Announcement PH Beta → Check it out! Click Me! (you might be see "unsafe", but it is safe)
Mucky Tundra
a month ago
Earlier today when talking about the Saints and their salary cap, our resident board owner asked:

Zero2Cool (10h) : What does NFL do if they're over cap?



NFL Top-51 Rule: What happens if an NFL team goes over the salary cap? 

What are the punishments for breaching the NFL's salary cap?
The NFL's salary cap is established in the Collective Bargaining Agreement set between the league and NFLPA.

If a team goes over the salary cap, they are fined upwards of five million dollars for each violation of the cap. In more severe scenarios, draft picks can be confiscated entirely and player contracts can be voided.

Teams over the cap are also banned from signing any new players until they are back below the cap again.

This is why there is so much talk about salary caps in the NFL, because it really isn't worth it for a team to go over that limit



So what about the Saints? Well... 

This trade would clear a prorated portion of $1.21 million and the Saints would carry $13.4 million in dead money in 2024. Where this gets tricky for New Orleans is looking ahead to 2025. The team is currently projected to be $71,408,567 over the effective salary cap next year, per Over The Cap. If they trade Lattimore, they would lock in $31.66 million in dead money for 2025 because this is a post-June 1 trade. That means the dead money is split between the rest of this season and next season. (Dead money is cash already paid to a player that hasn’t been accounted for on the salary cap.)

The Saints already need to clear more than $71 million, and dead money is not something that can be cleared out once a player has been moved. If they trade Lattimore, they’re just further leveraging themselves against future years’ caps. They would in turn need to find more people to trade, cut, or otherwise renegotiate contracts to clear more cap space.

The Saints have long been part of a running joke about the salary cap not being entirely real given how much they have kicked the can on it. Theoretically they can keep kicking it, but we’re seeing the result of this strategy: they’re a mediocre to bad team that cannot afford to upgrade their roster because they’re too busy paying for the mediocrity that currently exists.

At some point, the Saints will have to hit the reset button and take the pain of rebuilding everything. It’s just a matter of when they’re willing to do it, and who gets to take the lumps during what will be some very lean years.



A cursory look at the Saints salary cap  at Over the Cap shows them at $61 million in the hole for next year (not sure about the discrepancy with the previous $71 million figure the Lattimore article states, esp since they also cite Over the Cap). Over the cap by $61/$71 million with 49 contracts on the books is...not good. It gets worse when you look and see that 3 players have void years for 2025. So the Saints need so shed 10s of millions of cap to get under and will also need to get up to 53 players on their roster, most likely through the draft . As it currently stands, the Saints have a good shot at landing the top pick in draft. Even with the cap friendly rookie contracts, the Saints are in a bit of bind.

But hey at least they're in the black for 2026 with $23.5 million with 40 contracts on the books, right? Wellll....a closer examination shows 14 void year contracts, so in reality the Saints have a long way to go filling out their roster. And those numbers are subject to change as the current 2026 cap show has none of the 2025 or 2026 draft picks on the their books.

But surely 2027 is a good year! $209.6 million in cap space with only $104.3 in current cap hits with 28 contracts on the roster! WELLLLLLL.....17 of those contracts are void contracts. Similar to the previous year, the future draft classes aren't factored in and like the year previous, the Saints will have a long way to go in filling out their roster.

The big question is will the Saints let some of their talent (Olave, Ruiz etc) walk to get their cap healthy or will they use the cap expansion in 2027 to continue kicking the can?
“Nah. I like having the island. It’s pretty cool...not too many visitors”
UserPostedImage
"I’ve got it." -Aaron Rodgers
beast
a month ago
Simply put, teams are not allowed to be over the cap. If they are over the cap then expect punishment coming from the NFL as the other 31 teams are pissed that you cheated and the team most likely will lose cap space to the other 31 teams, they and their owner will be fined, and they'll lose draft picks.

In other words, Saints will get under the cap, BUT with the position they have put themselves how many star players will they have to get rid of to get under the cap?

I'm thinking their QB Carr and QB/TE Hill could be gone, maybe even more players.
UserPostedImage
wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
a month ago
I didn't see it when I tried to look up which teams have been over the cap in the past but I think SF maybe New England have been over the cap and fined in the past.
UserPostedImage
beast
a month ago

I didn't see it when I tried to look up which teams have been over the cap in the past but I think SF maybe New England have been over the cap and fined in the past.

Originally Posted by: wpr 



I don't believe it's ever officially happened, as it's not simple not allowed, and all 31 other teams will come after you.

Teams MUST be under the salary cap... and teams gives a lot of options to kick the can down the road and borrow money from the next couple of years.

The only time I can remember a team failing to meet salary cap was the 90s Super Bowl Broncos... but here is the catch, they technically showed that they were under the cap, they just had side deals with Elway and I think the RB that they did not properly report, but where not caught until like a decade later.


