool (3h) : I wanna kill new QB's ... blitz the crap out of them.
beast (3h) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue
Zero2Cool (4h) : However, we seem to struggle vs new QB's
Zero2Cool (4h) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.
packerfanoutwest (4h) : ok I stand corrected
Zero2Cool (5h) : Ok, yes, you are right. I see that now how they get 7th
Zero2Cool (5h) : 5th - Packers win out, Vikings lose out. Maybe?
beast (5h) : Saying no to the 6th lock.
beast (5h) : No, with the Commanders beating the Eagles, Packers could have a good chance of 6th or 7th unless the win out
Zero2Cool (5h) : I think if Packers win, they are locked 6th with chance for 5th.
beast (5h) : But it doesn't matter, as the Packers win surely win one of their remaining games
beast (5h) : This is not complex, just someone doesn't want to believe reality
beast (5h) : We already have told you... if Packers lose all their games (they won't, but if they did), and Buccaneers and Falcons win all theirs
Zero2Cool (5h) : I posted it in that Packers and 1 seed thread
Zero2Cool (5h) : I literally just said it.
packerfanoutwest (5h) : show us a scenario where Pack don't get in? bet you can't
Zero2Cool (5h) : Falcons, Buccaneers would need to win final two games.
Zero2Cool (5h) : Yes, if they win one of three, they are lock. If they lose out, they can be eliminated.
packerfanoutwest (5h) : as I just said,,gtheyh are in no matter what
Zero2Cool (5h) : Packers should get in. I just hope it's not 7th seed. Feels dirty.
packerfanoutwest (5h) : If packers lose out, no matter what, they are in
packerfanoutwest (5h) : both teams can not male the playoffs....falcon hold the tie breaker
packerfanoutwest (5h) : if bucs win out they win their division
beast (5h) : Fine, Buccaneers and Falcons can get ahead of us
packerfanoutwest (5h) : falcons are already ahead of us
beast (5h) : Packers will get in
beast (5h) : If Packers lose the rest of their games and Falcons win the rest of theirs, they could pass us... but not gonna happen
packerfanoutwest (6h) : they still are in the playoffs
packerfanoutwest (6h) : If Packers lose the remaining games,,,,at 10-7
Zero2Cool (7h) : We can say it. We don't play.
Mucky Tundra (9h) : But to say they are in is looking past the Saints
Mucky Tundra (9h) : That said, their odds are very favorable with a >99% chance of making the playoffs entering this week's games
Mucky Tundra (9h) : Packers are not in and have not clinched a playoff spot.
buckeyepackfan (9h) : Packers are in, they need to keep winning to improve their seed#.
Mucky Tundra (18h) : Getting help would have been nice, but helping ourselves should always be the plan
beast (19h) : Too bad Seahawks couldn't beat Vikings
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