UserPostedImage
Mucky Tundra
a month ago

In other words, Saints will get under the cap, BUT with the position they have put themselves how many star players will they have to get rid of to get under the cap?

I'm thinking their QB Carr and QB/TE Hill could be gone, maybe even more players.

Originally Posted by: beast 



With the Lattimore trade, the Saints dead cap hit is next year is $48 million but now have $52 million in free cap for 2026. Gonna have to punt a lot into 2026. 2027 might see a similar situation that GB had in 2023: over 50% of the cap tied up in void years and dead cap.

I wonder who the placeholder coach is going to be for the next three years.
“Nah. I like having the island. It’s pretty cool...not too many visitors”
UserPostedImage
"I’ve got it." -Aaron Rodgers
buckeyepackfan
a month ago
The Broncos signed (John Lynch)? Late in The 1997 season, it was discovered after the season the signing had put them over the cap, by then it was too late to do anything except fine them. Lynch solidified their defensive backfield and helped them beat The Packers in the SB.
Probably was worth the fine, whatever it was.
That was 27 years ago, I think the story is accurate .
Only time I remember it happening.
I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!
beast
a month ago

The Broncos signed (John Lynch)? Late in The 1997 season, it was discovered after the season the signing had put them over the cap, by then it was too late to do anything except fine them. Lynch solidified their defensive backfield and helped them beat The Packers in the SB.
Probably was worth the fine, whatever it was.
That was 27 years ago, I think the story is accurate .
Only time I remember it happening.

Originally Posted by: buckeyepackfan 


I believe they later found out that the Broncos deals with Elway and one other player (I want to say the star RB) also gave them some money that was off the books.

https://forums.denverbroncos.com/forum/broncos-football/talkin-smack/223817-denver-broncos-cheated-to-win-both-of-their-sbs 

In December 2001, the Broncos were fined $968,000 and lost a third-round pick in the 2002 draft for violations reportedly relating to $29 million in deferred payments to quarterback John Elway and running back Terrell Davis.

On Thursday, the league announced that the Broncos have been fined $950,000 and will lose a third-round selection in next year's draft for circumventing the salary cap between 1996 and '98


UserPostedImage
Mucky Tundra
a month ago
Saints not planning for rebuild despite coaching change, high salary cap charges 

From the outside, it all seems to add up: a looming head-coaching vacancy, a non-traditional salary cap, and plenty of older, accomplished players. Are the Saints headed for a rebuild?

Yet, that's not the plan at all.

New Orleans isn't planning for an overhaul. There will be changes, and likely an effort to get younger. But they aren't envisioning taking their franchise down to the studs, just like they didn't plan a fire sale prior to this past Tuesday's trade deadline. With a roster they believe is far better than their record, one besieged by unrelenting injuries, the Saints believe in pushing forward, rather than stepping back.



I guess the can will be kicked even further.
“Nah. I like having the island. It’s pretty cool...not too many visitors”
UserPostedImage
"I’ve got it." -Aaron Rodgers
beast
a month ago

I guess the can will be kicked even further.

Originally Posted by: Mucky Tundra 


That's all their GM does... and he's been GM since 2002 (not 2022, but 2002).

Seems like their GM is locked in for life, or until their ownership changes.

And I assume that's why Sean Peyton left.
UserPostedImage
Mucky Tundra
a month ago

That's all their GM does... and he's been GM since 2002 (not 2022, but 2002).

Seems like their GM is locked in for life, or until their ownership changes.

And I assume that's why Sean Peyton left.

Originally Posted by: beast 



When I was looking into their GM before I started this thread and saw he had been there since 2002, I had to do a double take. 2002? As in, "2002 with Aaron Brooks, Deuce McAllister and Joe Horn"? I struggle to see them attracting anyone worthwhile to the job now.
“Nah. I like having the island. It’s pretty cool...not too many visitors”
UserPostedImage
"I’ve got it." -Aaron Rodgers
Fan Shout
Zero2Cool (1h) : I'd say play everyone. Going into playoffs at 7th seed on two game lose streak - yucky
Zero2Cool (1h) : Do the Packers have any best players?
beast (1h) : Play or Rest*
beast (1h) : Should the Packers play or free their best players vs the Bears?
Zero2Cool (2h) : Packers should be 3 - 2 in the Division. Bonkers being swept by both Lions and Vikings. yikes
go.pack.go. (3h) : All crazy stuff…and good point beast
beast (3h) : Packers should be 0-5 in the division, can't say I saw that coming, even 1-4
Zero2Cool (3h) : Sam Darnold 35 TD's ... another one
Zero2Cool (3h) : Baker Mayfield, 39 TD's ... can't say I saw that one
Zero2Cool (4h) : No matter who is playing as 7th, I think we want them to win. Get rid of 2nd seed haha
go.pack.go. (4h) : That would be dhazer who was rooting for Minnesota
beast (12h) : Well, Commanders are currently the 6th seed and Packers the 7th
beast (12h) : Who was it in Chat, that wanted the Vikings to win (because Lions fans upset them) because Packers could not lose the 6th seed?
beast (15h) : If Falcons win, Packers stay as the 6th seed and Falcons lead the NFCS, if they lose, Commanders 6th and Bucs take NFCS lead
beast (15h) : Win or Loss, the NFCS is going down to week 18
Mucky Tundra (15h) : if the Falcons win, how does that affect the overall NFC playoff picture? Does it mean that the NFC South comes down to week 18?
beast (15h) : If Commanders win, the Packers drop to the 7th seed
beast (20h) : Taylor still at it!
beast (20h) : Colts get the ball and fumble turn over
packerfanoutwest (20h) : Jets pull Aaron Rodgers for Tyrod Taylor
Mucky Tundra (20h) : Colts-Giants now a tight one
beast (22h) : Still early, but Giants 14 to 3 over Colts
beast (22h) : With Broncos losing to the Bengals, Colts got to control their destiny for the 7th seed... looks like they're about to give it up
Mucky Tundra (22h) : I believe Pickett is starting for Philly
beast (22h) : Is the Eagles QB Hurts playing? I forgot to check
Zero2Cool (29-Dec) : Watson unlikely to play today.
Mucky Tundra (29-Dec) : Good job gpg!
go.pack.go. (29-Dec) : I figured out the signature thing. I had to find a different hosting website
Zero2Cool (28-Dec) : Packers elevated S Omar Brown.
go.pack.go. (28-Dec) : I tried the [img][/img] but that didn’t work
go.pack.go. (28-Dec) : How do I upload a picture to change my signature? I haven’t done it in years lol. I have the picture but can’t get it to work
Mucky Tundra (28-Dec) : Saturday NFL games=the season is about to get serious
Mucky Tundra (28-Dec) : Greg Gumbel passed away today after bout with cancer.
buckeyepackfan (27-Dec) : 1 NFC South @ NFC West @ AFC West other 3 games,
buckeyepackfan (27-Dec) : Packers play NFC East and AFC North in 2025, plus 2 other games
Mucky Tundra (27-Dec) : Geeze Zero get it right!😋
Zero2Cool (27-Dec) : I guess 3 games. Whatever
Zero2Cool (27-Dec) : Bleh, that only impacts two games.
Zero2Cool (27-Dec) : Packers are gonna get 3rd place division schedule next year.
Mucky Tundra (27-Dec) : Kanata, seek help! lol
beast (27-Dec) : I was rooting for the Bears to win and hurt their draft pick status
Zero2Cool (27-Dec) : Forgot there was even a game last night haha
TheKanataThrilla (27-Dec) : That was terrible.
TheKanataThrilla (27-Dec) : Watching that game in its entirety yesterday is proof positive that I am a football addict.
beast (27-Dec) : And horrible time management multiple times... and not being able to score more than 3 points on a team with talent
beast (27-Dec) : Realizing the Bears didn't fix it from the previous week and do the same thing, getting the game to overtime
beast (27-Dec) : They probably are not tanking, but they've absolutely mismanagement some things, such as Vikings seeing the Packers blocked FG and realizing
Zero2Cool (27-Dec) : Crazy of Bears to have that mindset that is
Zero2Cool (27-Dec) : Hail Mary stop away from 5 - 2. Not sure how that flips to tanking. Crazy mindset if true
beast (27-Dec) : I've quietly questioned if Bears are tanking on purpose... they suddenly got a lot worse with some simple concepts like 101 clock management
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2024 Packers Schedule
Friday, Sep 6 @ 7:15 PM
Eagles
Sunday, Sep 15 @ 12:00 PM
COLTS
Sunday, Sep 22 @ 12:00 PM
Titans
Sunday, Sep 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Oct 6 @ 3:25 PM
Rams
Sunday, Oct 13 @ 12:00 PM
CARDINALS
Sunday, Oct 20 @ 12:00 PM
TEXANS
Sunday, Oct 27 @ 12:00 PM
Jaguars
Sunday, Nov 3 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 17 @ 12:00 PM
Bears
Sunday, Nov 24 @ 3:25 PM
49ERS
Thursday, Nov 28 @ 7:20 PM
DOLPHINS
Thursday, Dec 5 @ 7:15 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 15 @ 7:20 PM
Seahawks
Monday, Dec 23 @ 7:15 PM
SAINTS
Sunday, Dec 29 @ 3:25 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 5 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Recent Topics
1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

2h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

2h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

4h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

29-Dec / Green Bay Packers Talk / go.pack.go.

27-Dec / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

27-Dec / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

27-Dec / Random Babble / Martha Careful

27-Dec / Around The NFL / Martha Careful

27-Dec / Random Babble / Mucky Tundra

27-Dec / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

25-Dec / Featured Content / Zero2Cool

25-Dec / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

25-Dec / GameDay Threads / bboystyle

24-Dec / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2024 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.